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What's going on with these dimes? Grease or old dies or bad planchets or ?

So does anyone have a clue why so many clad dimes minted in the 60's have their dates and motto's so mushed out? Here's 3 examples from 3 separate years with very similar issues - the bottom rims and everything near them are mushy and almost non-existent. Is this a die issue, a grease issue, a plancet issue or just poor quality control?

Comments

  • FredWeinbergFredWeinberg Posts: 5,930 ✭✭✭✭✭

    They're struck from worn or 'overused' dies.

    Not really considered errors - more of a minor anomaly.

    By the way, you should see of of the dimes and quarters
    from the last few years like this, especially the last 5-8 years.

    Retired Collector & Dealer in Major Mint Error Coins & Currency since the 1960's.Co-Author of Whitman's "100 Greatest U.S. Mint Error Coins", and the Error Coin Encyclopedia, Vols., III & IV. Retired Authenticator for Major Mint Errors for PCGS. A 50+ Year PNG Member.A full-time numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022.
  • 291fifth291fifth Posts: 24,710 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This was a period when coins were rapidly transitioning from .900 fine silver to clad. The clad coins were needed quickly and quality took a back seat to production numbers.

    All glory is fleeting.
  • TequilaDaveTequilaDave Posts: 271 ✭✭✭
    edited April 19, 2017 1:59PM

    @FredWeinberg said:
    They're struck from worn or 'overused' dies.

    Not really considered errors - more of a minor anomaly.

    By the way, you should see of of the dimes and quarters
    from the last few years like this, especially the last 5-8 years.

    What do you suppose it is about the portion of the die at ~ 6 o'clock that wears differently than any other portion of the die? There must be something about the way the dies press or eject or ? that causes the bulk of the wear to occur in this one section of the die.

  • JimnightJimnight Posts: 10,846 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Filled die

  • FredWeinbergFredWeinberg Posts: 5,930 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Don't know for sure, but it might relate
    to the way the dies are set up in the press;
    the Mint wouldn't really care if some of the
    coins are 'weak' in that area. They might care
    in the first few days/weeks/whatever of striking
    new coinage, but after awhile, they're just
    striking little round pieces of metal with
    pictures on them.

    Could also relate to the reverse design opposite the obv.
    area, but I don't see anything on the top of the reverse that would confirm that.

    Retired Collector & Dealer in Major Mint Error Coins & Currency since the 1960's.Co-Author of Whitman's "100 Greatest U.S. Mint Error Coins", and the Error Coin Encyclopedia, Vols., III & IV. Retired Authenticator for Major Mint Errors for PCGS. A 50+ Year PNG Member.A full-time numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022.
  • TequilaDaveTequilaDave Posts: 271 ✭✭✭

    @FredWeinberg said:
    Don't know for sure, but it might relate
    to the way the dies are set up in the press;
    the Mint wouldn't really care if some of the
    coins are 'weak' in that area. They might care
    in the first few days/weeks/whatever of striking
    new coinage, but after awhile, they're just
    striking little round pieces of metal with
    pictures on them.

    Could also relate to the reverse design opposite the obv.
    area, but I don't see anything on the top of the reverse that would confirm that.

    Here's the reverse of these dimes and they show basically the same mushiness, if not more. It just strikes me as odd that the wear is concentrated in the same area over the span of several years.

  • FredWeinbergFredWeinberg Posts: 5,930 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The angle of the dangle - the dies were
    probably not set up perfectly, or shifted
    at a very slight angle after striking a few
    hundred thousand coins.

    Retired Collector & Dealer in Major Mint Error Coins & Currency since the 1960's.Co-Author of Whitman's "100 Greatest U.S. Mint Error Coins", and the Error Coin Encyclopedia, Vols., III & IV. Retired Authenticator for Major Mint Errors for PCGS. A 50+ Year PNG Member.A full-time numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022.
  • StoogeStooge Posts: 4,673 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @FredWeinberg said:
    Don't know for sure, but it might relate
    to the way the dies are set up in the press;
    the Mint wouldn't really care if some of the
    coins are 'weak' in that area. They might care
    in the first few days/weeks/whatever of striking
    new coinage, but after awhile, they're just
    striking little round pieces of metal with
    pictures on them.

    I've seen a majority of the post silver early clads (1965-1967) 7FB & and 1 8FB and they are some of the most beautifully struck clad dimes you will see. The mint made billions of dimes these 3 years, but made only an an extremely small handful of what I would call gems.


    Later, Paul.
  • StoogeStooge Posts: 4,673 ✭✭✭✭✭

    1966 MS67FB
    photo 27913178_large_zps992b8ea0.jpg

    1968-D MS67+FB
    photo 29392847_large_zpsvhhxs5id.jpg


    Later, Paul.
  • TequilaDaveTequilaDave Posts: 271 ✭✭✭

    @Stooge said:
    1966 MS67FB
    photo 27913178_large_zps992b8ea0.jpg

    1968-D MS67+FB
    photo 29392847_large_zpsvhhxs5id.jpg

    Nice! Is that '66 a business strike or SMS? I've a box of original bank rolls from '65 to 68 and while going thru them I found the above examples. I really love seeing the flow lines in some of these dimes. In fact, I have a few that would give the 68-D a run for its money...maybe I should submit a couple and see how they fare.

  • StoogeStooge Posts: 4,673 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TequilaDave said: Nice! Is that '66 a business strike or SMS? I've a box of original bank rolls from '65 to 68 and while going >thru them I found the above examples. I really love seeing the flow lines in some of these dimes. In fact, I have a few that >would give the 68-D a run for its money...maybe I should submit a couple and see how they fare.

    They are business strikes


    Later, Paul.
  • 1630Boston1630Boston Posts: 14,111 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I always love learning new facets concerning coinage :smile:
    Thanks to all who shared info here :smile:

    Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko

    Bad transactions with : nobody to date

  • abcde12345abcde12345 Posts: 3,404 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Can a coin struck from a worn die still receive a high mint state grade if it is mark free and lustrous?

  • BuffaloIronTailBuffaloIronTail Posts: 7,551 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It probably has something to do with metal displacement, the torch tip (which is at that location on the reverse) needing a lot more metal to fill the space.

    Pete

    "I tell them there's no problems.....only solutions" - John Lennon
  • DIMEMANDIMEMAN Posts: 22,403 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Stooge said:
    1966 MS67FB
    photo 27913178_large_zps992b8ea0.jpg

    1968-D MS67+FB
    photo 29392847_large_zpsvhhxs5id.jpg

    Stooge...that 66 is a MOOSE!!!! Nice clad Dime!

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Interesting anomaly.... I had not noticed this.... Thanks for the inputs Fred.... now I will be checking my dime change for this....my OCD will kick in immediately :D Cheers, RickO

  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,815 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @291fifth said:
    This was a period when coins were rapidly transitioning from .900 fine silver to clad. The clad coins were needed quickly and quality took a back seat to production numbers.

    This.

    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • ashelandasheland Posts: 23,784 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @abcde12345 said:
    Can a coin struck from a worn die still receive a high mint state grade if it is mark free and lustrous?

    I think it would be limited by the mushy strike.

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