Suggestions for a widow?
erwindoc
Posts: 5,301 ✭✭✭✭✭
I had the opportunity to help out and look over a widow's collection that she inherited from her deceased husband recently. She has decided that she wants to sell it. I spend the better part of 2 hours going through box after box. Initially, it was quite fun, but then the repetition from the sheer volume became quite mundane. Most of the collection consisted of modern proof sets, state quarters, ATB quarters and other ultramodern stuff up until his death last year. I know that there is not tons of value in the collection, but it is quite vast in terms of the number of coins. What do you think would be the best option for my widow friend? I know that many of the local dealers will not be too interested in what she has.
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Have her or you write down all that she has and throw it on the BST and ask for honest offers.
Tough position and extremely time consuming to sell off. Most modern proof and mint sets are worth far less than what the mint charged initially and I'm sure you know that. The market is flooded with this material and prices are appropriately weak. Making a list and seeing what folks really want on the BST is a good option as it reduces the cost of selling (as apposed to ebay). Just making the list and being accurate will require much time. I'd charge for my time if I were the one making the list (and I would not trust the widow to do it for me).
bob
Get her a gift of a hammer and empty coin rolls. Teach her how to use both.
Now you know how dealers feel every day
I am going back later this week to look at the last two tubs. I keep holding on that there will be something other than modern stuff inside, but Im not holding my breath. Thanks for the advice and kinda what I was thinking too.
Make a fair offer to the lady, split it into lots and sell them on Ebay when you get bored.
Benevolence is a good thing.
You need at least a rough guesstimate of what's in it. If it really is large quantity, I would call Littleton.
Whatever number you come up with, realize there’s a real possibility she’ll think you’re trying to scam her. Sometimes this seems inevitable.
She has no interest, so maybe inventory and donate to charity. She could get good value as a tax deduction, and the coins would then find there way to collectors via the charity... everyone wins.
Too brutal. With all due respect, I don't find it humorous. She's a widow. Comfort and solace for her. E r w I n d o c, your heart is in the right place. Bless you.
Would maybe make sense if the deduction was at cost of the coins and hopefully her husband saved the paperwork that showed cost. Even then you're essentially selling them at about a fourth of their cost or maybe less.
Dealers see this all the time. My opinion is to take the great bulk of common, modern material and sell it in one lot to any local dealer who will give you 80% or so of Greysheet. Some folks might cry foul with this decision, but what is your time worth and how much might you squeeze out extra?
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Maybe check for toned, error coins?
A term I have learned to use a lot is "spending money." When I am pawing through such a collection, my time is going to be more valuable, most times, than anything contained in the collection. So I pick out all the circulated Ikes/Sacs/Prezzies, Bicentennial whatevers, clad Kennedys, hand them to the owner and say "these are spending money."
And I make it clear that I am buying the rest Below Wholesale so that I can sell it to another dealer for Wholesale (or below). That tends to reduce the "but why does my Red Book say this coin is worth this" mentality. And, I charge by the hour. If you accept my offer, there is no charge for my hourly rate. If you do not accept my offer, I charge XX/hour.
Kind regards,
George
Would not go the offer route unless she is really helpless and without heirs. Remember the cynical adage, "no good deed..." If she doesn't have seller's remorse at first, she might after talking to friends, and the chances of same are exponentially greater if she has heirs. "You sold dad's collection for WHAT?" Been there.
Have her pick out some representative items, 3 -4 modern proof sets, state quarters, etc. enough to fit in a small shoe box and let HER take it to a couple coin dealers and see what they will pay. It might help her to grasp what is really going on with the collection.
I would question donating to charity. The IRS is not stupid on values. THe great car scam of years ago, ie, donate you old car, running or not, get a BIG tax deduction, yielded $200 clunkers getting a $5000 tax write off. The IRS clamped down on it, and now the the value is capped at what the charity sells it for, unless it is discounted to a needy person, and that is after expenses of the charity. For example, if they sell it for $1800 but spend $600 on a new engine, your deduction is limited to $1200.
So if she donates $100 in face value of state quarters, assuming she is in the 25% tax bracket AND she can even itemize this year, the minimum "value" she would need would be $400 or by the roll, $40 a roll, and NO state quarter is anywhere near that. Most are $15 a roll or less RETAIL, so she would take a beating on a charitable donation.
There is extensive writing by the IRS, including specific reference to coin collections, in
https://www.irs.gov/publications/p561
Can be a dicey situation at best. No doubt most of what you described is not worth what may have been paid for it (except those collected from change). Best bet is to explain the situation, give her target estimates by grouping (i.e. mint sets, loose raw coins etc.) and then advise her to see what a coin shop or two might offer. Also, if there are heirs, advise her to consult with them too. Explain that your pricing is not an offer, but rather the best you think she may get on the market. This way, you cannot be accused of a rip off and she/they will find out your estimate is either better or likely about the same she will get elsewhere. Cheers, RickO
uh, Dennis1219,
RE:
She has no interest, so maybe inventory and donate to charity. She could get good value as a tax deduction, and the coins would then find there way to collectors via the charity... everyone wins.
Where'd you get this idea? Do you really think the modern junk that bored the OP is going to result in filing Sch. A under the recently enacted Tax reform? The widow will require professional appraisal if the value is 5K, value will likely be today's FMV for modern crap, and add steps if she's in community property state..
Pick out the 70’s and submit them for her. ( kidding )
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
If she has the paperwork from the original purchases she could sell and possibly be able to take a loss that could offset other gains or be carried forward to future years. Just a thought.
it's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide
If the will specifically left her the coins, original cost doesn't matter. At time of the inheritance inherited items get a new basis (cost) which is the market value at time of inheritance.
For this reason most inherited items that are quickly sold off do not normally see much of a gain or loss.
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
List everything on Ebay for her and take a 10% commission of net sales....start the auction at $0.99 no reserve...sounds like she just wants it gone and a few bucks...
I agree with this. Though if this material is really weak, I think 60% of Greysheet is more likely as they will probably hope to blow it out at 80%.
You would be doing a good deed to provide a written inventory of the whole collection she could bring or email to a dealer. I wouldn’t make an offer. As others have said, there’s no way for that to go well for you.
LIBERTY SEATED DIMES WITH MAJOR VARIETIES CIRCULATION STRIKES (1837-1891) digital album
I realize that, that's why I said possibly. Even if the will specified the coins were left to her what would be "market value"?, CDN bid?, CDN ask?, retail price in a Coin World ad?. There could still be a possibility for a tax loss. Also not exactly sure what would apply if the spouse passed away this tax year, although unlikely since it's only early January, and had no will?
it's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide
Also not exactly sure what would apply if the spouse passed away this tax year, although unlikely since it's only early January, and had no will?
As a spouse, "joint ownership."
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
This type of lot and situation is all too common. If it is nothing more than modern US Mint material check with local dealers and get an idea of % of gray sheet they offer. Whoever makes the best offer, assuming it is in any way reasonable, gets to buy the entire lot. Do not allow "pick and choose" ... strictly all or none. Trying to sell this lot piece by piece will grind up massive amounts of time and effort.
Buying this material was a mistake. Forget about what it cost her because she is going to lose money (unless bullion value bails her out). As a widow she need cash and not boxes full of recent US Mint material.
I handled a lot of this type for a co-workers widow many years back. I had very limited time to complete the sale as she was in poor health at the time. Bullion value bailed out much of the material and fortunately I had two active buyers, one for the numismatic coins and one for the bullion value "stuff". She passed away three months later but at least her teen age son got cash and not coins. (He had absolutely no interest in the coins.)
From what's been stated here in the past, you can't claim losses from hobby sales. You can use a loss to offset any gains from other sales, but I don't think that you could offset gains from say the sale of stocks.
Sounds like a lot of work for not much gain. Shipping costs would eat you alive.
Put it on Craigslist for 80% of sheet, payment to be made in small bills.
The coins have different values to different people so unless there specific rules in place, I see no reason why one couldn't use retail pricing from something like numismedia.com or even the Redbook.
This effectively fleeces the widow. After fees and shipping - and your 10% of net - there's no way this gets close to dealer wholesale or even face value
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
I don't get from the OP that she is financially strapped so even if she threw it in a dumpster she wouldn't be hurting. Sell it all as a yuge "grab bag" for a flat fee. If the purchase prices are avaialble, just divide them by a third or whatever makes sense. I've got some of that kind of stuff at nowhere near what she got stuck with and I cringe at the thought of trying to get rid of it. Regret buying it really.
Personally, I would recommend taking smallish lots to the local coin club(s) and let members offer on lots.
Lots of bad advice in this thread. Costs related to selling in small lots seem to be ignored by many posters. I'm not surprised at this as coin collectors tend to be a cheap lot who want every last cent when they sell ... but forget to calculate just how much time, effort and expense that involves.
Maybe show her a Dansco album and how she can fill it up with a series. And just think how many albums she could fill up. It would be fun for an old person to do. And then she would know why her husband collected them. To enjoy.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
Yes, yes. In my widow support group there must have been dozens if not hundreds of widows wanting to start type sets.
This is a market that should not be ignored.
The albums would cost more than the coins are worth.
Duh. And here I thought it was about having fun.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
You could always take them a skein of yarn, and some knitting needles and maybe some potting soil, and seeds. Or maybe find something else to otherwise keep them active and entertained. We can dance around this subject all day long. The people who have first dibs should capitalize on their counterpart's hobby. They just need a mentor. I think we should start them off on the right foot. Their late husbands obviously didn't , nor are we, as a group think tank, now. Are we ?
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5