The story of the Kino Bars, Paul Franklin and John Ford.

EagleEye · July 18, 2018 9:07AM

Father Kino was a Jesuit Priest (1645-1711). He discovered that California was not an island. After a well-received article about him in 1947, Kino became very popular in Southern Arizona.

A fellow named Milton Rose was said to have discovered the "Kino" silver bar hoard in the Yuma, Arizona area. The reported date of the discovery was given as being in the 1930's. But the earliest announcement was after the Kino article as published.

The find was published in Arizona Highways and intense interest started. During the 1950's speculation was rampant regarding the source of the bars. All were of varying fineness of silver (45% to 60%), Gold (trace to 15%), zinc (5% - 15%), copper, tin, iron and lead. They bore unusual marking with dates from the early 1700's and names like Kino.

As we cast speculation aside, we can easily condemn these as fake bars. We see no Spanish stamp on the bars, making them illegal as evading the royal 1/5 tax on bars due the crown. There is no way tin and zinc would be present it rough-hewn bars made in northern Mexico in the early 1700's. They vary too widely to be believed.

Recently I bought the main hoard of these bars, along with letters from John Ford, who expressed interest in the bars and directed the owners attention to Paul Franklin. It is possible that the widespread acceptance of the story (and profit) associated with these bars sparked an idea to fake other western bars. And so a saga began.

I recently picked up a Spanish gold bar that weighs 12.5 oz and tested to be 92% gold. This is believed to be a Paul Franklin hoax bar, as it has no provenience prior to the 1950's. Similar bars have never been found on shipwrecks of the era.

Meltdown · July 18, 2018 9:12AM

Wow. That's a great share, thanks.

MilkmanDan · July 18, 2018 9:19AM

Interesting stuff. With what intent did you buy them?

Sonorandesertrat · July 18, 2018 9:21AM

Any thoughts on who might have produced these bars, and whether Ford knew (or suspected) that they might not be genuine? The chemical and isotopic composition of the bars could give a clue regarding where the precious metals in them originally came from.

Karl Moulton's book on this topic (and related fake pieces marketed to many collectors, including Lilly) was a fascinating read, but I was left wondering about the whole truth, rather than innuendo and peripheral observations.

EagleEye · July 18, 2018 9:22AM

@OriginalDan said:
Interesting stuff. With what intent did you buy them?

To study and write about them. I bought them as fake, although I had to confirm the gold bar, if that is what you want to know.

Insider2 · July 18, 2018 9:24AM

Easy for me to say but it would be neat to donate at least one of the small silver bars plus images of the rest and a copy of the Ford letter to the ANA museum and a major museum in AZ. I'll bet the Smithsonian would like one too. This is true Arizona and numismatic history.

PS Easy to give away the property of others...With ideas as mine, you would be left with nothing.

PS Any contact with TOOTELLTHE TRUTH? I miss his stories.

MilkmanDan · July 18, 2018 9:28AM

@EagleEye said:

show previous quotes

@OriginalDan said:
Interesting stuff. With what intent did you buy them?

To study and write about them. I bought them as fake, although I had to confirm the gold bar, if that is what you want to know.

Yes, that’s what I was wondering thanks. Quarantine those puppies and get the word out.

coinsarefun · July 18, 2018 9:30AM

Interesting story, neat collection and even though..........the Spanish gold bar is still very cool looking bar,

Sonorandesertrat · July 18, 2018 9:30AM

The Kino statue in Tucson, during a storm:

EagleEye · July 18, 2018 9:35AM

TTTT is in Lampoc, California for the duration of the trump presidency, a few more months at least.

Coinstartled · July 18, 2018 9:38AM

Rick, we need an eyes popping out of head smiley. That is a splendid acquisition.

Coinstartled · July 18, 2018 9:39AM

@Sonorandesertrat said:
The Kino statue in Tucson, during a storm:

Is that near the mission, SDR?

Coinstartled · July 18, 2018 9:40AM

@EagleEye said:
TTTT is in Lampoc, California for the duration of the trump presidency, a few more months at least.

78 most likely.

Sonorandesertrat · July 18, 2018 9:43AM

It's at the Kino interchange. Every December, before Christmas, city workers put two small Santa hats on the horse's ears.

chumley · July 18, 2018 9:46AM

thank you for the education

jmlanzaf · July 18, 2018 10:14AM

@Coinstartled said:

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@EagleEye said:
TTTT is in Lampoc, California for the duration of the trump presidency, a few more months at least.

78 most likely.

uh-oh

EagleEye · July 18, 2018 10:53AM

There is a lot of information in this auction lot from a few years ago by Fred Holabird

Regulated · July 18, 2018 10:55AM

I think this is far and away the best study group of this material. It's also something that should make people here realize how lucky they are to collect at a time when the collecting community is the wild west...

Pun intended.

Coinosaurus · July 18, 2018 11:06AM

Thanks for sharing, I look forward to seeing the full writeup!

291fifth · July 18, 2018 11:11AM

This post is a good example of how a coin interested person such as myself can collect knowledge without actually buying any coins, etc.

Great information!

Insider2 · July 18, 2018 11:13AM

@Coinosaurus said:
Thanks for sharing,I look forward to seeing the full writeup!

Try this link:

@EagleEye said:
There is a lot of information in this auction lot from a few years ago by Fred Holabird

Smudge · July 18, 2018 11:27AM

Great post. Very interesting and informative, thank you.

sellitstore · July 18, 2018 11:49AM

@EagleEye said:
There is a lot of information in this auction lot from a few years ago by Fred Holabird

Yes, I remember seeing these and first learning about them in the Holabird sale. I remember first seeing them in the 2011 sale and then again two years ago.

I'd love to see more info on these. Although fantasies, they are still very interesting and based on actual history.

AngryTurtle · July 18, 2018 12:10PM

I had heard of the Ford/Franklin fakes, but not the Kino bars. A fascinating subject!

RogerB · July 18, 2018 1:28PM

Wonderful stuff! Those little fake bars are especially telling ---

Namvet69 · July 18, 2018 6:37PM

Sounds like a sequel to The treasure of Sierra Madre. Peace Roy

EagleEye · July 18, 2018 8:28PM

This is the map that Father Kino had made showing California as a peninsula, not an island. Kino was spelled Chino in his lifetime. That is another reason the bar marked "Kino" is not of the period.

Timbuk3 · July 18, 2018 8:40PM

Wow, interesting, thanks for sharing !!!

ricko · July 19, 2018 7:22AM

Very interesting... I did not know very much about these, having only heard about them in some passing conversations. Thanks for the links.... Cheers, RickO

DaveWcoins · July 19, 2018 7:32AM

Post of the week! Fascinating.

CaptHenway · July 19, 2018 7:38AM

Fascinating!

Ford may not have originated the concept of taking a known legend and fabricating some piece of crap to match it, and he wasn't the last. The so-called "Yoachum Dollars" from the Ozarks did the same thing.

CaptainBlunt · July 20, 2018 5:29PM

One of Ford's favorite movies was The Treasure of the Sierra Madre starring Humphrey Bogart....
I always wondered what the last days of the relationship between Ford and Franklin were like..
Did they look at each other with suspicion?

Insider2 · July 20, 2018 5:38PM

The best counterfeiters know what they are doing. For example, someone who is an expert in Western Art could help produce amazing reproductions that would pass inspection. Two of my favorite books are about Mark Hoffman and how he made his fake Mormon documents.

CaptainBlunt · July 20, 2018 6:13PM

There was a group of gold ingots that first showed up around 1969 at an auction in London. They were stamped
F.G. Hoard Amador Co. Cal Assayer , 999 Fine, etc....What is interesting about these bars is that Hoard
was a completely obscure figure in history. He was an assayer among other things in Fiddletown, CA.
There was absolutely no reason or way that he would or could turn out 999 Fine bars. He did not
own a refinery. Besides that there was no market for a 999 fine bar in Fiddletown, etc. These modern
bars were made to sell to collectors.

I believe that whomever made these FAKE bars pulled Hoard's name out of the 1867 Pacific Coast Business
Directory.....were he would have been listed as F.G. Hoard assayer under Amador Co. CA.

Zoins · June 13, 2019 8:47PM

@EagleEye said:
I recently picked up a Spanish gold bar that weighs 12.5 oz and tested to be 92% gold. This is believed to be a Paul Franklin hoax bar, as it has no provenience prior to the 1950's. Similar bars have never been found on shipwrecks of the era.

Old Thread Update

Just ran across this thread. Somehow I missed it the first time around.

This is a really nice looking gold bar. Do you still have this?

Insider2 · June 16, 2019 12:52PM

This thread got me to order this book from the ANA Library:

John j. Ford, Jr.
and the "Franklin Hoard"

It weighs about five pounds!

CaptHenway · June 16, 2019 3:25PM

@Insider2 said:
This thread got me to order this book from the ANA Library:

John j. Ford, Jr.
and the "Franklin Hoard"

It weighs about five pounds!

I have an extra one of those if you want to buy one. They are not cheap.

Zoins · June 16, 2019 5:10PM

@Insider2 said:
This thread got me to order this book from the ANA Library:

John j. Ford, Jr.
and the "Franklin Hoard"

It weighs about five pounds!

It's interesting that two E-Sylum articles mentioned Paul Franklin's name differently. I was wondering which one was correct but apparently both were at different times. I was also curious if any of his dies were found and apparently the FBI found what sound like half dollar dies.

"Gerow Paul Franklin": https://www.coinbooks.org/esylum_v16n26a07.html
"Paul Gerow Franklin": https://www.coinbooks.org/esylum_v09n12a02.html

Recently I obtained the capacity to search the New York Times' article database, and I decided to look for the name of Paul Franklin, the source of the "Franklin Hoard" of U.S. Assay Office of Gold items that led to a major contretemps in 1967. Paul Gerow Franklin, Sr. was born on May 24, 1919, and died on March 13, 2000. Franklin originally used Gerow as his first name, but later reversed the order of the names.

Only one article came up as a result. Entitled, "Evader of Draft, Long Sought, Held; Small Arsenal Found in His Room, Including 2,000 Ammunition Rounds; Fake 4F Cards also Seized; Prisoner Says He Avoided His Board Fearing Arrest as Parole Violator," it ran in the New York Times of July 11, 1943, on page 26.

The article states that Gerow Paul Franklin, aged 24, was arrested at the apartment in which he had been hiding out on West 74th Street, New York City. When arrested the FBI found in his room nine pistols, four rifles, 2,000 rounds of ammunition, black powder, and smokeless powder, plus knives, bayonets, and brass knuckles. One pistol had a home made-silencer. A German luger was mounted on a stock, with a canister of thirty rounds of ammunition. The weapons are depicted in a photograph that accompanies the article.

The FBI also found forged draft registration and classification cards that classified the holder as 4F.

The arresting FBI agent stated that Franklin was a gunsmith "of no mean ability", who had been able to construct some unique weapons. It also states that in 1941, Franklin had been arrested for "possession of counterfeit molds which he used in the manufacture of half-dollars."

dcarr · May 7, 2021 7:09PM

Old thread, second revival.

Today at the Denver coin show I saw this little bar. I didn't know what it was, but it looked interesting. I had it XRF tested at the show and the composition was:

55% Silver
22% Copper
17% Zinc
5% Tin
1% Iron

59.5 grams weight.

So I bought it, not knowing what it was.

Now I know !

If the image doesn't show up, here is a link to it:
designscomputed.com/coin_pics/kino_bar.jpg

.

DCW · May 7, 2021 7:40PM

Here you go, @dcarr

Zoins · May 7, 2021 7:54PM

Very cool Dan @dcarr!

Is the Franklin-Ford minting facility generally known as the Massapequa Mint?

dcarr · May 8, 2021 10:53PM

@Zoins said:
Very cool Dan @dcarr!

Is the Franklin-Ford minting facility generally known as the Massapequa Mint?

I'm not familiar with that, so I don't know.

I did find it interesting that, even with full disclosure and history, one such bar recently sold on eBay for somewhere in the vicinity of $600:
https://ebay.com/itm/184820200179

And another is asking $1,250 (but no sale yet):
https://ebay.com/itm/303989408147

Zoins · May 8, 2021 11:14PM

@dcarr said:

show previous quotes

@Zoins said:
Very cool Dan @dcarr!

Is the Franklin-Ford minting facility generally known as the Massapequa Mint?

I'm not familiar with that, so I don't know.

I did find it interesting that, even with full disclosure and history, one such bar recently sold on eBay for somewhere in the vicinity of $600:
https://ebay.com/itm/184820200179

And another is asking $1,250 (but no sale yet):
https://ebay.com/itm/303989408147

Very interesting information in those descriptions. Here's the description, which is the same for both, for posterity.

eerc said:

This is part of the “Tucson” hoard of silver ingots. These purport to be from the time of Spanish exploration in the Sonoran desert region of southern Arizona and northern Sonora, Mexico. It is widely believed that these are not products of that time, but were part of a treasure hoax begun in the 1940’s. We are marketing these as such.

These have been offered in the past on auction sites such as www.HolabirdAmericana.com as “Father Kino Hoax Ingots.” He writes: “The popularity of the folklore surrounding these elaborate fakes makes them immensely marketable.”

My conclusion that these are not of the Kino era (1690-1710) is based on the metallurgy and lack of a royal Spanish stamp. These bars all have alloys inconsistent with rough poured silver bars. Simple and true. Making precious metal bars without the Spanish stamp would have been a crime punishable by death in colonial New Spain. It would mean the Royal Fifth was not paid to the crown.

The story of their “discovery” and history was detailed by Fred Holabird in a 2016 auction description, which is as follows:

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Introduction

The Father Kino ingots are among the great hoaxes of twentieth century numismatics. First appearing in national media print in 1947, though allegedly discovered in the 1930's, the ingots sparked a series of articles in various publications, such as the prestigious Arizona Highways Magazine.

The ingots were reportedly discovered by Milton Rose in the 1930’s. No information regarding the “discovery”, appears in the public sector until the 1940's, after Rose put some of the bars on display at the Arizona Mining and Minerals Museum in Tucson in 1947, and a subsequent detailed article in Arizona Highways Magazine in 1948.

The story of Kino is interesting, but the underlying and even more significant "big picture" regarding the fabrication of counterfeit ingots cannot be ignored. Karl Moulton, in his book on John Ford and Paul Franklin, wrote a detailed account of his research findings that is remarkably telling in what it says and doesn’t say. My take on it is that these bars are the first of a series of fake ingots made specifically to deceive the public. They show similar characteristics to many of the questioned bars supposedly discovered years later, and the alleged date of the "discovery" of the Kino ingots and subsequent initial publication far predates any involvement in the "industry” by Ford and Franklin.

There remains a group of people, particularly treasure hunters, who still believe these ingots are original and legitimate.

The Father (padre) Kino Story

Kino was born Eusebio Kino in northern ltaly in August 1645. At the age of 18 he became so sick that he vowed if cured, he’d become a missionary for the Church. Highly schooled in science and math, Kino was chosen for a mission to New Spain, "the New World.” ln 1678 he left for Genoa to go to the New World, but the group of Jesuits missed their boat, and, instead of taking the "next boats” which were slave boats designed to go to Africa to take slaves and then venture to the New World, it took them three years to get onboard another ship. Once ashore in the New World, Kino then made his way to Sonora, Mexico, then north into the Santa Cruz and Gila River regions in Arizona. He settled for a time in Baja California, drawing attention to the fact that California was Not an island, as reported on all the maps, and they could travel north and east to the Gila region, the land of the pima lndians.

ln November, 1694 he "discovered” the giant ruins of a previous civilization at Casa Grande, reportedly the first account of the ruins by a white man. By the early 1700's miners and other Spaniards complained that the Jesuits had control of all the good land in pima country, a conflict that lasted for years. The Arizona Highways article entitled “The Trail of Padre Kino" discussed how this educated man was on a mission to educate and christianize the lndians of the southwest, introducing cattle and farming techniques to the region. He was reportedly killed by Indians in 1711. The Pima and Apache were rival tribes, with the latter causing great difficulties to explorers and miners for more than a century.

Early mining in the remote areas of southern Arizona has been known since Spanish times, though it was limited to mostly prospecting. Reports of Kino and these early Spanish prospects were published by Emory from his 1846 explorations through the southwest and others In the early 19th century.

Near the junction (of the Gila and Colorado rivers), on the north side, are the remains of an old Spanish Church, built near the beginning of the 17th century, by the renowned missionary, Father Kino. The mission was eventually sacked by the lndians and the inhabitants all murdered or driven off. Reports of Spanish mining in the southern Arizona region were further researched by subsequent American exploring expeditions fueled by the California Gold Rush. One of the very early companies, the Sonora

Exploring and Mining Co., reported to stockholders in 1857 that a theory was held that the proportion of silver contained in the ores increases as you advance towards the north. They further opined: The idea probably originated in the famous Bolas de Plata (BaIls of silver) of Arizona, in the beginning of the last century (c 1700-1710), which was, and probably still is, believed in Europe to be one of those fables, with which mining countries always abound.

Treasure Hunting Rush Ensues

Reports of the discovery of these ingots in Arizona Highways fueled more treasure hunters. Whether it was looking for buried Spanish treasure or the Lost Dutchman mine, treasure hunters crawled the hills and mountains of remote and treacherous Arizona regions looking for the mysterious and elusive rumored riches. The argument for thee lost mines was not new: In fact, the Spanish were so intent on finding Quivera, the mythical city of gold, that they sent numerous expeditions into Mexico and America in search of the El Dorado. A young Paul Franklin, drawn to treasure hunting through friends he met during WWII, was an eager and gullible target for the hoaxers, and so were thousands of others. Franklin was given several photographs of the “discovery” of the ingots in the mid-1950’s, one reproduced here, kindly offered from the family. Franklin thought there were two batches of ingots- one real, and one fake. He felt the ingots with a white cast, an oxide or alkalai coating on some ingots indicated they were real or authentic. Unfortunately, that was not the case. Today, current scientific and advanced study lead to the conclusion that the ingots are fake.

New Evidence

Ernie Richards and Alan Craig’s book on Spanish ingots is perhaps the best telling evidence of their fabrication. Through time, particularly after WWII, treasure hunters and divers in Florida began to find silver coin and the occasional silver bar. Then Mel Fisher hit it big with the Atocha in 1985 using a technique that his men developed to help clean the sand from the bottom of the ocean and expose the heavy metals that sat on the original ground surface, or hardpan. Because of Fisher’s salvage innovations, divers began finding more and more bars, all from the mid 1500’s through the eighteenth century. Wrecks from Spanish treasure fleets from 1554 (San Estiban, etc), c1590’s (Power Plant wreck), 1622 (Atocha, etc), 1656 (Mimbres), 1660 (Jupiter), 1715 (Plate Fleet), 1733, 1766 (Duke of York) produced coins and ingots.

Craig & Richards’ study provides factual data and information on two hundred years of Spanish ingot production in the New World, 1554-1766, showing good consistency throughout, and in fact, shows the early methods and customs used that were later carried on by American assayers a century later. Not one single ingot has been found from the treasure fleets made in the style of the Kino ingots – the outward embossed letters and unusual shapes. I find it interesting that no one discussing the Kino ingots thought to compare the legitimate silver ingots found off the Florida and other East coast areas where wrecks of Spanish treasure fleets abound.

For decades, silver ingots from the Spanish treasure fleets were being found one at a time, but rarely were publicized, until Fisher’s gigantic discovery in the mid 1980’s of over 920 silver bars. The embossing on the Kino ingots was made from crude carving of letters into the ingot molds. Further, the ingots were small, and many of uniform size. The smallness was possibly due to the fakers intent that the bars be made in a manner for use in monetary circulation, something generally not seen in Spanish bars, and not more common until American ingot production. Some have a crude bullion punch on the reverse with a figure of what may be royalty, as a clever attempt to show some higher governmental authority.

Research by Dr. Gene Lyon, as well as that by Craig & Richards shows that any legitimate silver bar must have the King’s tax stamp to show the owner paid the quinto, or fifth tax. To not have the tax stamp indicates illegal contraband. While we now know from research that some silver processed in the Arizona region did not pay their quinto, the placement of a phony looking bullion punch on the reverse of one ingot inconsistent with the others belies the problem of the payment of the King’s quinto, and thus was a poor effort to try to legitimize the fakes. Additionally, as evidenced by the many contraband bars listed by Craig and Richards, these ingots would not contain the names of men in Kino’s group if they were contraband, nor would they show a sign of the Church (cross), or be dated. Many carry dates, such as 1697, 1707. Physically, the molds themselves are far too perfect, formed with vertical sides, showing no evidence of post-pour assay, a critical mistake. They are, in fact, wonderfully inventive artistic creations, but are not authentic Spanish realm silver bars.

When Moulton began his research into the Kino bars, a rather lengthy internet blog session was begun in August 2007, continuing for a solid month. Moulton diligently printed the blogs, which have perhaps more information on these bars that ever seen or read before. The trouble with blogs is that no one will write an article and stand behind their name. This renders interpretation of the blog as unsubstantiated information. Further, not one single blog offering detailed history cites any specific reference, which in the work of a professional researcher amounts to a fatal flaw. While it is reported that a man still owns most of the original hoard found more than 100 years ago, that person is not forthcoming, and serious questions arise as to the validity of any of the reports. Yet they are interesting, nonetheless.

DCW · May 9, 2021 9:15AM

Perhaps people want them even as counterfeits, much like the Henning nickels are now so highly collectable.
(Worth many times what any real nickel would bring.)

Dwight_M · May 9, 2021 1:12PM

Ascribe the following as you wish ; at an ana show in Baltimore about 18 years ago, john and I had a long talk at the table. Prior I had flown him out for a private ssca ingot day in the vault. He told me how little he had in the 1940s and would fly a plane to make money surveying below. He made the point repeatedly how tight things were. Then by 1950/51, the same time all these “discoveries “ happened , he was selling the norwebs and others all they could handle a suddenly was rolling in dough. Seems quite the coincidence

bigtonydallas · May 10, 2021 4:34AM

My mom was from the town in northern Mexico, Magdalena, where in the 1960's they found father Kinos remains while digging for a new police station. I never heard of Kinos silver bars. I know when they found his remains the body had a large red ruby heart shaped gold necklace that was Kinos.

Coinnmore · March 27, 2024 4:26PM

Hey glad to see you post these I know I picked up a few of them crosses I keep them locked up in the safe. I will have to read up on your article and maybe one day visit the shop if I am ever in Arizona.

yspsales · March 28, 2024 6:26AM

That is an amazing story.

I guess at some point 100 year old Art Deco/Native American fakes have a certain cachet.

rte592 · March 28, 2024 7:14AM

@Coinnmore said:
Hey glad to see you post these I know I picked up a few of them crosses I keep them locked up in the safe. I will have to read up on your article and maybe one day visit the shop if I am ever in Arizona.

Just stumbled across this topic.
Pictures of the crosses would be great to see and what shop would that be in Arizona?
The closest story I heard was from a kid at a local coin meeting in Yuma talking about his father's friend that found a treasure chest on the beach in Mexico in the 60's.
The kid had a few pictures on his phone of older pictures and a couple pieces of eight cobs. He said he was working with the guy moving the items and he was going to bring in some gold and gems next month.
The kid didn't return to any other meetings, I believe the kid was a farmer in Blythe California? or his family was.

Coinnmore · March 28, 2024 8:28AM

@rte592 said:

show previous quotes

@Coinnmore said:
Hey glad to see you post these I know I picked up a few of them crosses I keep them locked up in the safe. I will have to read up on your article and maybe one day visit the shop if I am ever in Arizona.

Just stumbled across this topic.
Pictures of the crosses would be great to see and what shop would that be in Arizona?
The closest story I heard was from a kid at a local coin meeting in Yuma talking about his father's friend that found a treasure chest on the beach in Mexico in the 60's.
The kid had a few pictures on his phone of older pictures and a couple pieces of eight cobs. He said he was working with the guy moving the items and he was going to bring in some gold and gems next month.
The kid didn't return to any other meetings, I believe the kid was a farmer in Blythe California? or his family was.

I got a few pictures when I can find them I will post. The two I have are in the main photos in this article. I just have to find it cause it was back a few years.

Coinnmore · March 28, 2024 10:10AM

These are not the best pictures but then back a few years is when I got them so the only pictures so far I can find. Not sure if I ever put them on the sigma to check for silver content.

The story of the Kino Bars, Paul Franklin and John Ford.

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