interesting topics in Legend's new Hot Topics
Gazes
Posts: 2,315 ✭✭✭✭✭
Legend posted a new hot topics. https://www.legendnumismatics.com/hot_topics/odds-and-ends/
What I thought was particularly interesting was the paragraph titled "Bill Gates" The topic is now that we have "a slew" of collectors with mega bucks, how has it impacted the market. Laura says "To complete a top set in some cases you are forced to buy over graded or ugly coins. BAD. There are very few if any new top 2-3 sets in many series that can be built. So was it better to have Bill Gates? I say no, now its a deterant (sic) for many collectors. Remedy, forget about a #1 set. Build the best set possible-with the best coins, it will serve you much better as time goes on."
I thought her comments were very interesting and touched on many issues (i.e difficulty building a top set, the impact of mega collectors, etc). Would like to hear others thoughts?
Comments
Buy the best you can't afford.
Buy ... promote ... dump ...
As much as I love Laura’s passion, this is pretty morbid, and hope she can retire from 80 hour days.
I think this is a great idea. The ANA has some stuff online but for some reason, I don’t end up there. I tend to end up using the NNP and ANS more online. Thanks to Newman and Bass for setting the direction along with many others for execution.
Laura just posted here she built sets for the love of collecting and couldn’t care less for ranking. So why does # 1-2-3 set matter here?
At least this is an area an astute collector can still come out on top. Knowledge is power.
This is cool and good to know.
Beyond my OP, the one thing I would love to read from Laura relates to her statement:
" Sadly I am far more censored today then I was just a few years ago. I'm holding back a lot as I am focusing on trying to semi retired. I do promise tho, one day everything I am angry about and have seen WILL come out."
That is what I want to read!!!
I wonder who is censoring her? I got the impression that she wouldn’t be silenced by anyone!
I think she’s touched on some of these topics before.
My thoughts:
I was at the ANA and, even though there weren’t 10,000 in attendance; I still feel it was a good turn out. There were quite a few people having a good time including myself. I found two really nice coins on the bourse floor. You must factor in that we are now in the digital age and that is where most business is done.
I agree that I don’t care for the PNG, as I feel they are useless.
How could any price guide possibly be accurate, as grading is subjective and different coins are worth more than others within the same grade and issue, because of quality differences. You just must do what I’ve done: Study the market and decide how much a coin is worth to YOU..How badly do you want it for your set and how much of a premium are you willing to pay for it and are you going to hold it long term? Do you believe that you can find another like it at the same or better price? The best price guides will always just be references. Dealers will always talk Coins down when buying and talk coins up when selling, Regardless of the quality. That has always been the name of the game and a shrewd collector will not let himself/herself be taken advantage of.
I don’t care for dealer representation. I’ve never had a dealer really help me locate a coin and, when they do, they always want a gigantic premium. I’m not completely against dealer representation but I’ve done pretty well on my own, so far. I would certainly consider it, if I really thought it would help me but, so far, this hasn’t been the case. I just feel that more often than not; I can do better on my own. Whenever I tell dealers my wants, they always go by the wayside and I never hear from them again. It looks good on paper but, in reality, it has not worked well for me. A dedicated individual who is FOCUSED on a single series has an advantage over a dealer IMHO.
I totally agree with her that coin collecting and investing is a long-term proposition, especially, when you’re buying really high quality coins.
Finally, I will never have the top ranking walking liberty half set. But I will have quality coins that are the best that I can afford and that are the best within their grade level. Many far better than what the numerical insert says and worthy of reconsideration and I am more than happy with that.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Sorry, but I take exception to the part of your post I have copied below. If you’d said “sometimes” or even “frequently”, instead of “always”, I would have moved along, without replying. I know plenty of dealers who are complimentary of coins they’re trying to buy. And likewise, I know many dealers who don’t talk up each coin they’re trying to sell.
“Dealers will always talk Coins down when buying and talk coins up when selling, Regardless of the quality. That has always been the name of the game and a shrewd collector will not let himself/herself be taken advantage of.”
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Sorry, my bad. Point taken. You are correct---there are a few good dealers out there.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Well, a “few” is a step in the right direction. 😉
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@MFeld said: "Sorry, but I take exception to the part of your post I have copied below. If you’d said “sometimes” or even “frequently”, instead of “always”, I would have moved along, without replying. I know plenty of dealers who are complimentary of coins they’re trying to buy. And likewise, I know many dealers who don’t talk up each coin they’re trying to sell."
“Dealers will always talk Coins down when buying and talk coins up when selling, Regardless of the quality. That has always been the name of the game and a shrewd collector will not let himself/herself be taken advantage of.”
Something about the "exceptions prove the rule" hit me, but I agree that absolutes like "always" always leave you open to error. LOL
@Walkerfan said: "Sorry, my bad. Point taken. You are correct---there are a few good dealers out there."
And even the good ones often talk coins up or down during a transaction.
Don't have time to read but from the original post I gathered this! Gates = Hanson
Hmmm, I guess my clientele of some of the richest people on the planet who can read or write still deal w/me. Look, I simply do NOT care about literary snobs. I write what is in my head-and sometimes it comes out not so polished. hard to believe I do not have time to go back and clean it up. You don't have to read it you know....
I discuss more issues on my Hot Topics then 85% of the dealers today. Why? I do not cheat by cleaning coins, doctoring them, adding heads, running scams... etc..Like most of them do. I am really here to help. Its more important I get the messages out so people do not make mistakes.
I am here in Chi and today I looked at so much garbage-not even DRECK-garbage my head is spinning. You want to end up with the stuff? I'll say this, you WILL know the fresh and nice coins from the auction. But the stuff dealers had-really it will end up in a collectors hand and it will not be a happy ending for someone
I have -0- to contribute to this thread other:
:than to add to my posit count &
I do enjoy reading @specialist reports &
finally to post before this thread gets locked or deleted by cu mod
I concur with her thoughts.
The DLH pursuit is an exceptional and interesting sideshow.
Gates and DLH can have all the pedigreed coins and the Set Registry rankings.
Many coins may as well not exist, since they move from strong collections to other whales and are never really on the market anyway.
Really has no bearing on my collecting habits.
BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out
A friendly reminder to keep things civil.
Heather Boyd
PCGS Senior Director of Marketing
It's not just the orthography, but the presentation and occasionally the substance.
That's kind of defamatory and likely hyperbole.
As long as it is rewarded with straight grades, the abuses will continue.
For all the complaints of misspelling, I’ve never misunderstood a Hot Topics or forum post.
For those really focused on this, check out the book “David and Goliath” by Malcolm Gladwell.
Then why does she care if some people regard Hansen's set as finer than the Simpson sets she built? There are probably 10 pages of nonsequiturs on the topic in the Hansen mega thread. I'm not buying it.
Is Simpson Bill Gates or is Hansen Bill Gates? Or are they both Bill Gates?
What if there were no Simpson and Hansen in the hobby?
I feel bad for Bill Gates. Imagine if he was thinking of building a collection with Legend.
Dirt is the best. I wonder if she will write a book.
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
I do like reading these. I am not in the target audience for the value of coins Legend sells, but much of the information posted is interesting and some is amusing.
LIBERTY SEATED DIMES WITH MAJOR VARIETIES CIRCULATION STRIKES (1837-1891) digital album
The Cliff Notes version of the Market Report:
1) We work harder than we'd like to.
2) ANA needs to step up their game.
3) PNG needs to step up their game.
4) It is ok and safer to be #2.
5) We need a better price guide.
6) Find a dealer you can trust and work the relationship.
Hard not to agree with these tenets. If for some reason you do, at least you know exactly where to find specialist standing.
How would it be if most other major dealers shared the same level of information, thoughts, and insight? Because they don't. Think about it.
Sprinkle in some CAC stuff, and you have the formula (not unlike that used by Greek bards) for all of her blog posts. That's not a snipe, but I think it will save others time.
Do you have a point to make?
This thread is redundant with the others. If you've read the others, there is nothing substantial that is new. I was providing the Cliff Notes to your Cliff Notes.
...ahh...the infamous “Ledge” notes!...this method of note-taking got me through college
It does not sound like you are summarizing anything, it sounds like you are demeaning the message. If the message is repetitive, insubstantial and archaic, why do you bother to continually respond without refutation but only with ad hominem attacks?
Don't shoot me.... I'm just the piano player.
Show me the ad hominem attack in the post of mine you quoted. I critiqued the prose and not the author; thus, you seem to fundamentally misunderstand the meaning of that term. "Ad hominem" is Latin for "to the person."
As for my tone, perhaps it has something to do with the fact that these reports are posted and when people respond civilly in dissent as to actual substantive points in the past (this thread is a poor example of that), it blows up and the posts are deleted. It is okay for the author to attack people in other threads and yet people are expected to gush over every blog post or not participate. You offered your summary, and I offered mine. My post is just as valid as yours.
My post also addressed your question of, "How would it be if most other major dealers shared the same level of information, thoughts, and insight?" Just the same as it has all been said before through Legend, but through other dealers as well.
Simpson, Delloy, and Tyrannt on their own are all a Bill Gates. With any of them Its not how much they can spend in total, its how much they can find they want. Then all the others are left w/the crumbs. There are not many crumbs.
Why do I care what the top 3 money-spenders buy, or don't buy? Someone's gotta do it.
I knew it would happen.
I have always enjoyed Laura's posts....She speaks directly from her thoughts. I would compare her delivery to some famous twitter commentaries.....Though more topic focused and certainly more accurate. If she ever decides to write 'The Book', I have no doubt that every knowledgeable coin collector will buy a copy the day it hits the stands. Cheers, RickO
I'm not sure it has changed things much. It just used to be 100 deep pockets instead of 3. I only care if registry set domination is my goal.
I would also add that if people only collected by type instead of date/mint mark, there would be more than enough nice coins to go around in most series.
Most of us here are “the others” so we know how it feels.
To me this is the most terrifying part of all. Numismatics has always been thinly capitalized, but it seems a lot worse the last few years than in previous decades.
Who is Tyrannt? I don't recognize the name.
LIBERTY SEATED DIMES WITH MAJOR VARIETIES CIRCULATION STRIKES (1837-1891) digital album
You could check out their website, but it's down right now unfortunately:
http://thetyrantcollection.com/
Here's some info that's still up:
http://www.longbeachexpo.com/documents/TyrantCollection_Brochure_619.pdf
Maybe because Tyrant has no ego and quietly assembled his collection. I know the person, he is very nice and is still mad at me for beating him on the $10 1887 PCGS PR66 CAC a few years ago!
His foreign coins are supposed to be beyond incredible.
Quick question for the crowd. Is describing a coin only as "$10 1887 PCGS PR66 CAC" meaningful? It might be meaningful to a dealer, but to me, describing it with the pedigree, e.g. the Dr. Robert J. Loewinger plate coin (along with the other info) seems more meaningful than only a grade.
Zoins, I just hobbled out of the class of 59 dinner at the show. I am confirmed now to be old and forgetful. I can not remember if the 1887 had a pedigree...
I just noticed you also mentioned "5C 1913 PCGS PR66 CAC" in another thread. That seems a bit more sterile than saying the "Eliasberg specimen". Maybe that pedigree is just as forgettable for you, but somehow collecting seems less interesting to me when a coin is just known by its grade.
My guess is that most people who are likely to read this thread would not be familiar with Dr. Loewinger’s name.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Who?
Would you say the same about calling the Eliasberg 1913 Liberty Head nickel the "5C 1913 PCGS PR66 CAC"?
Here's the line from another thread "He will be displaying his incredible Liberty Nickel set -with the 5C 1913 PCGS PR66 CAC at the PCGS table at the ANA Show."
I would not guess that most readers would be unfamiliar with the Eliasberg name.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
They should be. Just search the Heritage auction archives for his name. Very impressive collector, and a researcher whose findings I have leaned on.
can you tell us who you purchased the $10 1887 for? thx
Lowenger had early gold-early PR gold. But many of his coins were NOT impressive and many had been ugh doctored. His coins probably were never talked about for that reason. I recall him as a cheap buyer too
If your building something high quality and really special, the world knows you are out there (maybe not by name).