1909-S VDB - Toooooooo bad!!

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Windycity
Windycity Posts: 3,603 ✭✭✭✭✭
in U.S. Coin Forum

Two coins - both tragic...

First is a 1909-S with an added VDB and the second is a 1909-S VDB with reverse graffiti (whoever "RH" was made a big mistake carving initials on this coin!!). Never had an added VDB before.

Added VDB Coin


1909-S VDB Graffiti


<a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.mullencoins.com">Mullen Coins Website - Windycity Coin website

Comments

  • Hemispherical
    Hemispherical Posts: 9,370 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    The “RH” makes me sad. :( Now I will always wonder WHY that was done, a self applied diagnostic. :s

  • ricko
    ricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Too bad... I wonder if the 'engraver' even realized what they had....Cheers, RickO

  • lkenefic
    lkenefic Posts: 9,518 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Yikes.... greed and stupidity. ..

    Collecting: Dansco 7070; Middle Date Large Cents (VF-AU); Box of 20;

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  • Namvet69
    Namvet69 Posts: 9,423 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Graffiti, geezo! So the added vdb is an electroplate buildup of copper? Peace Roy

    BST: endeavor1967, synchr, kliao, Outhaul, Donttellthewife, U1Chicago, ajaan, mCarney1173, SurfinHi, MWallace, Sandman70gt, mustanggt, Pittstate03, Lazybones, Walkerguy21D, coinandcurrency242 , thebigeng, Collectorcoins, JimTyler, USMarine6, Elkevvo, Coll3ctor, Yorkshireman, CUKevin, ranshdow, CoinHunter4, bennybravo, Centsearcher, braddick, Windycity, ZoidMeister, mirabela, JJM, RichURich, Bullsitter, jmski52, LukeMarshall, coinsarefun, MichaelDixon, NickPatton, ProfLiz, Twobitcollector,Jesbroken oih82w8, DCW

  • PipestonePete
    PipestonePete Posts: 1,987 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 19, 2018 6:45PM
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    There is graffiti all over the fields on the obverse of that coin, as well. I can't tell for sure, but I think the engraver has written, in full, his first and last name to the right of Lincoln's portrait.

  • cameonut2011
    cameonut2011 Posts: 10,863 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @mustangmanbob said:
    My initials are RH. Maybe I should own that coin?

    Bob

    It worked for TDN and the Dexter specimen of the 1804 dollar (sort of - I guess he could add the T and N)... ;)

  • Omegaraptor
    Omegaraptor Posts: 541 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited November 20, 2018 12:04AM
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    A valuable coin that has been intentionally damaged makes me miffed (I recently bought a holed XF-AU details Japan 1870 10 Sen Deep Scales with a clipped planchet for melt, which will probably get its own thread) but I'm more miffed about the 1909-S cent. They HAD to take an original, eye-appealing 1909-S cent and turn it into an altered counterfeit.

    Reminds me of the time someone said they had an 1800 bust dollar. It was a VF with great surfaces, original circcam toning, and great eye appeal. They got it for $700ish. Why so cheap? Some idiot tried to change the last 0 into a 4. You know, when every known specimen of the 1804 dollar is well-documented and there's these things called die pairs...

    "You can't get just one gun." "You can't get just one tattoo." "You can't get just one 1796 Draped Bust Large Cent."

  • BuffaloIronTail
    BuffaloIronTail Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Windycity:

    I don't think that the V.D.B. was added to the first coin. It looks good to me, it's in the correct position, and the obverse is correct for a Die #4.

    My opinion for sure, but what convinces you it's added?. Anybody?

    Educate me.

    Pete

    "I tell them there's no problems.....only solutions" - John Lennon
  • bolivarshagnasty
    bolivarshagnasty Posts: 7,359 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Doesn't the middle dot look too close to the D as compared to the original with graffiti? Would also like to hear the added explanation.

  • Twobitcollector
    Twobitcollector Posts: 4,749 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    RH Richard Head better known as ..........

    Positive BST Transactions with:
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  • Hemispherical
    Hemispherical Posts: 9,370 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Starts with D.... :D

  • BuffaloIronTail
    BuffaloIronTail Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @bolivarshagnasty said:
    Doesn't the middle dot look too close to the D as compared to the original with graffiti? Would also like to hear the added explanation.

    It does. It is really my only concern. Everything else looks good. The obverse is a correct die #4. No need to add anything to the reverse.

    That is what stumps me.

    Pete

    "I tell them there's no problems.....only solutions" - John Lennon
  • mr1931S
    mr1931S Posts: 7,308 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Far as I know (not really that far) 1909-S without V.D.B. is unknown in obverse die #4. Having said that, the V.D.B. doesn't look right to me, too far left? and the period not centered between "D" and "B"?

    We must keep in mind that 1909 SVDB was not all that special a coin for the first decade or two of its existence. I once read a story of someone having a half bag (2500 coins) of them in 1919 and wanting 1-3/4 cents apiece for them.

    "Two things are infinite: human stupidity and the universe; and I'm not sure about the universe."
    -Albert Einstein-

    Mistakes are natural. But repeated mistakes without reflection are something else. That may be the “stupidity” he was referring to. In research, he admitted uncertainty openly. “If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it?” This shows humility. Even a Nobel laureate accepted doubt. That humility makes the quote less cynical and more observational.

  • Outhaul
    Outhaul Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Great hole-filler for a novice.

  • 3keepSECRETif2rDEAD
    3keepSECRETif2rDEAD Posts: 4,285 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    ...maybe the ex wife left him with a reminder of why things went south...Like Randy Newman says...”Rollin' down the Imperial Highway...With a big nasty RedHead at my side!” ;)

  • Windycity
    Windycity Posts: 3,603 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    NGC confirmed added mint mark.

    <a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.mullencoins.com">Mullen Coins Website - Windycity Coin website
  • BuffaloIronTail
    BuffaloIronTail Posts: 7,765 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Windycity said:
    NGC confirmed added mint mark.

    That's one of the best placements for an added mintmark that I've ever seen.

    Go figure.

    Pete

    "I tell them there's no problems.....only solutions" - John Lennon
  • morgansforever
    morgansforever Posts: 8,512 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    WOW! Can't believe that's an added MM. Another reason for me personally not to but raw keys.

    World coins FSHO Hundreds of successful BST transactions U.S. coins FSHO
  • Windycity
    Windycity Posts: 3,603 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Correction, NGC confirmed added VDB.

    <a target=new class=ftalternatingbarlinklarge href="http://www.mullencoins.com">Mullen Coins Website - Windycity Coin website
  • rhedden
    rhedden Posts: 6,650 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    My initials are also RH. Last name Hedden. There is nobody named Richard in my family history for some reason. :D

    By the way... don't let me get near your Lincolns. I "bean" them by scratching RH with a letter opener.

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