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why 1938-D Buffalo nickels were produced
RogerB
Posts: 8,896 ✭✭✭✭✭
This short letter should help Buffalo nickel collectors understand why so many of these coins were made at the Denver mint.
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Another great piece of history! Thanks for posting!
It's a good thing I don't have access to all the info you have, I'm pretty sure my brain would explode.
So when were several S-mintmarked reverse dies deliberately over-mintmarked with D’s to use up the dies before the new design was ready? Before the 1938-D production began, or later after they decided that there would be no S’s?
Maybe someone will locate the answer --- but that would probably be in the Engraving Dept. die records which seem to have vanished.
The hoarders certainly snapped up a large portion of the Denver mintage anyway!
Good information and certainly helps to understand the proliferation of '38D's... and many were saved, which helps us to understand the availability of high grade Buffs from this year. Cheers, RickO
February 4 would be my guess.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
I had heard that another reason that Philly didn't want to do '38 nickels, is that if they issued a coin for circulation, then proofs could be requested by collectors. And this would add an additional burden of work - like the 1942 and 1942 War Nickels did.
They were already going to have to do proofs of the new Jefferson nickel. Could you imagine the embarrassment if someone had muled dies?
thefin - Haven't seen anything in mint files concerning worry about making 1938 proof Buffalo nickels.
Another informative "record". Now we know the rest of the story (or at least more of it)
An interesting suggestion on the Proofs, though I doubt that a mule was a serious concern. There have been several mid-year design changes, and the only technical mules were the Capped Bust half with the new reverse and the Liberty Seated half with the old reverse, and even they they are the correct designs, just the wrong hubs.
Other proof denominations were issued early in 1938, but no 5-cent until the fall. I really doubt there was any consideration to making a 1938 Buffalo proof - unless the entire Jefferson project failed. Customers were not required to purchase complete "sets" of proofs.
A similar low mintage/hoarding issue occurred in 1931 as follows-
From the “Numismatist” March, 1931
This was the entire mintage for the 1931-S Buffalo Nickel until December, 1931, when it was realized that nearly the entire issue would be hoarded because of the extremely low mintage.
So this was the remedy-
From the “Numismatist” February, 1932
Yep. The Mint Bureau recognized the effects of coin collecting at least as early as the 1870s. This was the reason for producing circulation coins that were otherwise unnecessary. (See Coin World article from a few years ago and the 1878 Director's Annual Report.)
The '38-Ds might have been hoarded, but at least I found one in a roll search a few years ago.
For all the gajillions of 1938-D nickels that have been graded (71,916 by PCGS, including overmintmarks), I was surprised to look at mintage figures today and find that the numbers were considerably less than for the two prior years at Denver.
1938-D: 7,020,000
1937-D: 17,826,000
1936-D: 24,814,000
1935-D: 12,092,000
1934-D: 7,480,000
From Coinfacts.
In contrast, MS graded numbers by our hosts are 7,866 for the 37-D, 4,558 for the 36-D, and even less for previous issues.
Many more 38-D were saved in roll quanties than for 37-D and before, so high grade examples are far more plentiful even though the mintage was significantly lower.
http://macrocoins.com
Treasury's competition for a new design was widely known, so there was extra incentive to hoard rolls of the last buffalo design. At just $2 a roll, a lot of people could afford to put some aside. Further, commercial demand for new nickels was not large.
There seems to be one pair of dies from the 1938-d run that produced beautiful proof-like examples. I always wondered if this maybe was a specially struck coin to commemorate the end of the buffalo production. Probably done without authorization but done none the less. Some of them are really incredible.
(I think that koynequest has one of these, I currently have two of them.) Very seldom seen and I also noticed the lack of au or au/unc pieces which would indicate these were not produced in a significant numbers and released into circulation.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
So this letter is to the superintendent of the San Francisco mint. Maybe, just as in 1913 with the liberty head nickel,
A few 1938-s nickels were struck, say maybe half a dozen or so, and will some day show up as the greatest buffalo nickel rarity on earth. If the dies were there, always the possibility of some monkey business going on during the third shift!
I think this is rather doubtful since 1938 is more that a few years ago but you could not say it is impossible.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
This thread needs a picture!
"She comes out of the sun in a silk dress,
running like a water color in the rain...."
Yes-as Tom says, I have two '38-D PL, too.
Here is an image of my slabbed (MS65) PL '38-D. I also have a raw one.
Wow, were any of the Philly dies sent to Denver as well? Surprised a few without mintmarks did not slip through
In reading the letter again at atop this post it just seems that the situation for monkey business at the San Francisco mint was so very ripe for the picking. If someone had decided to use a pair of dies to make a number of 38-s buffs, I wonder how
difficult this would have been. Maybe not hard at all. There are a lot of au and xf/au lustrous 38d buffs floating around and I have never see a high grade circulated one from this die pair. Which makes me think that the few which were struck were kept by the strikers as special mementos.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
They were just coins. A few might have been paid out by the Denver Cashier to employees in their pay packets and on casual exchange.
1938 Buffalo dies went to all three mints. Only Denver had begun production when the decision was made to make a design change via a competition. It was decided to keep all nickel manufacturing of that design only at Denver. That is reason for the admonition in the letter.
People working at the Mint were not stupid louts who disregarded orders and wandered about with dies in their overall pockets. Only the Coiner had access to dies and only the die setter could install/remove them. Every die was signed out and back in by the die setter and coining room foreman, and this was attested to by the Coiner. Any discrepancy - dies, metal, scrap, etc. - meant the entire department remained at their stations until the problem was resolved.
I had always thought that 38d buffs were struck to make the series conform to the law the they had to be struck for 25 years before being replaced. I learned a lot here.
thanks to all
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
"People working at the Mint were not stupid louts who disregarded orders and wandered about with dies in their overall pockets. Only the Coiner had access to dies and only the die setter could install/remove them. Every die was signed out and back in by the die setter and coining room foreman, and this was attested to by the Coiner. Any discrepancy - dies, metal, scrap, etc. - meant the entire department remained at their stations until the problem was resolved”
Well, I guess this does not apply to the individuals who "minted” the 1913 liberty head nickel.
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
Unfortunately, we know nothing at all about circumstances involving 1913 Liberty nickels. We have evidence about where dies were kept in late 1912/early 1913, and when the new design was adopted, and approximately when the old Liberty dies and hubs were destroyed. But absent Engraving Department and Coinage Department records, we know nothing. Even Brown's connection is unknown prior to his display of the coins and his ads.
PS: The Buffalo nickel design was officially adopted in December 1912. That's when the 25-year clock started ticking. (Details and source materials are in Renaissance of American Coinage 1909-1915.)
RogerB, Always enjoy your writings.
I remember in the mid-late 60's getting XF/AU 1938-D's in change.
That is really cool
PPS: Change to Barber's awful Liberty on subsidiary silver was approved in 1891. Hence, the 25-year replacement clock started then and not 1892.
Hey, a lot of us love the Barber coins.
Yeah, I know....But she's still awful "homely."
She's beautiful compared to Susan B.
True --- But Liberty is supposed to be "idealized" not "composted."
what an absolute monster!!
as nice as a proof!
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"