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Please Direct general questions to the Q&A forum
Aspie_Rocco
Posts: 3,872 ✭✭✭✭✭
There is an excessive amount of new members and trolls posting questions about random coins, usually circulated junk.
Specific threads about pre researched varieties and errors are a different subject and are not the topic of this thread.
I feel like we should be directing all the novice and troll posts to the Q&A forum. It may be slow there but why do we control feed trolls and or answer novice questions posted to the wrong forum.
Maybe the excessive junk coin question threads could be moved to the Q&A.
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People new to coin collecting must start somewhere... and with all the complaints about the hobby dying, no new collectors etc., it would be a good idea not to discourage these new members...Harsh responses, or unnecessary sarcasm drives people away and destroys their interest in coins. If we truly want the hobby to grow, it is best to respond to these new collectors with guidance - a respectful answer to their question, direct them to online resources, books and shows/shops for help. If the question is unclear, respond with advice on how to post inquiries. Yes, it can be frustrating when a new person does not accept the answer that is obvious to experienced collectors. Parents do not like to be told their children are ugly either. A little patience and polite treatment can encourage their interest in coins.
Cheers, RickO
Not only do new collectors have to start somewhere, but established collectors with experience have to ...STAY ...somewhere.
There's no question (to me) that a profusion of posts and pix of junk coins is making me far less likely to come here for discussion.
I agree with Aspie on this in a big way.
If one knows nothing about coins and is seeking information to figure out what they have or want to start with, they should not be bothered if their posts were moved to Q&A.
It does not bother me. These people need advice and help plus feel this is the expert place to go.
At a show I regularly set up at a woman has probably five 8’ tables of collector coins in 2 by 2 in vinyl pages in binders stacked. Many coins in $5 - $10 range world, US coins, saw lots of Ike’s, PF sets, Anthony’s, pres dollars, couple junk boxes, etc. It’s definitely a no CAC zone lol. There may be a couple bullion slabbed gold coins. Her tables packed with customers. One dealer told me she did $5000 at a recent show. Some would call this widgets but in my view it all adds up.
At the same show had got fantastic buy from the bourse chairman, wholesaled a nice coin to a dealer friend whose table next to mine, then this young lady about 20 came up interest in a NGC 69 silver panda I had at $35. She showed me she had only $10 in her wallet. I told her “MS I don’t want your last $10 but here is a nice slabbed coin (an ICG state quarter clad ICG PR79 - CU MV $50 I had $6 in an eBay win).
I'm outvoted.
Post a chopped up and damaged thing you just found to celebrate
Ask questions about US coins on the US coin forum. Once a good answer is provided don't keep feeding the post. and it will eventually get lost in the shuffle.
Governments can print currency. Only the people can print faith in it — and they’re running low on ink.
Agree! LOL at the latecomers who just parrot a correct answer. We have an agree button.
PS To answer the OP...they are mostly NEW members. I should post my "parking lot find" on the U.S. Forum also. :)You get more responses.
On some sites the moderators move these type of posts to the correct forum.
EDIT: And I'm remined of one long-time member who accused a new member (When she first joined she explained she knew nothing but has begun to love coins and search change) of being a troll! I suggested that she call him out but she is too nice. Too Bad, as I would have enjoyed reading his apology.
I came across a lad who had just found a rucked up coin on the sidewalk.
He asked me what had happened to it.
I told him go to the PCGS US coin forum and post a picture of it.
He asked what PCGS was.
I thrashed him soundly knowing that he would find it and probably end up submitting it to PCGS to know exactly what it was.
He thanked me and stole my hubcaps.
And then he found another coin in the gutter.
I didn't know what had happened to either coin but knew he would do his due diligence in pursuit of his education.
Honest. True incident. As I recall.
You need to move.
At the expense of beating a dead horse (who has that graphic??), I think the real issue is the attitude of some of the new posters. No one can begrudge them for being new and inexperienced - we all were at some point - but it is the defiance and combativeness of some of them that gets old real fast. They don't come here for opinions, but rather to have their fantasies validated.
Then there are the ones who post the same type of "error" over and over, ignoring previous advice.
While I am at it, another pet peeve of mine is new members who obviously do not read the forum - they just post a thread and only read the responses to their own question. If they took some time to follow the forum for a while they would learn so much.
As an example, a few weeks ago I posted a quarter that I was sure was PMD but the discoloration was such that it gave me momentary second thoughts that it might be an exposed copper error. The experts confirmed that it was PMD, and a week later a new member posted a coin that could have been the twin brother to my quarter. They obviously had not read the earlier post.
I am reminded of PF's gold giveaway a few months ago when there were a number of new members posting pictures of "double dies" and such, and almost none of them entered the contest. They were not reading the forum, only posting questions and not paying attention to anything else.
I am going to make an early New Year's Resolution. Despite my inclination to share my knowledge and experience with new collectors, I will no longer attempt to engage anyone who does not seem receptive to information or advice from forum members.
Always a good idea in a dying hobby to discourage newbies.
It is always a great idea to encouraged new collectors, but some people who have tried to help are getting understandably discouraged by the reception they are getting.
I didn't see any posts by you on the most recent spate of newbie threads, so please step up to the plate and do your part.
I am confident that you can help guide these new collectors so please don't hesitate to do so. 
I didn't realize that this was a requirement of board membership to have to post on every thread, even those that have zero interest to me. Is there an "Olde Timer's Guide to Board Posting" you can direct me to?
There is a pervasive problem of trolls posting endless questions in The US coin forum. Plain. Simple trolling. Sadly, their posting M.O. is to mimic novice posters in their questions. It is difficult at times to identify some newbie from an idiot or troll. Why continue to allow this?
It is miscategorized threads by the dozens!
I am not advocating “throwing the baby out with the bath water” or ignoring new posters with questions but there IS A Q&A FORUM.
I have a new interest in Meiji Japanese coins and have a thirst for knowledge, but I am not posting threads in the US coin section. I post where it belongs, in World coins.
If the many helpful members frequented the Q&A it might be more responsive and active there.
Clogging the US forum is not cool, it is in my opinion, being flooded with ridiculous questions, DAILY.
I try to be helpful and supportive with new members. I message them personally with links and photos sometimes, and or post to their threads. When I see them continue to post garbage it is frustrating and makes me believe they are intentionally trolling or disrupting the forum with guerrilla tactics. Eroding interest of more serious posters. Wasting the time of serious collectors.
Pardon the shouting
HAS NO ONE ELSE NOTICED THE AVATAR CHOICES OF THE TROLLS? Sort of consistent most of the time.
I am to the point where I am ready to start ignoring some new members out of frustration with constant garbage posts.
Please can we try to make a positive change and control the trolls. They are ruining the experience for serious people with honest questions.
Roccout
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
Does he rotate tires too?
There is, of course no such requirement. But when others try to do a good thing by helping out the newbies only to end up getting frustrated and discouraged, your only input is sarcasm aimed at those who tried to help?
Hmmm. I don't know what to say....
You control them by ignoring them or by helping them learn. Don't agree that they are trolls as much as they are a nuisance to some.
In Internet slang, a troll is a person who starts quarrels or upsets people on the Internet to distract and sow discord by posting inflammatory and digressive, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the intent of provoking readers .
I'm sure most of the experienced collectors started out with "dumb" questions. Good chance some of those asking such questions will eventually become experienced collectors. Not likely without guidance from the experienced crowd.
Governments can print currency. Only the people can print faith in it — and they’re running low on ink.
Hey @Aspie_Rocco I see what you see but all I do is choose not post to those threads.
Not everyone knows when they're being worked.
There are new potential members who will come along. You can tell who they are by their second reply to a thread.
The trolls are so obvious with their replies I'm surprised folks don't get it.
Over
"Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working" Pablo Picasso
No comments other than to add to my post counts & to “contribute” to a bud’s thread
I think there are a few posters on here who feel that by answering a newbie question, said newbie is expected to kiss their ring. Why get frustrated by answering a question - either the OP will take the advice or not. So what. If your feelings get hurt by not getting the response you want, maybe don't post to those threads.
As for trolls, you can still learn something from those posts. Maybe nothing earth shattering, but maybe someone will point out a die marker that few knew about or some other piece of knowledge.
I am a "NEWBIE". I am glad this topic got started. I made my first post a couple weeks ago and I posted it on the Q & A Forum because I thought it was a question. They graciously answered my question and told me that I should post my questions on the US Coin Forum. I am 60 years old and always wanted to collect coins but never had the time. Now I do. I did get the unhappy post twice from one of your experts telling me basically I should do more research myself. I do research a lot and read even more but you know by getting a late start I thought if I couldn't find the answer I would not waste time and ask you guys. I don't mind the unhappy responses I just feel if they did not want to bother reading it then don't bother answering it!!
I will definitely stick around because this is something I always wanted to do. And I am sure I will ask some more ignorant questions but you guys have a new member whether you like it or not in what could be a dying hobby (hopefully not in my life time).
Thanks for the help and thanks for the future help as well
DiggerJim
BST transactions - mach1ne - Ronyahski - pitboss (x2) - Bigbuck1975 (x2) - jimineez1 - nk1nk - bidask - WaterSport - logger7 - SurfinxHI (x2) - Smittys - Bennybravo - Proofcollector - Splitaces (x4) - onlyrooosies
I sometimes ignore posts that defy logic or gives me a weird feeling. Just saying. Peace Roy
BST: endeavor1967, synchr, kliao, Outhaul, Donttellthewife, U1Chicago, ajaan, mCarney1173, SurfinHi, MWallace, Sandman70gt, mustanggt, Pittstate03, Lazybones, Walkerguy21D, coinandcurrency242 , thebigeng, Collectorcoins, JimTyler, USMarine6, Elkevvo, Coll3ctor, Yorkshireman, CUKevin, ranshdow, CoinHunter4, bennybravo, Centsearcher, braddick, Windycity, ZoidMeister, mirabela, JJM, RichURich, Bullsitter, jmski52, LukeMarshall, coinsarefun, MichaelDixon, NickPatton, ProfLiz, Twobitcollector,Jesbroken oih82w8, DCW
If there is an "Old Timer's Guide" you are one of the ANCIENT members who would know about it!
You make an excellent group of points, yet the fact remains that many threads are miscategorized and should not be in this forum. Again I point out that there IS a difference between the trolls and the newbies, and again their multitudes of posts are in the wrong place, causing discord.
I feel like you are missing the point of this thread, and just condemning the frustrations of those who have repeatedly tried to help or been worked by a troll.
Whether or not you recognize it, there is a clear difference between a newbie and a troll.
In this thread the term troll is applied to the posters of fabricated questions, with no real desire to learn. There is a pattern to the way they ask pointless questions about garbage Coins and it is entirely different than an honest person with an honest question.
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
I don't believe I "personally" have asked any pointless questions about garbage coins. But being a newbie I guarantee you I don't have any "Extremely Rare or Highly Valuable Coins" YET!!! And if you call asking questions about Modern day Pennies, Nickels, Dimes and Quarters garbage coins then so be it. I have to start somewhere.
BST transactions - mach1ne - Ronyahski - pitboss (x2) - Bigbuck1975 (x2) - jimineez1 - nk1nk - bidask - WaterSport - logger7 - SurfinxHI (x2) - Smittys - Bennybravo - Proofcollector - Splitaces (x4) - onlyrooosies
@DiggerJim You will fit perfectly right in this forum, IMHO.
You, sir, are good
I am not referencing you at all in this thread except as a “newbie”
You do have a generic avatar of the theme common to some trolls, but it is not required to select a custom or personalized avatar, and your current choice of avatar is totally acceptable.
I would post examples of the problem behaviors I see, but it is against the rules to “attack” people in such a way, and I do not feel comfortable putting suspected trolls on public blast.
I hope that any new members reading this thread realize I am not complaining about them, my stance is against the trolls. If you are a new user, I would recommend the Q&A for most general questions.
I will make an effort to try to help with questions in the Q&A, and check there more often.
Best wishes to all (except trolls)
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
It...seems... like some progress is being made.
Excellent understanding by some of what is referred to as "trolls."
The initial posts usually are a good "tell."
Let's hope the ones who post with no real desire to ask a question can get the message.
Viva Newbies, .................Muera Trolls.
Here's a Muera Huerta Peso for genuine curious newbies.
And the info on it. It can also be Googled.
Revolution Muera Huerta Peso 1914, KM621, struck in Durango at the city of Cuencame.
Death to the feared General Huerta of the Federal army is what this coin states.
Minted in the turbulent year of 1914 the coin orders the death of Victoriano Huerta who had,
through a military coup, usurped the Mexican Presidency from Francisco Madero and
had him summarily executed the previous year.
This act brought the revolutionary armies of Villa, Obregon, Carranza and Zapata against Huerta
under the Plan of Guadalupe.
Villa’s hatred of Huerta had actually begun much earlier when he had been placed in
Huerta’s army by Francisco Madero as an honorary colonel during the suppression of
Pascual Orozco’s revolt of 1912.
Seen as an overly ambitious competitor and loose cannon, Huerta had Villa jailed and
scheduled for the firing squad for insubordination and horse thievery.
Only the intervention of Madero saved Villa, but the hatred between the two men had
been made plain. Further exacerbating this personal hatred was the murder of Villa’s
political mentor Abraham Gonzalez by Huerta’s forces in March of 1913.
Thus for the coinage distributed to the areas under his control Villa chose a direct
and plain call to arms: “Death to Huerta”.
Appalled by such a personal affront Huerta made it punishable by death to possess
one of these Pesos.
After a string of military losses culminating in the Battle of Zacatecas,
General Huerta was forced to resign the presidency and went into exile,
dying in U.S. custody in 1916.
I would like to use the ignore setting more, but I only have one member so marked (thus far). That is because I think the limit is 5 and I want to save the remaining in case I truly need to avoid unpleasant personalities. Trolls usually burn themselves out.
I think the OP has a good point, but for me, I just don't open up the kinds of threads that would waste my time.
"She comes out of the sun in a silk dress,
running like a water color in the rain...."
@topstuf
Thanks for the history lesson. The reference to Poncho Villa reminded me of my visits to Columbus, NM. Interesting.
@DiggerJim
Welcome to the hobby. Stick around and in no time you’ll be counting reeds and collecting things you never knew existed.
This thread has disturbing undertones of numismatic profiling and segregation. Like any thread out there, I can choose to simply not "participate" in it.
Do they not have the desire to learn or are they so far out of their depth / knowledge that follow on questions seem absurd to someone who has been in the hobby for decades? It seems like a few people who answer have the attitude of "I gave you the answer, why do you have more questions?".
Well Gentlemen, thanks for the support and the urge to continue learning this hobby you all know and obviously love so much. I promise to try to come to the table with acceptable questions but I still only have about 4 months of experience compared to the decades that most of you have. I have nothing but respect for the Collectors Universe site and all of you.
For me that's enough said.....
Thanks
DiggerJim
P.S. I will try to come up with an acceptable avatar soon.
BST transactions - mach1ne - Ronyahski - pitboss (x2) - Bigbuck1975 (x2) - jimineez1 - nk1nk - bidask - WaterSport - logger7 - SurfinxHI (x2) - Smittys - Bennybravo - Proofcollector - Splitaces (x4) - onlyrooosies
@DiggerJim - Don't go afoul of the self appointed forum police
I don’t mind the newbie posts. This forum isn’t super high traffic to miss things for me and we need new blood.
I am not sure who was the one who suggested you repost to the US Coins forum, but I do that frequently if I see an honest question that I think will get more expert answers on the US Coin forum. The Q&A forum does not get the traffic the US Coin forum gets, and sometimes that is a good place for a basic question, but sometimes the issue begs for more attention.
For @JBK
The best Qa question is one first time poster who asked where do I get a 1961 D nickel
professionaly appraised.
Always wonder about these new types that register 2 months before first posts. Why register if you dont have anything to say then?
LOL, you are making me wet my pants! Bye, see ya, dovidenja, ha det, tam beit, adios, and....aloha! :'( :'( :'( :'( :'(
@DiggerJim Hi Jim, In my opinion the questions are not the problem. The "newbies" will have questions that seen childish to the pros that have been doing this for decades, but that's okay. How else will a "newbie" learn. What I found the problem to be is the response by the newbie that follows the expert replies. An example is when a "newbie" comes back and basically tells all the experts that they're wrong and they have no idea what they are talking about. They do this by disagreeing with what was said and insisting that in hand it looks different or they say something like, "The coin shop I took it to said it was an error and that I should submit it to have it authenticated". When you have 10 people that have been doing this for years telling you it's PMD (Post Mint Damage), please move on and ask your next question. Please don't argue with what you're being told by the experts unless you have facts or clear photos showing why you disagree.
Happy Collecting. Donato
Donato's Complete US Type Set ---- Donato's Dansco 7070 Modified Type Set ---- Donato's Basic U.S. Coin Design Set
Successful transactions: Shrub68 (Jim), MWallace (Mike)
Do the moderators have the ability to do IP traces? It would seem to me that a few well placed IP traces would identify many “alt” profiles and trolls, or users who have multiple accounts they post from.
Is an IP trace still a thing? Is it legal? I am not so tech savvy as to know, but I remember talk of IP trace in forums in 2000-2006 era.
I do not quite know if I understand your post. I do know that my intention is not to profile or segregate members. I find that concept ridiculous. I have been profiled and “segregated” a few times in my life and would not inflict that on anyone excepting an enemy combatant or a Troll.
If you consider the desire of placing topics in their appropriate designated area “segregation” then so be it!
“Segregation...the action or state of setting someone or something apart from other people or things or being set apart.”
"the segregation of pupils with learning difficulties"
_ you struck a nerve with the segregation word. This is just one way I have been segregated, and I will not disclose other ways, I was placed in “special education “ classes until high school because I am high functioning autistic, and was not good with comprehension of some subjects, while accelerating beyond college level in other areas, I learned to fight young because I would not tolerate teasing, and I lack some social skills that I cannot just learn. Perhaps it was better that I was segregated and not in every normal class with my peers as I had many “dumb” questions. Or maybe I missed out because I was segregated. But members here are NOT banished to only one forum. There is no segregation here except of subject matter. In the situation of too many questions in the US COIN forum, I do believe most of the basic questions should be properly categorized or moved to the proper area _
“Segregation...the enforced separation of different racial groups in a country, community, or establishment.
"an official policy of racial segregation"
GENETICS
the separation of pairs of alleles at meiosis and their independent transmission via separate gametes.
plural noun: segregations”
Definition from google.
It really is disheartening to see some of the responses here, as though some feel the need to take up arms and be a social justice warrior, rushing to the defense of trolls abusing the forum.
I have no quarrel or issue with newbies, novices, or those unfamiliar to the hobby.
I think the horse has been beaten long past death, I have clearly and repeatedly explained the intent of this thread, calling attention to MISCATEGORIZED threads while also pointing out the obvious trolling issue. Still, somehow people find a way to take offense and make statements like yours. I appreciate the point that you are posting “disagreeing” opinion, yet also feel that such actions feed the troll or trolls.
I do not claim to be an expert or even qualified to answer the questions of newbies, but I do have enough years of basic experience that I try to help in areas I have confidence. ANY member who has answered questions and returned later to a thread they tried to help, should have a basic idea of who is a troll, who is serious, and who is not a troll but does not accept an answer. Any member who attempts to help often enough will notice the patterns of trolls and defiant serious folks.
Well said @JBK
You have “hit the nail on the head” many times in this thread. Thank you for the well written posts.
This is about people who repeatedly post trying to help. I may have missed a few but I do not recall seeing @3stars posting dozens of helpful answers in the multitudes of miscategorized question threads. I may be mistaken and I will check the user history to see if I am wrong, but I honestly do not recognize this username as someone frequently answering questions of the new user threads.
Wow I have devoted entirely too much time trying to explain to folks there is a category problem and a troll problem.
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
Maybe you spend too much time trying to create non-existent forum rules. Unless your name is Heather, what you want people to do is irrelevant. If you don't like a post or its outcome, move on. No requirement to have to answer any / every question that comes up. I don't answer the questions because I am aware of my knowledge limitations and realize that there other way more qualified board members who can provide much more (correct) insight than I ever could.
Do you feel qualified to defend the abuse of this forum?
You are way off base. I am not creating any rules. The rules are already there. The topics are already there. Seems like you are just instigating. Maybe you should stop criticizing those who are trying to improve the forum and help others. You do not seem to comprehend this topic. At all. Why keep fighting for the rights of trolls and miscategorized posts? Do you have skin in the game? Those are rhetorica questions. I am done responding to you. Have a nice day
https://www.autismforums.com/media/albums/acrylic-colors-by-rocco.291/
No dis to your special segregation situation. I empathize. But this is asking newps (community groups by def) to move to a Q&A site for their "simple" questions, as they may be perceived (that I have not seen, but could'a missed) "trolls". Segregation?
Also, we have some VERY ASTUTE posters here that use simple avatars and are being Numismatically Profiled as something less. Cheers all --
Let's all just enjoy coins!!
Edited to fix whacky formatting
Not sure if we were all troll-ish once, because many of us came to the PCGS Coin Forum with some background in numismatics - but it's often hard to tell a troll from a total newbie. I'd rather err on the side of feeding a troll, rather than discouraging a potential future collector.
Check out my current listings: https://ebay.com/sch/khunt/m.html?_ipg=200&_sop=12&_rdc=1
It would appear you are in the minority with your point of view @Aspie_Rocco . (see ricko's post and agrees) If you are annoyed with the newbies, ignore them. They most likely won't adhere to your request anyway.
There is NOTHING wrong with the course you are taking in this Hobby. Nothing at all. Your willingness to learn is honorable. Stick around here. Most newer collectors (and some older one too) have to endure a little adjustment to this place.
If you want to learn, this is the place.
Pete
Welcome @DiggerJim
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
Your questions are welcome here.
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