Those crackle toners showed up maybe 15-20 years ago (rough estimate) and I would see them in every TPG's holders. I thought they were legit for a while, until I was convinced otherwise by dealers wiser than myself.
Honestly, I thought they were quite attractive. I had to train my eye to see those as AT. But they are. No question.
I mainly saw them on BTW and Washington-Carver commems, and perhaps a few Walking 50c.
After saying all that, there is very similar, 100% real toning that mimics the AT crackle toning. It is found on some double mint set toners from the 1950's, as well as 1921 P-D-S Morgan dollars and some end roll toned Roosevelt dimes, 25c and possibly 50c. Those are 100% legit, as I have seen and "harvested" those myself over the years from non-numismatic sources.
Dave Wnuck. Redbook contributor; long time PNG Member; listed on the PCGS Board of Experts. PM me with your email address to receive my e-newsletter, and visit DaveWcoins.com Find me on eBay at davewcoins
I should add -- about the only difference I saw between the "legit" toners and the "fake toners" on these were -- the fakes had what I call "Christmas colors" -- greens, blues, reds, etc mixed in, whereas the legit ones did not, or they had very few of those shades, and less vibrant.
Dave Wnuck. Redbook contributor; long time PNG Member; listed on the PCGS Board of Experts. PM me with your email address to receive my e-newsletter, and visit DaveWcoins.com Find me on eBay at davewcoins
@DaveWcoins said:
I should add -- about the only difference I saw between the "legit" toners and the "fake toners" on these were -- the fakes had what I call "Christmas colors" -- greens, blues, reds, etc mixed in, whereas the legit ones did not, or they had very few of those shades, and less vibrant.
That would make Insider2 100% incorrect. Yours is the same point that I made. It is the colors and not the crackle that determine AT on these coins. The takeaway from this thread should NOT be that all crackle toning is AT.
Some refer to overgraded slabs as Coffins. I like to think of them as Happy Coins.
Going waay back in HA archives to find them doesn't seem to work, the pictures from that far back leave much to be desired. Haven't found any that show the crackle effect well, but did find a few with pretty obvious AT colors. Maybe somebody can fix these links. I am puter illiterate.
@Ronyahski said: "You keep contradicting yourself. Come back when you actually have a picture of a BLOCKY coin."
MY FAULT@Ronyahski is correct as I DID CONTRADICT MYSELF! I'll write more later.
While I lay in bed last night it hit me. Today I looked at my first post: "A long time ago, commemorative coins started to appear in the market with is type of blocky toning." Later I described what this pattern looked like and wrote there was not an example posted! That's the contradiction.
The coin in the OP is 100% AT. These alterations came out long ago. The "puke tan" color is one of the pastels seen but this PATTERN is not "blocky" although it did occur at the same time and often in combination with the blocky pattern. This pattern is not as pretty either.
I will try to find an AT coin with the blocky pattern. I don't have one in the teaching set because those AT coins were very expensive at the time!
@DaveWcoins said:
I should add -- about the only difference I saw between the "legit" toners and the "fake toners" on these were -- the fakes had what I call "Christmas colors" -- greens, blues, reds, etc mixed in, whereas the legit ones did not, or they had very few of those shades, and less vibrant.
That would make Insider2 100% incorrect. Yours is the same point that I made. It is the colors and not the crackle that determine AT on these coins. The takeaway from this thread should NOT be that all crackle toning is AT.
Crackle toning is not the same as "blocky" toning although the multi colors are similar. In florescent light the "blocky" AT commemoratives had touching panels of pastel light blue, pale green, PINK, and the puke tan in the OP. The blocks were liked packed rice grains resembling tiny rectangles.
Comments
Aren't you glad you are not conducting a class @Insider2 ? Thank you for your time sharing your expertise free of charge
Insider2 is 100% correct, in my opinion.
Those crackle toners showed up maybe 15-20 years ago (rough estimate) and I would see them in every TPG's holders. I thought they were legit for a while, until I was convinced otherwise by dealers wiser than myself.
Honestly, I thought they were quite attractive. I had to train my eye to see those as AT. But they are. No question.
I mainly saw them on BTW and Washington-Carver commems, and perhaps a few Walking 50c.
After saying all that, there is very similar, 100% real toning that mimics the AT crackle toning. It is found on some double mint set toners from the 1950's, as well as 1921 P-D-S Morgan dollars and some end roll toned Roosevelt dimes, 25c and possibly 50c. Those are 100% legit, as I have seen and "harvested" those myself over the years from non-numismatic sources.
I should add -- about the only difference I saw between the "legit" toners and the "fake toners" on these were -- the fakes had what I call "Christmas colors" -- greens, blues, reds, etc mixed in, whereas the legit ones did not, or they had very few of those shades, and less vibrant.
That would make Insider2 100% incorrect. Yours is the same point that I made. It is the colors and not the crackle that determine AT on these coins. The takeaway from this thread should NOT be that all crackle toning is AT.
Going waay back in HA archives to find them doesn't seem to work, the pictures from that far back leave much to be desired. Haven't found any that show the crackle effect well, but did find a few with pretty obvious AT colors. Maybe somebody can fix these links. I am puter illiterate.
http://https://coins.ha.com/itm/commemorative-silver/classic-commemoratives/1947-50c-booker-t-washington-pds-set-ms-65-ngc-all-the-coins-exhibit-lustrous-surfaces-beneath-even-multicolored-toning-sche/a/212-6907.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515#
https://coins.ha.com/itm/commemorative-silver/classic-commemoratives/1952-50c-washington-carver-ms65-ngc-deep-original-toning-blankets-each-side-of-this-eye-appealing-gem-purple-red-gray-a/a/318-7784.s?ic4=ListView-ShortDescription-071515
@Ronyahski said: "You keep contradicting yourself. Come back when you actually have a picture of a BLOCKY coin."
MY FAULT @Ronyahski is correct as I DID CONTRADICT MYSELF!
I'll write more later.
While I lay in bed last night it hit me. Today I looked at my first post: "A long time ago, commemorative coins started to appear in the market with is type of blocky toning." Later I described what this pattern looked like and wrote there was not an example posted! That's the contradiction.
The coin in the OP is 100% AT. These alterations came out long ago. The "puke tan" color is one of the pastels seen but this PATTERN is not "blocky" although it did occur at the same time and often in combination with the blocky pattern. This pattern is not as pretty either.
I will try to find an AT coin with the blocky pattern. I don't have one in the teaching set because those AT coins were very expensive at the time!
Crackle toning is not the same as "blocky" toning although the multi colors are similar. In florescent light the "blocky" AT commemoratives had touching panels of pastel light blue, pale green, PINK, and the puke tan in the OP. The blocks were liked packed rice grains resembling tiny rectangles.
Just did an internet check...not anything close. Now, 90% of the toned coins have peripheral toning.
We threw out virtually all of our old auction cats I'll bet a search from the 1988- 1994 period would produce many examples.
Yep it is hard to believe we don't have a good example to show! There were so many around at one time. Where did they all go?
I just know I now have one more thing to search for at FUN!!