What do I have here? Anything worth grading?
Slapdoodle19
Posts: 12 ✭
Hello all, new here and new to forums in general. My step father is in search of someone who can let him know what he has, estimated values and if any should be sent for grading. I myself am in the comic industry and familiar with that sort of market than coins.
He recently went to an old safety deposit box and got some coins out that his father had held onto along with some of his own. He also purchased a few at local auctions soon after diving back into it all.
We have looked across various sites, various auctions to get a better estimate for certain coins. Its fair to say that our inexperience in the market made it difficult to crunch the wide gaps in numbers.
I took pictures of 5 of the coins he had on the top of his list.
Please let us know what you think.
Much appreciated!
Comments
Welcome to the forum!
Good news & bad news.
The good news is you came to the right place for help and to learn.
More good news, your 1921 appears from the photos that it is genuine.
but not worth grading
The bad news it looks like your 4 other coins are modern counterfeit/replica coins.
Agreed.
Sorry OP.
"It's like God, Family, Country, except Sticker, Plastic, Coin."
No genuine 1853-O Seated Liberty Dollars were produced.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Any chance the replicas are made out of 90% silver?
Less than about 1% chance in my opinion.
No. They look like the crap coming out of china these days.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
virtually none, but someone with an analyzer could confirm
Very disappointing.
Agree but I think there may be a chance the OP mixed up the order on the photos and the O belongs to the 1850.
Of course I always reserve the right to be wrong.
Ditto
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, evn when irrefutably accurate.
here is the PCGS population report for graded seated dollars (the counterfeits)
https://www.pcgs.com/pop/detail/liberty-seated-dollar-1836-1873/29?ccid=0&t=3&p=MS
as mentioned, there were no 1853-O minted.
I mention this as a way to gently break the bad news to the step father. We experience the "bearer of bad news" effects here. People don't like earing the word "counterfeit." At least now you have definitive proof.
As for the 1921 Morgan, it is extremely common in high grades and it was massively minted in the day. In fact in that condition, it would sell for less than a non-1921 Morgan would sell for.
I'd guess it'd retail to you in the low $30s, but when you go to sell, someone might offer you only in the high $20s.
here is the PCGS CoinFacts page on it with a bit of a write up towards the bottom.
https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/coin/1921-1-morgan/7296
Dang. Well, luckily these 4 were purchased recently instead of sitting up. We suspected it, even weighed it, and put a magnet to it. I guess that doesn't amount to much of a test.
Would love to know how yall are able to tell.
@Slapdoodle19 Typically you can tell by just looking and being familiar with what the genuine article looks like. Generally dates and details look off or without good detail. Most counterfeit coins you can tell that way but some are very very deceptive and take more specialized equipment.
Edit: always good to compare date and mint with known coins in a book like the Red Book. If it isn’t in there then it’s not genuine and you don’t have to look further.
Maybe these will bring better news.
well, below are links to PCGS' CoinFacts.
this is on the 1850-O
https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/coin/1850-o-1/6938
one easy way for each is to look how poorly executed the date's numerals are.
you can view to 1865:
https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/category/dollars/liberty-seated-dollar/type-3-no-motto/741
and 1866-1873
https://www.pcgs.com/coinfacts/category/dollars/liberty-seated-dollar-1836-1873/type-4-motto-1866-1873/742
Not much here value wise. The eisenhower dollar is circulated and worth $1. The 28-S peace is a better date but little if any premium in that condition.
Stick to certified coins.
the indian head cent is corroded
the 1906-D Barber half dollar is scratched.
the 1928-S peace dollar does have some issues, but is in far better condition that the other cent and half.
I'm not going to offer values on those.
the Franklin half dollar has about $9.50 worth of silver in it. that's where its value lies.
the eisenhower dollar, as mentioned already, is nothing special and is worth $1.
I wish the Ike was a counterfeit. I am having a difficult time locating one for my DANSCO counterfeit type album.
peacockcoins
But I would still be worried about the 28-S Peace Dollar. Those little black "pops" (pinholes) on the obverse are worrisome as that usually is a sign of porosity from a cast fake/reproduction. You see how the surface of your Barber and Franklin are.
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
China does make coins that are of 0.900 silver with the correct weight. Take them to a coin shop or jeweler and have them tested.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, evn when irrefutably accurate.
the bubbles from casting are usually round. Those irregular shapes just look like damage to me.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, evn when irrefutably accurate.
Well the keyword is "usually" - you see how the details are soft. The "sand" used to make the molds aren't able to pick up the details very sharpley. I've been into pattern making and a foundry consultant since 1985 and believe me, the time I worked at a small iron and aluminum foundry we made every coin imaginable. Never to pawn off as fakes but just to see if we could make them to create items like key chains, bracelets, etc..........
"When they can't find anything wrong with you, they create it!"
@Slapdoodle19.... Welcome aboard. Sorry the news is not very good on your coins, but you can be sure the information is solid (I agree with the above assessments)... Keep showing us the coins, you will get good help here. Cheers, RickO
Yea, sadly the seated liberty looks fake. The date looks vary odd
Bummer.
Is it just me or does lady Liberty's head on the first one of the seated dollars look unnaturally large?
Alright and here's my next question. Though at first this one's authenticity was a no-brainer as it's stamped COPY. But we are lost on value. Does it actually have any? Current auction has one for over $300 and its really confusing why people are bidding that high. Is it worth that much? Anyone wanna buy one??
"But we are lost on value. Does it actually have any?"
No
You can buy as many as you want from an overseas internet seller for $1.00 each or less.
"why people are bidding that high."
I would guess some auction games or shill bidding in an attempt to create auction excitement and lure in a real bidder but it may just be under educated buyers.
trinket with trinket value
Yeah, figured as much.
Onto a few Barber Quarters.
The Barber quarters look real and the Seated dollars are absolutely modern counterfeits. The "copy" Civil War thing is a very poor copy not worth anything and I can only surmise the large "bid" you see online is a fake bid.
You don't appear too upset that the Seated dollar counterfeits are actually counterfeit, which makes me wonder how you obtained them or what you paid for them. These details can often lead someone to know immediately if something is fake or not.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
You might want to consider purchasing A copy of "A Guide Book of United States Coins" by RS Yeoman. It will be a lot easier to screen out the common coins instead of posting everything. You can then post the ones that are better dates or in better condition. Only $10-15 and is loaded with info, including some basic grading guidelines for circulated coins. I would bet that nearly every experienced US collector has one or has used one in their life
Well I'm not too upset about any of it because none of it is a loss or gain on my end. My stepfather on the other hand might dislike it more being that it's his investment.
He got those 4 at a local country auction and went up to $60 a piece.
$60 is too low if real, and way too high if fake. I wonder if there was a shill (perhaps the consignor) who bid them up to make them look legit.
Well then, obviously most everyone in attendance knew they were modern counterfeits and he went head-to-head against either "the book" (which can be a fictitious entity used by auctioneers to squeeze blood from a stone or at least the last dollar against unknowledgeable bidders) or against another dreamer who denied the evidence.
They can be purchased online, today, as a group for less than $8 including shipping.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
some of those barber quarters are so damaged and/or cleaned they are called "culls" and have lost collectible value.
interestingly enough, they can still bring more than silver value. silver value is about $4.75 for the culls.
APMEX prices above retail for many items - large grain of salt - https://www.apmex.com/product/168877/90-silver-barber-quarters-40-coin-roll-cull - currently $7.20 each. I don't know about that.
a good bit of those are culls.
going through the pictures and making a list from the pics is a chore,
taking the coins and making a list while they are in hand is easier.
I'm going to give you a short task to take those barber quarters and make a date-mintmark list of them that will be used to look for better dates.
the mintage figures will give you an idea of scarcity
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_quarter_mintage_figures#Barber_quarter
look at the 1901-S 72k then the 1901-(P) (no mintmark - minted in Philly) - 8.9 million
(O - new orleans mintmark)
as you can see there are wide ranges and the 1901-(P) is not really scarce in the series. with the heavy circulation, common stuff won't be worth a whole lot. however, a cull 1901-S is still going to be worth a nice, nice amount.