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Rejected proposal for use of slave labor at the New Orleans Mint

RogerBRogerB Posts: 8,852 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited September 26, 2018 10:31AM in U.S. Coin Forum

Here is the response of Treasury Secretary Thomas Ewing to a proposal from the New Orleans Mint Melter & Refiner to use slaves at the Mint. The original proposal is included in the PDF near the end of this thread.

Treasury Department

June 14, 1841

Joseph M. Kennedy, Esq.
Superintendent
Branch Mint at New Orleans

Sir,
Your letter of the 29th ulto. Enclosing a communication addressed to you by the Melter and Refiner of the Branch Mint at New Orleans in relation to the employment of slave labor in that establishment was duly received.

In reply I have only to say that the employment of slaves as workmen in the Mint is objectionable in many respects, and, cannot therefore, be sanctioned by the Department.

Very respectfully,
Your Obedient Servant
Thomas Ewing,
Secretary of the Treasury

[NARA RG 104 Entry 215 vol 02]

Comments

  • SmudgeSmudge Posts: 9,647 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Interesting. Thanks for your research.

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Very interesting....I am surprised that the question was raised at the time. Cheers, RickO

  • OldEastsideOldEastside Posts: 4,602 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Joseph Kennedy, interesting indeed, not sure if they differentiated the term Slave and Indentured Servitude back then, but there was a lot of immigrants from Ireland fleeing the Potato Famine in the 1840's many came as indentured servants to Boston and New Orleans, would like to see the original letter if ever found.

    Steve

    Promote the Hobby
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,496 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I will speculate that the objection was based upon the widespread repugnance of slavery in the North at the time, and not upon any question concerning the quality of the work them might do.

    Treasury Secretary Ewing had quite an interesting life:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomas_Ewing

    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • CascadeChrisCascadeChris Posts: 2,526 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ricko said:
    Very interesting....I am surprised that the question was raised at the time. Cheers, RickO

    The question has been around since the Continental Congress. Which is why the we got the Three-Fifths Compromise. The delegates couldn't come to a unanimous decision regarding the issue.

    The more you VAM..
  • RogerBRogerB Posts: 8,852 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 22, 2018 4:22PM

    Secretary Ewing was the great-great grandfather of J.R. Ewing, but nobody shot him....

    At the Dahlonega Mint the locals refused to own or work with slaves, even though mine owners often rented them during the winter months to dig gold. The NW part of Georgia was strongly anti-slavery and resisted the State of Georgia through out the Civil War.

  • HydrantHydrant Posts: 7,773 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 23, 2018 7:35AM

    Interesting.

  • RogerBRogerB Posts: 8,852 ✭✭✭✭✭

    OldEastside - Is the presscopy what you were looking for? The letter was discovered Friday afternoon and post-processed/transcribed Saturday.

  • dave700xdave700x Posts: 59 ✭✭✭

    Interesting piece of numismatic history. Thank you for sharing..

  • RegulatedRegulated Posts: 2,992 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I spent a little time thinking about this. I realized that the way I feel about my coins would have changed if I knew that slave labor had been used to make them.


    What is now proved was once only imagined. - William Blake
  • mustangmanbobmustangmanbob Posts: 1,890 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Regulated said:
    I spent a little time thinking about this. I realized that the way I feel about my coins would have changed if I knew that slave labor had been used to make them.

    A very difficult subject. Not just coins, but slave labor was used in building the White House, the Capitol Building, Wall Street and the Trinity Church in NYC, University of North Carolina, University of Virginia, etc.

    Europe is far more problematic, as basically Rome was slave labor, and who worked mining and much of the coining process.

    Even modern day issues have ethical problems. Data from Dachau on hypothermia has been extensively used by medical groups and governments on exposure, treatment, etc. even while noting the extreme ethical issues on how the data was collected.

  • WillieBoyd2WillieBoyd2 Posts: 5,234 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Using slave or prison labor at a mint would create enormous security problems.

    Guards would have to be hired to keep the prisoners from escaping.

    A basic rule of prison management is to keep inmates and cash separated to avoid corruption and aiding escapes.

    Can one imagine convicts working at the Bureau of Printing and Engraving making and handling currency?

    :)

    https://www.brianrxm.com
    The Mysterious Egyptian Magic Coin
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  • dpooledpoole Posts: 5,940 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Ewing found the proposal objectionable "in many respects," which does imply moral as well as practical reservations.

  • OldEastsideOldEastside Posts: 4,602 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 24, 2018 3:00AM

    @RogerB said:
    OldEastside - Is the presscopy what you were looking for? The letter was discovered Friday afternoon and post-processed/transcribed Saturday.

    Is this the original letter penned by Joseph Kennedy to Thomas Ewing regarding his request or the other way around,

    I'm not as good at researching as you, But I see T. Ewings sig on the letter, what I'd like to see is Joseph Kennedys proposal to T. Ewing if it could be found and is documented.

    Just curious

    Steve

    Promote the Hobby
  • dengadenga Posts: 922 ✭✭✭

    There is further information on this matter, to be found in RG 104, Entry 11, Box 29,
    of the Newman Portal. When the Kennedy letter was received by Treasury Secretary
    Ewing, it was forwarded to Mint Director Robert M. Patterson on June 9. The director
    replied on June 11, strongly condemning the proposal, and Ewing followed Patterson’s
    arguments in replying to Kennedy on June 14.

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,780 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 24, 2018 6:43AM

    Coin collector and former President John Q. Adams was a representative at this time; and if you follow his outspoken views on the slavery issue and how widespread that was; you can get a sense of the common view of the educated public.

  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,496 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @dpoole said:
    Ewing found the proposal objectionable "in many respects," which does imply moral as well as practical reservations.

    Agreed. It was repugnant to most free Americans.

    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • ashelandasheland Posts: 23,472 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Interesting thread.

  • BarndogBarndog Posts: 20,507 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @CaptHenway said:

    @dpoole said:
    Ewing found the proposal objectionable "in many respects," which does imply moral as well as practical reservations.

    Agreed. It was repugnant to most free Americans.

    and more so to the ones who weren't free!

  • RogerBRogerB Posts: 8,852 ✭✭✭✭✭

    OldEastside - I have not located the original letter from the NO Melter & Refiner. Superintendent Kennedy merely forwarded it.

  • dengadenga Posts: 922 ✭✭✭

    @RogerB said:
    OldEastside - I have not located the original letter from the NO Melter & Refiner. Superintendent Kennedy merely forwarded it.

    The letters have been found. They may be read on the Newman Portal at
    Record Group 104, Entry 216, Volume 5, pages 426–429. The suggestion
    was made by Melter & Refiner J.L. Riddell.

  • RogerBRogerB Posts: 8,852 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 25, 2018 2:08PM

    Thank you, Denga!

    The correspondence totals 8 pages, which seems a little long to post here except as a file attachment. If members wish, I will do that. I digitized E-216 vol 5 and have the original images.

  • PocketArtPocketArt Posts: 1,335 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Regulated said:
    I spent a little time thinking about this. I realized that the way I feel about my coins would have changed if I knew that slave labor had been used to make them.

    Shouldn't. My great, great, great Grandmother was a slave, and her daughter was taken in by a Christian home. She was a love child of a French plantation owner in Georgia, raised as a Cherokee so she wouldn't be treated like blacks. My Irish side drained much of the black swamp here in Ohio, and they were treated as slaves, and were paid a pittance for their service if they were lucky. How about the Chinese who were instrumental in constructing the transcontinental railroad? Forget about the indigenous cultures who existed here before colonization...we are all in a flux my friend. No present lenses should effect your collecting habits.

    We are all slaves in the end...pay your taxes! In the meantime...look, squirrel! :#

  • RogerBRogerB Posts: 8,852 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The 8 pages of correspondence are attached here in a low resolution version. Maybe a member would like to prepare an article for the Numismatist on this subject - there might be additional information hiding in plain sight.

  • BryceMBryceM Posts: 11,841 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 25, 2018 5:14PM

    Interesting topic and easily directed to a larger discussion about how we deal with historical actions that are objectionable by modern standards. The business of "righting old wrongs" gets immediately messy as individuals who were wronged are often long gone. What is the currency of restitution? Who pays it? Who gets it? History is largely written by the victorious and they have a way of glossing over unsavory details. This problem isn't unique to our time or our country. How do you "make up for" something as horrific as slavery, the wholesale displacement of Native Americans, or the Holocaust? Finally, and this is something we should all consider..... Each and every one of us would wither under public scrutiny of certain aspects of our lives.

    After mulling this around in my head for a while, the only thing that makes logical sense is to be willing to forgive others and "let it go", live my life the best I can, try to apologize for and correct my mistakes as I go, focus on today, learn from yesterday, and plan for tomorrow.

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