Dealers - Potential new scam
AMRC
Posts: 4,280 ✭✭✭✭✭
I know many dealers are on these boards, so I am sharing the following:
Last week I received a check with a purchase order for a specific coin that is being advertised on my Website. What was unique about this purchase was that there was no communication with me prior to this purchase. The check and Purchase order, all very legitimate looking, just showed up. Like with all checks we put a 5-day hold on it, and sure enough in 2 days it was returned to my bank as being an invalid account (Not NSF).
I guess they were banking on that since it all looked so official I would have just mailed out the coin, but that did not happen.
Check was from:
Stewart Group
PO Box 411023
Grandville, MI 49418
and drawn on the "First National" Bank
Last week I received a check with a purchase order for a specific coin that is being advertised on my Website. What was unique about this purchase was that there was no communication with me prior to this purchase. The check and Purchase order, all very legitimate looking, just showed up. Like with all checks we put a 5-day hold on it, and sure enough in 2 days it was returned to my bank as being an invalid account (Not NSF).
I guess they were banking on that since it all looked so official I would have just mailed out the coin, but that did not happen.
Check was from:
Stewart Group
PO Box 411023
Grandville, MI 49418
and drawn on the "First National" Bank
0
Comments
I tried communicating with the "buyer" but didnt hear from them for 3 days so I refunded the money
At shows, I expect cash or gold coins at melt in payment. I will take CRC at my wholesale offer in trade. Nothing leaves the table unless purchased (I don't do approvals at shows lol). In the past I have taken checks up to my risk limit of $300 providing they appear to be a vetted or trusted search (DL # taken, etc). However, with all the fraud appearing, I may have to revise this policy.
Don't let somebody at a show pressure you into taking a check from him ("well these dealers can vouch for me"). With all the dealer bankruptcies in this market just bc somebody is a dealer does not mean anything.
No clearance of payment, no ship.
thanks for update
I know many dealers are on these boards, so I am sharing the following:
Last week I received a check with a purchase order for a specific coin that is being advertised on my Website. What was unique about this purchase was that there was no communication with me prior to this purchase. The check and Purchase order, all very legitimate looking, just showed up. Like with all checks we put a 5-day hold on it, and sure enough in 2 days it was returned to my bank as being an invalid account (Not NSF).
I guess they were banking on that since it all looked so official I would have just mailed out the coin, but that did not happen.
Check was from:
Stewart Group
PO Box 411023
Grandville, MI 49418
and drawn on the "First National" Bank
Did your bank whack you for a fee for the not good check?
Coin Rarities Online
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
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Does dealers take PayPal gift payment at show?
No, I take cash or gold coins at melt. Its a money show lol.
If I make a major purchase at a coin show I'll pay by check. Once the check clears the dealer can ship me the coin at his expense.
This ^
I wonder if these guys are the Stewart Group?
No Way Out: Stimulus and Money Printing Are the Only Path Left
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
I got a few orders like that only they were accompanied by fake money orders that took 3 Weeks to come back as such. Thankfully we were fast on our feet and didn't get ripped off.
Same here. Unfortunately, I was a bit naïve the first time it happened. I thought I was being cautious enough. I waited several days after the "cashier's check" cleared before I shipped, but it came back as counterfeit about two weeks later. They got us for a little over $2,000.
Jade Rare Coin eBay Listings
checks can be reversed long after they clear. I accept them only from trusted customers.
DerryB...can you expound on this please?
A check can be deposited, you call or ask your bank and they say it cleared....and then later the check is reversed and the funds taken from your account?
If true, is there a time limit after which deposited and cleared checks cannot be reversed?
Wow!
Fraud is usually discovered weeks later.
Scammers make fake, but otherwise perfect bank checks, like what you
would take to a real estate closing. They use an actual account owner's
information. When the your bank clears the check it clears because the other
account has sufficient funds.
When the account owner (whose info has been stolen) gets his statement, he
notifies the bank that the charge to his account is not valid.
His bank investigates, restores his balance, receives funds back from your bank,
your bank charges you because you deposited a bogus check.
Your recourse is to the customer who gave you the check. Good luck.
Cheers, RickO
If I make a major purchase at a coin show I'll pay by check. Once the check clears the dealer can ship me the coin at his expense.
No offense but that seems rather unfair to the dealer. Why would you want to penalize the dealer for doing you the courtesy of accepting your personal check? If someone negotiates the last dime out of a deal and then lays a check on me at the end expecting me to eat shipping/insurance on top of it all, we likely won't have a deal. Just saying. If they state their intent up front I'll agree to hold and ship- but shipping will be part of the price. I don't see that as unfair to the buyer. If you had ordered the item from a dealer online or won at, say, a Heritage auction or something similar, shipping would be added to the cost and paid as a matter of course... and that's for something you can't even hold & inspect in hand before purchase. At a show you get to look at the item, confirm it's exactly what you want and negotiate a good price to boot. Why should the seller eat the shipping on top of it all for the privilege of having to wait for his money and hassling with packing and shipping?
Edit for typo.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
If I make a major purchase at a coin show I'll pay by check. Once the check clears the dealer can ship me the coin at his expense.
LOL... dictating terms of sale to a coin dealer at show .. I have seen my dealer friend and others refuse such business ..They don't take checks unless close business relationships
I got a few orders like that only they were accompanied by fake money orders that took 3 Weeks to come back as such. Thankfully we were fast on our feet and didn't get ripped off.
Same here. Unfortunately, I was a bit naïve the first time it happened. I thought I was being cautious enough. I waited several days after the "cashier's check" cleared before I shipped, but it came back as counterfeit about two weeks later. They got us for a little over $2,000.
You just reminded me it wasn't a money order it was cashiers checks, and Oh I shipped them unfortunately the same day the Bank of America "cashiers check" came back as fake. After I shipped of course. I parked outside the post office the next morning and was there when they opened the door ( actually went in the back with a rep ) and they called the next post office the package would stop at, whispered some magic word and we lucked out and had our coins back the next day via express mail.
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
If I make a major purchase at a coin show I'll pay by check. Once the check clears the dealer can ship me the coin at his expense.
I thought this was standard practice.
I've done this many times.
Never had a dealer say no.
If I make a major purchase at a coin show I'll pay by check. Once the check clears the dealer can ship me the coin at his expense.
LOL... dictating terms of sale to a coin dealer at show .. I have seen my dealer friend and others refuse such business ..They don't take checks unless close business relationships
I'm talking about buying a high valued coin. I don't feel comfortable carrying more than a few thousand in cash with me. Taking a check is not an unreasonable request especially if he holds the coin until the check clears. I've never had a problem with a dealer taking my check at a coin show.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire