@OnlyGoldIsMoney said:
When I can collect coins with estimated surviving populations of under 100 an issue with a surviving population of 225,000 pristine coins does not impress me as rare.
Sure, sure. True. But, that does ignore the 96-W dime, any modern ASE, the 70-D half, all of which have 100% survival rates in "pristine" condition.
I also don't think this is an appropriate comparison, but what would you say to a classic period coin with survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples?
Yes, many of us ignore those, too, preferring 180+ year old Real coins (not "made for collectors during our lifetime" ) that are R4, R5, R6 in Any condition.
Hell, this penny you're so excited about was made after some of the olives in my refrigerator!
I don't care about any of those myself. I think registry sets were brilliant marketing that created expensive coins with no real long term value by appealing to people's vanity. I don't care about any US coins except Buff Nickels and 18th century copper. And even those I don't really "collect". I don't even consider myself a coin collector. I just buy and sell. But there is a market for all of that and to deny it exists is silly.
And that's really my point: all of those things are as questionable in value as the 2017-S cent or, if you want to go glass half-full, all of those coins are as valuable as the 2017-S cent. Yet, the pricing doesn't reflect that similarity.
@jmlanzaf said: "I've made money on these sets. I continue to make money on these sets. I'm not pumping anything. If I were, I'd do it somewhere where there were far more eyeballs than this little board."
As a relatively new member here, I'd like to remind you that MANY OF THE BEST EYEBALLS IN THE COIN BUSINESS post on these boards. As I wrote before, you have started a very informative discussion; yet just know that age, years-in the business, etc. often mean absolutely nothing at least from what I have seen. I hope these sets become very profitable for you!
@OnlyGoldIsMoney said:
When I can collect coins with estimated surviving populations of under 100 an issue with a surviving population of 225,000 pristine coins does not impress me as rare.
Sure, sure. True. But, that does ignore the 96-W dime, any modern ASE, the 70-D half, all of which have 100% survival rates in "pristine" condition.
I also don't think this is an appropriate comparison, but what would you say to a classic period coin with survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples?
I would consider a classic period coin with a survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples to be common and not rare.
and yet CC dollars sell for several hundred dollars...
Commonly available coins selling for hundreds of dollars are still common.
@OnlyGoldIsMoney said:
When I can collect coins with estimated surviving populations of under 100 an issue with a surviving population of 225,000 pristine coins does not impress me as rare.
Sure, sure. True. But, that does ignore the 96-W dime, any modern ASE, the 70-D half, all of which have 100% survival rates in "pristine" condition.
I also don't think this is an appropriate comparison, but what would you say to a classic period coin with survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples?
Yes, many of us ignore those, too, preferring 180+ year old Real coins (not "made for collectors during our lifetime" ) that are R4, R5, R6 in Any condition.
Hell, this penny you're so excited about was made after some of the olives in my refrigerator!
"made for collectors" would include 1913 Liberty Nickels, 1804 dollars, most 19th century proof coins, all 20th century proof coins...
This coin has non of the things that cause the demand for a CC Morgan dollar. Price is a function of supply and demand. At this time (and I suspect for many years to come), this coin will have a supply that far exceeds demand.
Collector and Researcher of Liberty Head Nickels. ANA LM-6053
@OnlyGoldIsMoney said:
When I can collect coins with estimated surviving populations of under 100 an issue with a surviving population of 225,000 pristine coins does not impress me as rare.
Sure, sure. True. But, that does ignore the 96-W dime, any modern ASE, the 70-D half, all of which have 100% survival rates in "pristine" condition.
I also don't think this is an appropriate comparison, but what would you say to a classic period coin with survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples?
Yes, many of us ignore those, too, preferring 180+ year old Real coins (not "made for collectors during our lifetime" ) that are R4, R5, R6 in Any condition.
Hell, this penny you're so excited about was made after some of the olives in my refrigerator!
"made for collectors" would include 1913 Liberty Nickels, 1804 dollars, most 19th century proof coins, all 20th century proof coins...
True but consider the mintages. There are only 5 1913 Liberty Nickels and 15 1804 dollars. Many 19th century proof coins (and some 20th century proof coins) have fairly low mintages. The 20th century proof coins with high mintages don't actually sell for that much.
The coin itself is meh, just another penny like ya find on the ground, except this one has a little S and some parts are mirrored, but otherwise, just another common zinc Shield Cent that Appeals to collectors of Memorial Pennies, who want to keep their sets up to date.
BUT, if it was in a sp70+ dcam first strike slab, with a picture of Lincoln and a signature of the mint director and the president of the Grading Company and a sticker from the other Guru and had rainbow toning and fancy pictures aand a flowery writeup on a 1%er dealer website now then you really got something there!!
@dbldie55 said:
Price is a function of supply and demand. At this time (and I suspect for many years to come), this coin will have a supply that far exceeds demand.
No, price brings supply and demand into equilibrium. At present the equilibrium price for a 2017-S EU cent is about $10.
If the price of this coin goes down to 5 cents, I guarantee that my personal demand alone will exceed the maximum mintage of 225,000.
@Baley said:
Yes, many of us ignore those, too, preferring 180+ year old Real coins (not "made for collectors during our lifetime" ) that are R4, R5, R6 in Any condition.
I prefer them too, but not having the financial means to indulge my tastes, I confine my collecting to the lesser unReal coins. But I don't look down on those whose taste in collecting differs from my own.
Not looking down on anyone, its just suggesting to collectors to think about another point of view.
Buy one if you like, collect what you like, but think twice before buying an expensive one, and think thrice before buying 100 of them, is all we crusty old timers are saying
Many years ago a collector told me to collect what you like.If you do that you will never be disappointed .Yes it is nice to turn a profit .Nothing wrong with that.I hope some of these sets will be given to young non collectors to get them excited about our hobby.The coin hawkers will push them on TV.Maybe 50K will be sold over the next few years taking those off the market.Many other sets will be broken up also by other dealers.Maybe ,In the end there will be less complete sets in the original packaging left.
@Insider2 said: @jmlanzaf said: "I've made money on these sets. I continue to make money on these sets. I'm not pumping anything. If I were, I'd do it somewhere where there were far more eyeballs than this little board."
As a relatively new member here, I'd like to remind you that MANY OF THE BEST EYEBALLS IN THE COIN BUSINESS post on these boards. As I wrote before, you have started a very informative discussion; yet just know that age, years-in the business, etc. often mean absolutely nothing at least from what I have seen. I hope these sets become very profitable for you!
I meant no disrespect to the people that are here. I like most of the people that are here, very much. But if you want to pump, this isn't really the place.
@OnlyGoldIsMoney said:
When I can collect coins with estimated surviving populations of under 100 an issue with a surviving population of 225,000 pristine coins does not impress me as rare.
Sure, sure. True. But, that does ignore the 96-W dime, any modern ASE, the 70-D half, all of which have 100% survival rates in "pristine" condition.
I also don't think this is an appropriate comparison, but what would you say to a classic period coin with survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples?
I would consider a classic period coin with a survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples to be common and not rare.
and yet CC dollars sell for several hundred dollars...
Commonly available coins selling for hundreds of dollars are still common.
@OnlyGoldIsMoney said:
When I can collect coins with estimated surviving populations of under 100 an issue with a surviving population of 225,000 pristine coins does not impress me as rare.
Sure, sure. True. But, that does ignore the 96-W dime, any modern ASE, the 70-D half, all of which have 100% survival rates in "pristine" condition.
I also don't think this is an appropriate comparison, but what would you say to a classic period coin with survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples?
Yes, many of us ignore those, too, preferring 180+ year old Real coins (not "made for collectors during our lifetime" ) that are R4, R5, R6 in Any condition.
Hell, this penny you're so excited about was made after some of the olives in my refrigerator!
"made for collectors" would include 1913 Liberty Nickels, 1804 dollars, most 19th century proof coins, all 20th century proof coins...
True but consider the mintages. There are only 5 1913 Liberty Nickels and 15 1804 dollars. Many 19th century proof coins (and some 20th century proof coins) have fairly low mintages. The 20th century proof coins with high mintages don't actually sell for that much.
Price wasn't my point. The problem is people don't read the whole thread.
People keep throwing up objections to the EU cent due to rather spurious categorizations that apply to many other coins that they don't similar exclude. People have thrown out survivorship, "made for collectors", NCLT, "manufactured rarity", etc. But there are many, many prized coins that fall into any one of those categories. Yet, few of them are despised as much as the EU cent seems to be.
@Baley said:
The coin itself is meh, just another penny like ya find on the ground, except this one has a little S and some parts are mirrored, but otherwise, just another common zinc Shield Cent that Appeals to collectors of Memorial Pennies, who want to keep their sets up to date.
BUT, if it was in a sp70+ dcam first strike slab, with a picture of Lincoln and a signature of the mint director and the president of the Grading Company and a sticker from the other Guru and had rainbow toning and fancy pictures aand a flowery writeup on a 1%er dealer website now then you really got something there!!
Have you seen one in hand? Your description really doesn't match the coin. It is not simply "some parts are mirrored", the entire field has a sand-blasted, tectured look.
@OnlyGoldIsMoney said:
When I can collect coins with estimated surviving populations of under 100 an issue with a surviving population of 225,000 pristine coins does not impress me as rare.
Sure, sure. True. But, that does ignore the 96-W dime, any modern ASE, the 70-D half, all of which have 100% survival rates in "pristine" condition.
I also don't think this is an appropriate comparison, but what would you say to a classic period coin with survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples?
Yes, many of us ignore those, too, preferring 180+ year old Real coins (not "made for collectors during our lifetime" ) that are R4, R5, R6 in Any condition.
Hell, this penny you're so excited about was made after some of the olives in my refrigerator!
"made for collectors" would include 1913 Liberty Nickels, 1804 dollars, most 19th century proof coins, all 20th century proof coins...
True but consider the mintages. There are only 5 1913 Liberty Nickels and 15 1804 dollars. Many 19th century proof coins (and some 20th century proof coins) have fairly low mintages. The 20th century proof coins with high mintages don't actually sell for that much.
Price wasn't my point. The problem is people don't read the whole thread.
People keep throwing up objections to the EU cent due to rather spurious categorizations that apply to many other coins that they don't similar exclude. People have thrown out survivorship, "made for collectors", NCLT, "manufactured rarity", etc. But there are many, many prized coins that fall into any one of those categories. Yet, few of them are despised as much as the EU cent seems to be.
How are you determining the level a coin is despised? A lot of people despise the 1913 Liberty nickel and the 1804 dollar. Why do you think more people despise the EU cent?
@OnlyGoldIsMoney said:
When I can collect coins with estimated surviving populations of under 100 an issue with a surviving population of 225,000 pristine coins does not impress me as rare.
Sure, sure. True. But, that does ignore the 96-W dime, any modern ASE, the 70-D half, all of which have 100% survival rates in "pristine" condition.
I also don't think this is an appropriate comparison, but what would you say to a classic period coin with survival of a couple hundred thousand mint state examples?
Yes, many of us ignore those, too, preferring 180+ year old Real coins (not "made for collectors during our lifetime" ) that are R4, R5, R6 in Any condition.
Hell, this penny you're so excited about was made after some of the olives in my refrigerator!
"made for collectors" would include 1913 Liberty Nickels, 1804 dollars, most 19th century proof coins, all 20th century proof coins...
True but consider the mintages. There are only 5 1913 Liberty Nickels and 15 1804 dollars. Many 19th century proof coins (and some 20th century proof coins) have fairly low mintages. The 20th century proof coins with high mintages don't actually sell for that much.
Price wasn't my point. The problem is people don't read the whole thread.
People keep throwing up objections to the EU cent due to rather spurious categorizations that apply to many other coins that they don't similar exclude. People have thrown out survivorship, "made for collectors", NCLT, "manufactured rarity", etc. But there are many, many prized coins that fall into any one of those categories. Yet, few of them are despised as much as the EU cent seems to be.
How are you determining the level a coin is despised? A lot of people despise the 1913 Liberty nickel and the 1804 dollar. Why do you think more people despise the EU cent?
LOL. Just anectdotal based on the amount of verbal abuse I'm getting.
Will it please catch the attention of someone soon! We just had to lower the price on the 70 grade coins another roughly 20% to stay competitive with the open bid auctions! Wondercoin.
Please visit my website at www.wondercoins.com and my ebay auctions under my user name www.wondercoin.com.
@wondercoin said:
Will it please catch the attention of someone soon! We just had to lower the price on the 70 grade coins another roughly 20% to stay competitive with the open bid auctions! Wondercoin.
LOL. Unfortunately, I think the damage is done due to the distribution snafus. It will take time, probably months or years, for the bad taste to leave people's mouths.
@wondercoin said:
Will it please catch the attention of someone soon! We just had to lower the price on the 70 grade coins another roughly 20% to stay competitive with the open bid auctions! Wondercoin.
LOL. Unfortunately, I think the damage is done due to the distribution snafus. It will take time, probably months or years, for the bad taste to leave people's mouths.
LOL old excuses .. the 225th a dog ......buy one.... leave the rest for uniformed specs to lose their rear ends
@wondercoin said:
Will it please catch the attention of someone soon! We just had to lower the price on the 70 grade coins another roughly 20% to stay competitive with the open bid auctions! Wondercoin.
LOL. Unfortunately, I think the damage is done due to the distribution snafus. It will take time, probably months or years, for the bad taste to leave people's mouths.
LOL old excuses .. the 225th a dog ......buy one.... leave the rest for uniformed specs to lose their rear ends
I think Bestday is secretly in love with the EU sets and only wants them all to himself.
@wondercoin said:
Will it please catch the attention of someone soon! We just had to lower the price on the 70 grade coins another roughly 20% to stay competitive with the open bid auctions! Wondercoin.
LOL. Unfortunately, I think the damage is done due to the distribution snafus. It will take time, probably months or years, for the bad taste to leave people's mouths.
LOL old excuses .. the 225th a dog ......buy one.... leave the rest for uniformed specs to lose their rear ends
I think Bestday is secretly in love with the EU sets and only wants them all to himself.
I think BestDay is just in love with himself. He can't stop telling people that he's RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT about these sets. The small, fragile child in side must really be afraid that he's WRONG WRONG WRONG.
Or maybe he's just in love with me. He seems to be stalking me. Even when I'm saying something negative about the sets, he wants to jump in and make sure he says something MORE negative.
@TwoSides2aCoin said:
Low mintage rarely translates to rare, in this hobby. The main question is "why does our minting facility not recognize their own foolishness when it comes to targeting collectors?
They should have seen this coming. Collectors are the only rarity nowadays.
But the mint got paid since when do they care aboiut collectors beyond whats in their wallet?
This whole thread reminds me of what BongoBongo wrote in his one & only appearance on this forum years ago.
"If you buy what you like, at a price you can afford at the time, then things will be easier. If you buy what other people like, borrow to fund it and expect multiple of return, then you are likely to be unhappy. Bongo say nearly everything depreciates over time. Bongo would not pay $500 for a silver bell this Christmas and expect it to be worth $550 next year, but Bongo knows a Silver Bell is not old coin. Or is it? Bongo maybe not surprised that old coin is like any other limited non essential commodity and subject to the whims of taste and market. Put the coin in book and enjoy it. If it is worth more when you come to sell it, well done. If not, then you have had enjoyment out of it. Remember that old coin is only worth a few dollars in physical material value – This is why value is an esoteric concept in many ways and it may be vulgar to assign any monetary value to old coin unless you are a Russian Oligarch or Chinese shoddy goods factory owner."
"Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
@wondercoin said:
Will it please catch the attention of someone soon! We just had to lower the price on the 70 grade coins another roughly 20% to stay competitive with the open bid auctions! Wondercoin.
LOL. Unfortunately, I think the damage is done due to the distribution snafus. It will take time, probably months or years, for the bad taste to leave people's mouths.
LOL old excuses .. the 225th a dog ......buy one.... leave the rest for uniformed specs to lose their rear ends
I think Bestday is secretly in love with the EU sets and only wants them all to himself.
I think BestDay is just in love with himself. He can't stop telling people that he's RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT about these sets. The small, fragile child in side must really be afraid that he's WRONG WRONG WRONG.
Or maybe he's just in love with me. He seems to be stalking me. Even when I'm saying something negative about the sets, he wants to jump in and make sure he says something MORE negative.
Much love, BestDay. xoxoxo
LOL .after several newbies on the forum bought way too many 225th sets , tried to gin up support with wishful hope ...;..posted several hundred comments to gin up price for 225th ,with little success , ...left with 25,000 of the 225th sets available .. selling at 500 a week = a sellout in ?
Time to move on to the next mint product ..cut losses short ... Forum members .... too a sharp lot
LOL .after several newbies on the forum bought way too many 225th sets , tried to gin up support with wishful hope ...;..posted several hundred comments to gin up price for 225th ,with little success , ...left with 25,000 of the 225th sets available .. selling at 500 a week = a sellout in ?
Time to move on to the next mint product ..cut losses short ... Forum members .... too a sharp lot
Who you calling a newbie? I've been here at least 2 days......
@wondercoin said:
Will it please catch the attention of someone soon! We just had to lower the price on the 70 grade coins another roughly 20% to stay competitive with the open bid auctions! Wondercoin.
LOL. Unfortunately, I think the damage is done due to the distribution snafus. It will take time, probably months or years, for the bad taste to leave people's mouths.
LOL old excuses .. the 225th a dog ......buy one.... leave the rest for uniformed specs to lose their rear ends
I think Bestday is secretly in love with the EU sets and only wants them all to himself.
I think BestDay is just in love with himself. He can't stop telling people that he's RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT about these sets. The small, fragile child in side must really be afraid that he's WRONG WRONG WRONG.
Or maybe he's just in love with me. He seems to be stalking me. Even when I'm saying something negative about the sets, he wants to jump in and make sure he says something MORE negative.
Much love, BestDay. xoxoxo
LOL .after several newbies on the forum bought way too many 225th sets , tried to gin up support with wishful hope ...;..posted several hundred comments to gin up price for 225th ,with little success , ...left with 25,000 of the 225th sets available .. selling at 500 a week = a sellout in ?
Time to move on to the next mint product ..cut losses short ... Forum members .... too a sharp lot
Again, that ain't me kid. I have as many sets as I want, no more no less. Although I would like more cents at the right price.
I AM NOT TRYING TO GIN UP SUPPORT FOR ANYTHING. YOUR ARE SO EFFING FULL OF YOURSELF THAT YOU READ MINDS?
I find this set interesting. I find the reaction of people to this set interesting. I talk about this set because I'm INTERESTED/EXCITED about the set, not because I'm trying to sell anything.
EU is priced closer to a proof in the market, not as a business strike. If you look at it that way then 225,000 is not very low mintage at all.
EU was the worst choice the mint could have made for this set. Had they been RP then they would be at $70 a set or higher.
Also there is the factor that sitting on Lincoln Cents you have a chance that some turn on you, as spotting and toning happens easily with these coins.
Then the big one, the mint may decide in the next couple of years to come out with some special 175th set of EU coins with a mintage of only 175,000. So everything that seemed special about the 225th set disappears.
You take a big risk in holding these types of coins, I have learned this myself the hard way. The mint is continuously finding new sets to produce, and special coins to sell. Any time there is heavy returns on a mint issue, you have to listen to the market. Right now it is saying there isn't enough demand.
@HalfStrike said:
EU is priced closer to a proof in the market, not as a business strike. If you look at it that way then 225,000 is not very low mintage at all.
EU was the worst choice the mint could have made for this set. Had they been RP then they would be at $70 a set or higher.
Also there is the factor that sitting on Lincoln Cents you have a chance that some turn on you, as spotting and toning happens easily with these coins.
Then the big one, the mint may decide in the next couple of years to come out with some special 175th set of EU coins with a mintage of only 175,000. So everything that seemed special about the 225th set disappears.
You take a big risk in holding these types of coins, I have learned this myself the hard way. The mint is continuously finding new sets to produce, and special coins to sell. Any time there is heavy returns on a mint issue, you have to listen to the market. Right now it is saying there isn't enough demand.
I can hold 100 Lincolns for $600 for a couple years. Big deal.
225,000 is low for a proof set. They still sell close to twice that many. 225,000 is closer to the sales of Mint sets.
The "heavy returns" were driven largely by one large 20,000 set cancellation. In my ever humble opinion, this set would have been sold out in 5 minutes and stayed sold out on the first day if not for the cancellation. The 20,000 sets cancelled (still not clear whether that was initiated by the Mint or the customer) put a large number back on sale. That created a wave of returns from panicked flippers resulting in somewhere between 30,000 and 40,000 returns based on sales numbers.
The closest comp I can see for that "market" action is the gold Mercury dime. [Not a coin comparison, mind you, but a market action comparison.]
In the end, this remains a unique finish (so far) for many of the coin series. It remains the lowest mintage Lincoln. Lincoln cents continue to sell for $40 in 70 and $25 in 69. At $30, the sets remain a reasonable value just for breaking out the cents.
We all place our bets where we choose. My $25 cost basis on the sets remains in the black even at current prices. I'm in no immediate danger of losing any money [thank you all for your concern ].
I agree that there currently is not enough demand. That says little about demand 2-5 years from now when the demand may be higher or much lower. Time will tell. Let's find out, shall we?
Now if it’s good for that set – what about all the other Lincoln set possibilities?? Was this some sort of “Test” listing ??. My point being is that PCGS has not made it much of a collectible coin since they have not required it in that many sets – perhaps in the future they will.
So yes, it’s a Modern cent, but so are 2017 S proof minted in the millions. And when they first came out It was a must have coin and the first buyers paying say - $200 ?? for the privilege which is now down to maybe $30 for a Proof 70. But why? Demand for registry sets. Once our host figures out just where the cent will be required, demand should jump – for a while.
WS
Proud recipient of the coveted PCGS Forum "You Suck" Award Thursday July 19, 2007 11:33 PM and December 30th, 2011 at 8:50 PM.
@WaterSport said:
I tried to sell 3 of these cents in SP69 and 70 with Trueview pics on Ebay with no bids at all last week. Frankly I was a bit surprised.
Now if it’s good for that set – what about all the other Lincoln set possibilities?? Was this some sort of “Test” listing ??. My point being is that PCGS has not made it much of a collectible coin since they have not required it in that many sets – perhaps in the future they will.
So yes, it’s a Modern cent, but so are 2017 S proof minted in the millions. And when they first came out It was a must have coin and the first buyers paying say - $200 ?? for the privilege which is now down to maybe $30 for a Proof 70. But why? Demand for registry sets. Once our host figures out just where the cent will be required, demand should jump – for a while.
WS
That's interesting. I'm surprised they added it already.
You're not going to get much of a jump when there's only 101 sets in the registry. As it is, they are selling 2,000 sets per week.
Someone has to request the slot get added to each set. I did this for the nickel in all of my variety sets. Thus it is listed as optional in multiple sets (but not in the sets where it hast not yet been requested).
These coins will be required in the variety sets by the start of next year, when 2017 coins are set to be required. I suspect there are currently multiples of graded 70 coins for the current number of sets holders which will need one.
Collector and Researcher of Liberty Head Nickels. ANA LM-6053
@dbldie55 said:
Someone has to request the slot get added to each set. I did this for the nickel in all of my variety sets. Thus it is listed as optional in multiple sets (but not in the sets where it hast not yet been requested).
These coins will be required in the variety sets by the start of next year, when 2017 coins are set to be required. I suspect there are currently multiples of graded 70 coins for the current number of sets holders which will need one.
My opinion should not be construed as highjacking, but it kind of steers off the beaten path. Ah, but hyping up a common creation as rare, only reminds me that Stewart Blay probably owns the rarest Lincoln cent. I could be wrong, but new issues , despite "mintage numbers" is not what the majority of collectors (deeply ingrained collectors) consider rare. Not by a long shot.
Comments
I don't care about any of those myself. I think registry sets were brilliant marketing that created expensive coins with no real long term value by appealing to people's vanity. I don't care about any US coins except Buff Nickels and 18th century copper. And even those I don't really "collect". I don't even consider myself a coin collector. I just buy and sell. But there is a market for all of that and to deny it exists is silly.
And that's really my point: all of those things are as questionable in value as the 2017-S cent or, if you want to go glass half-full, all of those coins are as valuable as the 2017-S cent. Yet, the pricing doesn't reflect that similarity.
@jmlanzaf said: "I've made money on these sets. I continue to make money on these sets. I'm not pumping anything. If I were, I'd do it somewhere where there were far more eyeballs than this little board."
As a relatively new member here, I'd like to remind you that MANY OF THE BEST EYEBALLS IN THE COIN BUSINESS post on these boards. As I wrote before, you have started a very informative discussion; yet just know that age, years-in the business, etc. often mean absolutely nothing at least from what I have seen. I hope these sets become very profitable for you!
At least you finally got there.
Commonly available coins selling for hundreds of dollars are still common.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
Yup, sure would.
Nice try but false equivalency.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
This coin has non of the things that cause the demand for a CC Morgan dollar. Price is a function of supply and demand. At this time (and I suspect for many years to come), this coin will have a supply that far exceeds demand.
True but consider the mintages. There are only 5 1913 Liberty Nickels and 15 1804 dollars. Many 19th century proof coins (and some 20th century proof coins) have fairly low mintages. The 20th century proof coins with high mintages don't actually sell for that much.
PENALTY.
5 Posts in a row in 5 Minutes.
This is not Twitter. You can use more than 140 characters.
The coin itself is meh, just another penny like ya find on the ground, except this one has a little S and some parts are mirrored, but otherwise, just another common zinc Shield Cent that Appeals to collectors of Memorial Pennies, who want to keep their sets up to date.
BUT, if it was in a sp70+ dcam first strike slab, with a picture of Lincoln and a signature of the mint director and the president of the Grading Company and a sticker from the other Guru and had rainbow toning and fancy pictures aand a flowery writeup on a 1%er dealer website now then you really got something there!!
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
No, price brings supply and demand into equilibrium. At present the equilibrium price for a 2017-S EU cent is about $10.
If the price of this coin goes down to 5 cents, I guarantee that my personal demand alone will exceed the maximum mintage of 225,000.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
All ya need then is the guy on TV to tell you it's the rarest Lincoln ever minted the rarest Lincoln ever minted
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Succintly put, in only 95 characters (and a goalie).
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
I prefer them too, but not having the financial means to indulge my tastes, I confine my collecting to the lesser unReal coins. But I don't look down on those whose taste in collecting differs from my own.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Not looking down on anyone, its just suggesting to collectors to think about another point of view.
Buy one if you like, collect what you like, but think twice before buying an expensive one, and think thrice before buying 100 of them, is all we crusty old timers are saying
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
And agreed about price discovery! If the price were 5 cents per, I'd get a roll.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
As a collector since the mid-1950s, I qualify as an old timer. I try not to be crusty, though.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Many years ago a collector told me to collect what you like.If you do that you will never be disappointed
.Yes it is nice to turn a profit .Nothing wrong with that.I hope some of these sets will be given to young non collectors to get them excited about our hobby.The coin hawkers will push them on TV.Maybe 50K will be sold over the next few years taking those off the market.Many other sets will be broken up also by other dealers.Maybe ,In the end there will be less complete sets in the original packaging left.
I meant no disrespect to the people that are here. I like most of the people that are here, very much. But if you want to pump, this isn't really the place.
True dat.
Price wasn't my point. The problem is people don't read the whole thread.
People keep throwing up objections to the EU cent due to rather spurious categorizations that apply to many other coins that they don't similar exclude. People have thrown out survivorship, "made for collectors", NCLT, "manufactured rarity", etc. But there are many, many prized coins that fall into any one of those categories. Yet, few of them are despised as much as the EU cent seems to be.
Have you seen one in hand? Your description really doesn't match the coin. It is not simply "some parts are mirrored", the entire field has a sand-blasted, tectured look.
You might be one of the few with the crusts trimmed off.
I continue to find this coin far more interesting than I probably should.
I also find this thread interesting to see the multiple reasons people use to explain away any significance to this coin.
How are you determining the level a coin is despised? A lot of people despise the 1913 Liberty nickel and the 1804 dollar. Why do you think more people despise the EU cent?
LOL. Just anectdotal based on the amount of verbal abuse I'm getting.
Not sure who despised the EU cent. I do know most despise using irrelevant statements to justify a position.
Really, could you cite a study? Oh, wait, it's just you being crusty. I'll consider the source, wash my hands, and move on.
Will it please catch the attention of someone soon! We just had to lower the price on the 70 grade coins another roughly 20% to stay competitive with the open bid auctions! Wondercoin.
LOL. Unfortunately, I think the damage is done due to the distribution snafus. It will take time, probably months or years, for the bad taste to leave people's mouths.
LOL old excuses .. the 225th a dog ......buy one.... leave the rest for uniformed specs to lose their rear ends
I think Bestday is secretly in love with the EU sets and only wants them all to himself.
Don't quote me on that.
I think BestDay is just in love with himself. He can't stop telling people that he's RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT about these sets. The small, fragile child in side must really be afraid that he's WRONG WRONG WRONG.
Or maybe he's just in love with me. He seems to be stalking me. Even when I'm saying something negative about the sets, he wants to jump in and make sure he says something MORE negative.
Much love, BestDay. xoxoxo
It's simple supply and demand...
Create the demand then supply the product
Coin Club Benefit auctions ..... View the Lots
But the mint got paid
since when do they care aboiut collectors beyond whats in their wallet?
And the goalie is an orange. Must play for a florida team
This whole thread reminds me of what BongoBongo wrote in his one & only appearance on this forum years ago.
"If you buy what you like, at a price you can afford at the time, then things will be easier. If you buy what other people like, borrow to fund it and expect multiple of return, then you are likely to be unhappy. Bongo say nearly everything depreciates over time. Bongo would not pay $500 for a silver bell this Christmas and expect it to be worth $550 next year, but Bongo knows a Silver Bell is not old coin. Or is it? Bongo maybe not surprised that old coin is like any other limited non essential commodity and subject to the whims of taste and market. Put the coin in book and enjoy it. If it is worth more when you come to sell it, well done. If not, then you have had enjoyment out of it. Remember that old coin is only worth a few dollars in physical material value – This is why value is an esoteric concept in many ways and it may be vulgar to assign any monetary value to old coin unless you are a Russian Oligarch or Chinese shoddy goods factory owner."
LOL .after several newbies on the forum bought way too many 225th sets , tried to gin up support with wishful hope ...;..posted several hundred comments to gin up price for 225th ,with little success , ...left with 25,000 of the 225th sets available .. selling at 500 a week = a sellout in ?
Time to move on to the next mint product ..cut losses short ... Forum members .... too a sharp lot
Who you calling a newbie? I've been here at least 2 days......
Don't quote me on that.
Again, that ain't me kid. I have as many sets as I want, no more no less. Although I would like more cents at the right price.
I AM NOT TRYING TO GIN UP SUPPORT FOR ANYTHING. YOUR ARE SO EFFING FULL OF YOURSELF THAT YOU READ MINDS?
I find this set interesting. I find the reaction of people to this set interesting. I talk about this set because I'm INTERESTED/EXCITED about the set, not because I'm trying to sell anything.
EU is priced closer to a proof in the market, not as a business strike. If you look at it that way then 225,000 is not very low mintage at all.
EU was the worst choice the mint could have made for this set. Had they been RP then they would be at $70 a set or higher.
Also there is the factor that sitting on Lincoln Cents you have a chance that some turn on you, as spotting and toning happens easily with these coins.
Then the big one, the mint may decide in the next couple of years to come out with some special 175th set of EU coins with a mintage of only 175,000. So everything that seemed special about the 225th set disappears.
You take a big risk in holding these types of coins, I have learned this myself the hard way. The mint is continuously finding new sets to produce, and special coins to sell. Any time there is heavy returns on a mint issue, you have to listen to the market. Right now it is saying there isn't enough demand.
Well, you can still find them on the black market: ebay.com/itm/like/151910213783?vectorid=229466&lgeo=1&item=151910213783&rmvSB=true
I can hold 100 Lincolns for $600 for a couple years. Big deal.
225,000 is low for a proof set. They still sell close to twice that many. 225,000 is closer to the sales of Mint sets.
The "heavy returns" were driven largely by one large 20,000 set cancellation. In my ever humble opinion, this set would have been sold out in 5 minutes and stayed sold out on the first day if not for the cancellation. The 20,000 sets cancelled (still not clear whether that was initiated by the Mint or the customer) put a large number back on sale. That created a wave of returns from panicked flippers resulting in somewhere between 30,000 and 40,000 returns based on sales numbers.
The closest comp I can see for that "market" action is the gold Mercury dime. [Not a coin comparison, mind you, but a market action comparison.]
In the end, this remains a unique finish (so far) for many of the coin series. It remains the lowest mintage Lincoln. Lincoln cents continue to sell for $40 in 70 and $25 in 69. At $30, the sets remain a reasonable value just for breaking out the cents.
We all place our bets where we choose. My $25 cost basis on the sets remains in the black even at current prices. I'm in no immediate danger of losing any money [thank you all for your concern
].
I agree that there currently is not enough demand. That says little about demand 2-5 years from now when the demand may be higher or much lower. Time will tell. Let's find out, shall we?
That's a 2016-S proof not a 2017-S enhanced.
But I'm well aware where to find them. Just bought 45 raw cents at $6 each.
I tried to sell 3 of these cents in SP69 and 70 with Trueview pics on Ebay with no bids at all last week. Frankly I was a bit surprised.
Ok, so I don’t mean to interrupt the “discussion” going on here, but let’s look at from 2 other points. One was touched on about the uptick in demand should DANSCO add the hole in newer books. Well what about PCGS?? Did any of you know that the coin is now optional at this moment IN ONLY THIS SET . https://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistry/half-cents/lincoln-cents-major-sets/lincoln-cents-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1959-present/50
Now if it’s good for that set – what about all the other Lincoln set possibilities?? Was this some sort of “Test” listing ??. My point being is that PCGS has not made it much of a collectible coin since they have not required it in that many sets – perhaps in the future they will.
So yes, it’s a Modern cent, but so are 2017 S proof minted in the millions. And when they first came out It was a must have coin and the first buyers paying say - $200 ?? for the privilege which is now down to maybe $30 for a Proof 70. But why? Demand for registry sets. Once our host figures out just where the cent will be required, demand should jump – for a while.
WS
That's interesting. I'm surprised they added it already.
You're not going to get much of a jump when there's only 101 sets in the registry. As it is, they are selling 2,000 sets per week.
Someone has to request the slot get added to each set. I did this for the nickel in all of my variety sets. Thus it is listed as optional in multiple sets (but not in the sets where it hast not yet been requested).
These coins will be required in the variety sets by the start of next year, when 2017 coins are set to be required. I suspect there are currently multiples of graded 70 coins for the current number of sets holders which will need one.
+1
My opinion should not be construed as highjacking, but it kind of steers off the beaten path. Ah, but hyping up a common creation as rare, only reminds me that Stewart Blay probably owns the rarest Lincoln cent. I could be wrong, but new issues , despite "mintage numbers" is not what the majority of collectors (deeply ingrained collectors) consider rare. Not by a long shot.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
Soooooo, should I buy or sell? I'm so confused.
Buy what you like.
d2
Don't quote me on that.