Whats the chances this is an original proof set or picked?
goldrealmoney79
Posts: 417 ✭✭✭
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goldrealmoney79
Posts: 417 ✭✭✭
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Original set? No chance at all. Coins not graded, buyer beware.
Not sure about that set, but here is a truly original proof set with the mint envelope and all CAC endorsed:
End Systemic Elitism - It Takes All of Us
ANA LM, LSCC, EAC, FUN
The custom box and plastic suggests that a collector might have put this together some time ago, but......a lot of money represented not to have had them graded before selling. And, looks like a very experienced seller, so....2+2.
Very hard to tell if original from those pics.
Put together some prices that this set should be worth based on grades. I think you'll find it needs to be a very high grade set to make it worth $18000 Like better than PR65
This seller sells slabbed material so he is aware of the market
There is a return privilege, so there's little risk, but my statement on grades needed to value the set near $18K tells me all I need to know
Ike Specialist
Finest Toned Ike I've Ever Seen, been looking since 1986
I would wonder why they are not slabbed even tho the seller has 100% feedback and has been around for a while. I would ask him if there's anything that precludes slabbing.
Unless it's the holder, and I doubt it is all the holder, the money coins (the dollar and half dollar) are hairlined to all heck and back.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Pay $18,000 for raw coins in today's coin market ... no way.
Original proof sets from that era came in mint wrappers. The silver coins tended to tone pretty deeply and with some consistency among the coins. The odds of finding ones as lightly toned (or brilliant) as the ones shown by the OP are pretty slim. If you're after Cams and Deep Cams you often have to dip the coins....at your own risk. Cams are about as good as you normally get on an original 1860's to early 1900's proof set that have been kept together for 50-100 yrs.
Coins were ordered from the mint individually. They were not sold in sets and certainly this aftermarket holder is not of that era (very modern). The coins may very well be original. Pics are such that they look awesome but would need to see in hand to spend that kind of money.
bob
You could also order sets.....look at the pic in the third post
A few years ago there was a run of these sets with original envelopes etc. They brought huge bucks as you would expect.
Ike Specialist
Finest Toned Ike I've Ever Seen, been looking since 1986
I would definitely not pay that much for the set...even if I could see it 'in hand'....and looking at the magnified picture, well... the grades I see would not justify the price.... Cheers, RickO
Zero chance it's original.
Zero chance they have never been dipped.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
Of course I agree with the skepticism expressed above, but the set is a bit of a curiosity.
I think the seller really did acquire this from a Palm Beach estate; that part is probably not fantasy.
Given the way the felt is worn and adheres to the plastic holder, it does seem that it has been stored in the wooden box and plastic holder for a long term - fifty years or more.
Was it stored in the wooden box before that? It is somewhat remarkable that the plastic hold fits exactly in the box.
Although it may be the photo, the four smaller coins appear to have been stored face up for quite a while, with the cloudy reverses related to touching felt or some other substance.
The dollar and half seem different, but were perhaps acquired together, and periodically wiped rather hard by their owner.
Probably the coins were dipped at the time they were put in the plastic holder. To me, they have the look of an old rather than a new dip.
There is a big difference between proof like and original proof set.
Maybe stored for 50 years, that's certainly possible.
But remember, in the 1970's dealers and collectors were dipping every single coin they owned.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
This proof set has been listed for sale on ebay at a price of $18,000.00 for a very long time (I think for at least a year and most likely more than a year).
It would be interesting to see the coins in hand.
Zero, at best.
Dave
Coins are cleaned and hairlined. Easy to see on the dollar and half dollar but I still doubt any would straight grade.
In essence everyone here is stating the dealer- with 34,000+ feedbacks at 100% positive- is an absolute liar and cheat.
It very well may have been an original set, but that really doesn't matter as much as the fact that they were all cleaned at the same time. $18,000 is north of PR65 CAM retail.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
I will give the benefit of doubt that they are original and not cleaned; acquired from an estate who put this set together and put them in plastic when that was the only plastic available. But the seller is not a newbie and if these would grade in 64/65/66 cameo they would already be in PCGS/NGC plastic instead of Capital. Especially at that price.
What does “proof like” have to do with this set? It’s a Proof set.
It’s unoriginal looking, as the coins appear to have been dipped. Additionally, some people use the term “original” to describe sets that have been together since the time of issue. But there’s no way to know if such is the case with this set.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
They look cleaned to me and fairly well hair-lined. So, no surprises there. Original proofs from this era were virtually ALL cleaned. That is why it is so damn hard to find Original coins, and particularly original Proof Sets. The original proof sets that do come on the market generally all exhibit deep toning, and the toning is consistent across the silver coins.
OP in the first line said proof like. Maybe I misunderstood.
Thanks. I don’t understand what that post meant.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
18K
Me either.
@abcde12345 said "In essence everyone here is stating the dealer- with 34,000+ feedbacks at 100% positive- is an absolute liar and cheat."
I don't think people are being that harsh. The seller seems to deal mostly in bullion, foreign coins, some modern stuff. Not necessarily cheap stuff ... many transactions are several hundred dollars, and some into the thousands. There are some slabbed rare coins. But this proof set is atypical, and perhaps he is being a bit "hopeful". Many of us, including me, are biased when it comes to our own coins.
The seller may in fact have convinced himself that he has a choice "original" set. But, they are raw, the images are poor, and most viewers very reasonably think the coins look hairlined, if not very seriously mishandled. This is not unfair.
I think he meant "cameo"
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, evn when irrefutably accurate.