If there are over 28,000 PCGS MS66 38-D Buffs, why are they so rare in 2.5/3.5 holders??

Lakesammman · November 7, 2013 3:17AM

Any theories?? Inquiring minds need to know!

LindeDad · November 7, 2013 3:33AM

Maybe back then they graded MS65 and became 66's later?

ricko · November 7, 2013 3:51AM

Crackouts > upgrades....Cheers, RickO

BustHalfBrian · November 7, 2013 5:10AM

Are they that rare? I never noticed. Seems to be a common coin in every holder...

Maybe you just need to look harder

cucamongacoin · November 7, 2013 5:14AM

Back when PCGS first started, I remember a guy at Long Beach with stacks and stacks of '38D in rattlers, all MS65. I'm sure many of these were undergraded at the time. He was hawking them like a snake oil salesman, hollering out " come 'n get 'em" or something of that nature. I think he was asking $50 a pop.

johnny9434 · November 7, 2013 5:17AM

<< Crackouts > upgrades....Cheers, RickO >>

my theory as well.

Lakesammman · November 7, 2013 11:05AM

It's so common, and the upside so minimal, why bother?? There are still plenty of them in rattlers and other OGH's……even 2.0's.

cucamongacoin · November 7, 2013 11:08AM

Wasn't there a hoard of 100 rolls some time ago? 4,000 coins would surely skew the stats.

291fifth · November 7, 2013 11:28AM

Perhaps there was a downturn in the market at that time. Because they are so common it may not have been worth the cost of slabbing them.

BryceM · November 7, 2013 2:17PM

Goodness. Are there 28,000 people who collect slabbed 38-D buffs? Where do they all end up? I'm not sure there are 28,000 slabs on the floor of a major coin show.

SoCalBigMark · November 7, 2013 9:11PM

I can spot a 38 D from 10 feet away, they sure come nice.

keets · November 7, 2013 9:21PM

as I type there are 116 MS66 PCGS graded 1938-D Buffalo Nickels available at eBay. I remember in the mid-1960's getting AU's in change from my paper route, probably from rolls still being released.

ambro51 · November 7, 2013 9:34PM

That's an amazing figure and still only a percentage of extant raw MS examples. I feel this was a "comment" by collectors of the era that the design was monumental and in demand in the future. Too bad very few of these folks kept 50 rolls or so of mid 20s branch mint coins.... Find that guys hoard under your attic floorboards and ...

brg5658 · November 8, 2013 12:06AM

<< Goodness. Are there 28,000 people who collect slabbed 38-D buffs? Where do they all end up? I'm not sure there are 28,000 slabs on the floor of a major coin show. >>

How about the more than 200,000 PCGS graded 1881-S Morgan dollars in grades from MS63-65?? Where are all of those, and why on earth would you slab those?

BAJJERFAN · November 8, 2013 12:16AM

<< 

<< Goodness. Are there 28,000 people who collect slabbed 38-D buffs? Where do they all end up? I'm not sure there are 28,000 slabs on the floor of a major coin show. >>

How about the more than 200,000 PCGS graded 1881-S Morgan dollars in grades from MS63-65?? Where are all of those, and why on earth would you slab those?

>>

Dang good kwettun! Often wondered that myself.

originalisbest · November 8, 2013 12:49AM

Isn't it funny? I had a raw gem like 25 years ago I bought as a young collector, for like $40. Since sold or traded off, I forget when, but still need to get one for my partial Buff nickel set today. I don't feel the need to rush really.

Lakesammman · November 8, 2013 1:03AM

Well, there are probably at least 28,000 type collectors, so it makes a nice cheap type coin. Same for the 1881-S S$1.

coinlieutenant · November 8, 2013 1:55AM

I forgot what holder this is in....but it sure is pretty.

I got it for type, nothing more. Only 27,999 more collectors to find.

Billet7 · November 8, 2013 3:04AM

I've been collecting bust and seated coins the last 10 years or so, to see a coin where the population of CERTIFIED coins for a single issue (Morgan 1881-S) is probably MORE that the entire population of certified coins for the whole series (Bust quarters or dimes...possibly even seated quarters) is just MIND BLOWING!!! Actually the certified population of the 1881-S rivals the estimated population of ALL known bust quarters. Just a guestimate based on coinfacts, but I wouldn't think there are more than 100,000 bust quarters in existance.

ambro51 · November 8, 2013 4:11AM

Hone that further to relate about 5-6 thousand Vermont in total extant. I will confess to owning 1881-S Morgans though, five Pcgs ms68s.

Shamika · November 8, 2013 12:55PM

38-D's are common as dirt. Probably more slabbed examples of this date than every other date in the series.

shorecoll · November 8, 2013 11:32PM

I think a lot of those 1881-s Morgans were slabbed and sold in "investment portfolios". They were a favorite of telemarketers years ago.

mr1931S · November 9, 2013 3:09AM

Mr. Hall was big on these in earlier days when they were like $10 apiece. The issue does have some interesting mintmark varieties.

I have a lovely NGC MS65+ 1938 D/S FS-513 pop 0 in all grades.I'm still waiting for them to update the record to pop 1.

ColonelJessup · November 9, 2013 3:36AM

<< I forgot what holder this is in....but it sure is pretty.

I got it for type, nothing more. Only 27,999 more collectors to find.

>>

That's a nicely toned-over 2 point mark. Naked-eye monster! Borderline MS68? Trust your gut. Do the math. Send it in again. .

It will sticker just easily as a 67. .

InternetJunky · November 9, 2013 4:29AM

<< 

That's a nicely toned-over 2 point mark. Naked-eye monster! Borderline MS68? Trust your gut. Do the math. Send it in again. .

It will sticker just easily as a 67. .

>>

Although this is a beautiful example IMO the strike is too weak to go above a 66 for this date.

Cocoinut · November 9, 2013 4:53AM

<< 38-D's are common as dirt. >>

True. I worked in a coin shop from 1979-1983, and at any given time, we had anywhere from 5 to 25 rolls of BU 1938-D Buffs. We sold a lot of rolls, and new 38-D rolls would come in as fast as we sold them. The 1937-P was the second most common Buffalo BU roll, but the 38-D probably outnumbered them by a 5 to 1 ratio.

Jim

Lakesammman · November 9, 2013 5:20AM

The fact they are as common as dirt was stated in the OP. Everyone knows that.

What I want to know is, why so rare in specific holders??

Cocoinut · November 9, 2013 6:00AM

See this link, in which former Forum member Conder101 writes that the 2.5 and 3.5 holders were each produced for only about one week, the 2.5 in late November 1989, and the 3.5 in late December of the same year. It doesn't take much imagination to believe that very few of any one date/mint mark combination would have been graded.

Jim

JRocco · November 9, 2013 7:31AM

No idea what gen my 66 is in, but here it is.

Lakesammman · November 9, 2013 8:49AM

the 2.5 and 3.5 holders were each produced for only about one week

Have read that many times but it seems to be a guess - the 2.5's are genuinely scarce, the 3.5's common, so I'm guessing the 3.5's were made for more than a week. I've seen 20-30 per day of the 3.5's listed on ebay on occasion - not so for the 2.5 and 3.0.

JRocco - that's the 4.0.

mr1931S · November 9, 2013 3:26PM

Can someone explain what 2.5,3.5 and 4.0 means? How do you identify the holder with these numbers?

magikbilly · November 9, 2013 3:43PM

<< The fact they are as common as dirt was stated in the OP. Everyone knows that.

What I want to know is, why so rare in specific holders?? >>

Interesting question. Wonder what it could suggest.

Eric

LukeMarshall · November 9, 2013 3:59PM

<< Can someone explain what 2.5,3.5 and 4.0 means? How do you identify the holder with these numbers? >>

Get you are...

Link

LanceNewmanOCC · November 24, 2013 7:53AM

.
this is what the thread is referring to

- except diff date.

BAJJERFAN · November 24, 2013 9:29AM

LanceNewmanOCC · November 24, 2013 10:14AM

<<

>>

well we have a 2.0, 2.5 and 4.0.

who wants to post the 3.5, 1.0 and 5.0?

Lakesammman · November 25, 2013 12:01PM

Was there a period of time when the cost of certification to resulting value just wasn't worth it?? Was it higher historically during the 2.5 and 3.5 period??

CaptHenway · November 25, 2013 1:00PM

Just as a WAG, perhaps a few original bags were put through at the same time, or at a few distinct times, and it didn't happen to be when those holders were being used.

ColonelJessup · November 26, 2013 7:55AM

<< ...
Although this is a beautiful example IMO the strike is too weak to go above a 66 for this date. >>

You should have seen the strike on the MS68 I made. .

I want a ":snark;" emoticon.. Pretty please?

LanceNewmanOCC · November 26, 2013 8:18AM

<< Was there a period of time when the cost of certification to resulting value just wasn't worth it?? Was it higher historically during the 2.5 and 3.5 period?? >>

i'll venture a wild guess if you are referring to why there seems to be so few of these 2 generations.

i'd say that they weren't widely accepted due to their poor stackability and how easy the rings break. although that doesn't explain why there is more than 1 type since the 2.5/3.5 are virtually identical.
.

BAJJERFAN · November 26, 2013 8:37AM

<< Was there a period of time when the cost of certification to resulting value just wasn't worth it?? Was it higher historically during the 2.5 and 3.5 period?? >>

I doubt that was the case here.

If there are over 28,000 PCGS MS66 38-D Buffs, why are they so rare in 2.5/3.5 holders??

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