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If You Touch a Coin, It Is No Longer Mint State
Coinosaurus
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So I'm talking with a boy scout who recently earned his coin collecting merit badge. He shows me a modern quarter in a flip that is at least MS65 and tells me it is no longer "Mint State" because he touched it once by accident. I corrected him several times but he did not seem convinced. Where does this nonsense come from?
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I have no idea. It seems more common with proofs though, never heard it with MS coins.
Coin Photographer.
He likely has taken a statement or written information very literally (quite common among young people) and allowed no gray areas. I have often run into this, with coins and many other things, and it takes patience and usually a fairly extensive explanation of the terms and defining criteria. Cheers, RickO
Well, you can always polish the dickens out of any coin to return it to mint state...
A recent discussion on this topic here: https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/comment/13284646#Comment_13284646
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Proof is not a grade per se. It's a means of manufacture. Even a well worn Proof coin is still a Proof. Of course, after a certain level of wear, it may be impossible to tell that it was a Proof unless it was a Proof only issue such as the 1895 Morgan dollar in which case you'll see PR12 or PR04 coins.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
Just for consideration only, evidence is all important, if you are presented with a mint state coin with a fingerprint, would you consider it a mint state coin regardless of grade or holder?
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
i prefer to wear clean gloves when around proofs, the other ms should be handled as such jmo
Yes, of course. I was saying the OP statement of if you touch a proof it’s no longer a proof (which is clearly false) is more common because of this misunderstanding that seems common among new collectors of the manufacture of proofs.
Coin Photographer.
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i've given an ENORMOUS amount of thought to things i was/wasn't taught as a kid/teen and what stuck with me or wasn't taught/reinforced (reinforcement is vital) over the years (umm decades) and fwiw, it is best to not always focus on the immediate result, that is to say, that they get what you are trying to bestow to them right then and there, about anything really.
just keep teaching and pluggin', knowing some of it will stick, some will come back to them at a later time. the most important thing is to not underestimate how important what you teach may be to someone, even if they don't seem to understand/agree. really it goes with adults as well, sometimes we just need time (people) to absorb and process things. 7 billion people and i can tell you through BITTER experience, not everyone is processing stuff the same way. if you gave 1000 people 10 different goals, you may very well get 10 or more different paths to arrive at the same goals.
at the very least, hopefully it was enjoyable enough for you both/all to be discussing numismatics. it is refreshing to see/hear someone much younger talk about such things and how they perceive and process/use what they have been told/figured out!
If it's touched in the Mint, it's still Mint State.
If it's touched outside of the Mint, it's net graded PMD
We're talking metal objects, quite hard and resistant to adverse effects and handling. I takes a lot to take a coin from Unc. to AU and below.
People like me. In my spare time I enjoy giving boy scouts erroneous numismatic advice.
Don't worry... not in a weird way.
Cheers.
LOL. I knew there had to be a good reason. Thanks for clarifying.
Yeah, if he was eating Cheetos and touched the coin!
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I wouldn’t call it “nonsense”. I’d say it’s a matter of not understanding the difference between a coin that’s no longer (technically) uncirculated and one that can still grade “mint state” (insert numerical grade here).
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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whatever you do, don't send him or his troupe to @Coinscratch official coin roll hunting thread. the amount of coins that go into gem unc status holders and even some top-pops from circ bank rolls would probably be more than that poor little fellar could handle! heck, he may even turn IN his numis merit badge!
Don't know, but it's not new. Here's a page from my Jefferson nickel collection inventory list from when I was a kid. I had originally noted the coin grade as "UNC." and the source as "CIRCULATION". Some idiot adult tried to "help" me, and I changed the source to "BANK".
As long as he wears glove while handling AU or uncirculated coins before he eats a candy bar on a hot day, he should be okay.
USN & USAF retired 1971-1993
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Back in the 70’s participants in the ANA Summer Seminar Counterfeit Detection Course did a field trip to the Denver Mint where we got to walk the floor and look at machines that were actually running (some years; other years they were doing end of fiscal year settlement).
There were hoppers of blanks and struck coins that we could run our hands through. No free samples. The coins were still “Mint State” when we were through!
Graders at the grading services touch coins when they are grading them. Does this mean that no graded coins are mint state? I don't think so.
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
I know it sounds funny but that hits a bit close to home. When I was a kid I loved coins. The problem was that no-one in my family did so there was no supervision and it was not like today where there is a world of free information on the subject. I would pick the occasional buf nickle, merc dime or indian head out of change when I was lucky enough to find one but then in the mid 1970's the Rockaway Mall opened in my home town in NJ and there was a store in it called "The Coinery" in it. Every weekend when I received my allowance I would run there and buy the best coin I could afford that struck my fancy. Boy did I love thinking about all the hands that the coins had passed through and all the history they had seen!
The only problem was that while the guy working behind the counter was really nice he never said anything like "Hey kid. When you get home don't tear this coin out of the holder and clean it with a pencil eraser". Lol. Still worth it!
The kid is obviously on track to becoming a future grader! 😂 🤣
Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )