Coins made for the mint sets are struck with higher pressure than coins made for circulation.
Given that the above definition comes from the US Mint's glossary, what are the weak areas on the cent, 2005 to 2010 that determines it's a coin made for circulation. Does anyone know?
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
I think the fact of the matter is that, as cladking says, there are many of these still in storage. How do you think the pops will inflate if they're released again by the roll? Same goes with rare date Morgans, although that market is slightly more stable than moderns are, as the hoards have probably already been dispersed by now or are in strong hands that are keeping them secret for the time being. Playing the modern top-pop game is not for the weak of stomach.
<< <i>I met the guy who bid on the coin for his client. Even he was shocked his client wanted to bid that high. To be fair, the dealer did bid *slightly* higher than what his client wanted, but I think the client had made some other arrangement to balance things out.
Point is: someone else wanted that coin badly. Maybe pop 1/0 are the next "craze." >>
You need to let that guy know his client needs to have the coin reviewed by PCGS due to the spot at 4:30. Because the other bidder just may be a bit more articulate and not want that coin later down the road.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
<< <i>I think the fact of the matter is that, as cladking says, there are many of these still in storage. How do you think the pops will inflate if they're released again by the roll? Same goes with rare date Morgans, although that market is slightly more stable than moderns are, as the hoards have probably already been dispersed by now or are in strong hands that are keeping them secret for the time being. Playing the modern top-pop game is not for the weak of stomach. >>
Well, the only way to have these business strikes graded is by submitting the entire roll. In other words, how does the grader know the coin submitted came from a mint set or roll? Such a coin cannot be submitted raw with the thought, yeah, Ill just write on the form that it's a business strike and think PCGS will believe that.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
Well, here's the link for the term uncirculated. There you will find in the definition; Uncirculated coins are manufactured using the same process as circulating coins, but with quality enhancements such as slightly higher coining force, early strikes from dies,
The business strikes, also known as circulation strikes, also known as coins made for circulation are nothing more that a lesser quality of coin struck from the same dies that were used to make the higher quality coin for Mint sets.
My advice, don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation. The mint set coins are your better choice for quality. Same goes for coins made after 2010 because the US Mint is still using higher hammer pressure for the coins for the mint sets and lower pressure for the coins made for circulation.
Cheers,
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
<< <i>Well, here's the link for the term uncirculated. There you will find in the definition; Uncirculated coins are manufactured using the same process as circulating coins, but with quality enhancements such as slightly higher coining force, early strikes from dies,
The business strikes, also known as circulation strikes, also known as coins made for circulation are nothing more that a lesser quality of coin struck from the same dies that were used to make the higher quality coin for Mint sets.
My advice, don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation. The mint set coins are your better choice for quality. Same goes for coins made after 2010 because the US Mint is still using higher hammer pressure for the coins for the mint sets and lower pressure for the coins made for circulation.
>>
The mint has been using enhancements to strike mint set coins since they sent the old proof coin presses to San Francisco to make SMS coins in 1965. Year in and year out they have used higher pressures and lower speeds to bring out all the detail of the dies. They also swap out dies at the very first sign of wear (~30,000 strikes) rather than using them for up to a couple million strikes like the dies for circulating coins. Often the dies will get special treatment which can include basining. Planchets are sometimes polished or, more commonly, burnished. Mint set coins are washed and dried after coining.
Mint set coins aren't always very good because they're often banged up but they are al- most always well made. Of course there are wide variations in quality within the mint sets and in the circulating issues and all moderns don't appear in the mint sets. But with relativ- ely few exceptions the finest of each date and mint mark will come from a mint set. There's no way to positively differentiate a circulation issue from a mint set coin but so few circula- tion issues of most dates survive you can almost just assume any given coin is mint set and this goes many times over if it's well made.
With the satin finish things have been complicated somewhat. Mint set dies are retired while still almost new so most of them are reused to strike circulation issues. More and more of these have been showing up in circulation for years and not every coin in the mint sets have the full SF treatment.
<< <i>daonlybg: But, did the dealer address with his customer the more serious potential issue raised by many folks here that the coin might actually be a mechanical error Satin Finish coin worth well under $100?
As always, just my 2 cents
Wondercoin >>
Wondercoin: probably not- I don't think this dealer specializes in recent modern coins, but I'm not exactly sure myself. It's not like I know the guy too well, I just met him at CSNS and spoke with him for a bit. It's possible that his client saw the sticker (as opposed to the coin) and got excited about owning such a rarity. The assumption of TPG's infallibility can prove to be quite costly, as the $4,993.75 figure shows... according to the dealer, he thought the whole pursuit was a bit irrational, but his client insisted. I guess some people have more money than they know what to do with it.
<< <i>You need to let that guy know his client needs to have the coin reviewed by PCGS due to the spot at 4:30. Because the other bidder just may be a bit more articulate and not want that coin later down the road. >>
You're absolutely correct in that the other bidder might not want it down the road. I sure wouldn't, lol. However, suppose that PCGS did review the coin. Then what? Suppose they downgraded the coin to whatever grade they saw fit. The client still loses money. Would PCGS refund him the money he chose to spend in a huge auction? Would the auction house refund him the money? I don't think anyone would, to be honest. The mistake happened when this client decided he wanted to spend whatever on getting this coin. I guess for the sake of the hobby, it's much better for PCGS to give out more accurate grading by acknowledging the carbon spot... but is this client ready to lose a huge amount of money (in his mind, anyway)? Maybe he is, idk. He did, after all, pay $5000 for a 2010-D penny..
That's a lot of money to pay for a number on a population report.
You Suck! Awarded 6/2008- 1901-O Micro O Morgan, 8/2008- 1878 VAM-123 Morgan, 9/2022 1888-O VAM-1B3 H8 Morgan | Senior Regional Representative- ANACS Coin Grading. Posted opinions on coins are my own, and are not an official ANACS opinion.
<< <i>Well, here's the link for the term uncirculated. There you will find in the definition; Uncirculated coins are manufactured using the same process as circulating coins, but with quality enhancements such as slightly higher coining force, early strikes from dies,
The business strikes, also known as circulation strikes, also known as coins made for circulation are nothing more that a lesser quality of coin struck from the same dies that were used to make the higher quality coin for Mint sets.
My advice, don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation. The mint set coins are your better choice for quality. Same goes for coins made after 2010 because the US Mint is still using higher hammer pressure for the coins for the mint sets and lower pressure for the coins made for circulation.
>>
The mint has been using enhancements to strike mint set coins since they sent the old proof coin presses to San Francisco to make SMS coins in 1965. Year in and year out they have used higher pressures and lower speeds to bring out all the detail of the dies. They also swap out dies at the very first sign of wear (~30,000 strikes) rather than using them for up to a couple million strikes like the dies for circulating coins. Often the dies will get special treatment which can include basining. Planchets are sometimes polished or, more commonly, burnished. Mint set coins are washed and dried after coining.
Mint set coins aren't always very good because they're often banged up but they are al- most always well made. Of course there are wide variations in quality within the mint sets and in the circulating issues and all moderns don't appear in the mint sets. But with relativ- ely few exceptions the finest of each date and mint mark will come from a mint set. There's no way to positively differentiate a circulation issue from a mint set coin but so few circula- tion issues of most dates survive you can almost just assume any given coin is mint set and this goes many times over if it's well made.
With the satin finish things have been complicated somewhat. Mint set dies are retired while still almost new so most of them are reused to strike circulation issues. More and more of these have been showing up in circulation for years and not every coin in the mint sets have the full SF treatment. >>
Nicely put Cladking! OK to add this to my website?
Some areas of the coiled strips of metal will get a touch more polishing to give some coins a prooflike appearance. Other than that there's nothing out of the ordinary to look for since circulating coins are exactly the same coin as received in mint sets but more inferior. Don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation!
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
<< <i> Nicely put Cladking! OK to add this to my website? >>
Sure.
<< <i>Some areas of the coiled strips of metal will get a touch more polishing to give some coins a prooflike appearance. Other than that there's nothing out of the ordinary to look for since circulating coins are exactly the same coin as received in mint sets but more inferior. Don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation! >>
Until '86 I suspect the majority of polished planchets were accidently polished and a few were stray or rejected proof planchets. But, they started burnishing some planchets for the mint sets when they got the equipment around 1986.
Generally, I agree that finding Gems in mint sets is like shooting fish in a barrel. In theory you can find just as good in circulation but in practice finding coins of similar quality can be almost impossible. A few coins have to come from rolls because there are no mint sets and some mint coins can be so bad that you need to search rolls but in most cases most of the Gems and all of the finest coins come from mint sets. The fact rolls can be highly elusive just makes this all the more true.
Comments
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
Given that the above definition comes from the US Mint's glossary, what are the weak areas on the cent, 2005 to 2010 that determines it's a coin made for circulation. Does anyone know?
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>I met the guy who bid on the coin for his client. Even he was shocked his client wanted to bid that high. To be fair, the dealer did bid *slightly* higher than what his client wanted, but I think the client had made some other arrangement to balance things out.
Point is: someone else wanted that coin badly. Maybe pop 1/0 are the next "craze." >>
You need to let that guy know his client needs to have the coin reviewed by PCGS due to the spot at 4:30. Because the other bidder just may be a bit more articulate and not want that coin later down the road.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>I think the fact of the matter is that, as cladking says, there are many of these still in storage. How do you think the pops will inflate if they're released again by the roll? Same goes with rare date Morgans, although that market is slightly more stable than moderns are, as the hoards have probably already been dispersed by now or are in strong hands that are keeping them secret for the time being. Playing the modern top-pop game is not for the weak of stomach. >>
Well, the only way to have these business strikes graded is by submitting the entire roll. In other words, how does the grader know the coin submitted came from a mint set or roll? Such a coin cannot be submitted raw with the thought, yeah, Ill just write on the form that it's a business strike and think PCGS will believe that.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
The business strikes, also known as circulation strikes, also known as coins made for circulation are nothing more that a lesser quality of coin struck from the same dies that were used to make the higher quality coin for Mint sets.
My advice, don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation. The mint set coins are your better choice for quality. Same goes for coins made after 2010 because the US Mint is still using higher hammer pressure for the coins for the mint sets and lower pressure for the coins made for circulation.
Cheers,
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>Well, here's the link for the term uncirculated. There you will find in the definition; Uncirculated coins are manufactured using the same process as circulating coins, but with quality enhancements such as slightly higher coining force, early strikes from dies,
The business strikes, also known as circulation strikes, also known as coins made for circulation are nothing more that a lesser quality of coin struck from the same dies that were used to make the higher quality coin for Mint sets.
My advice, don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation. The mint set coins are your better choice for quality. Same goes for coins made after 2010 because the US Mint is still using higher hammer pressure for the coins for the mint sets and lower pressure for the coins made for circulation.
>>
The mint has been using enhancements to strike mint set coins since they sent the old
proof coin presses to San Francisco to make SMS coins in 1965. Year in and year out they
have used higher pressures and lower speeds to bring out all the detail of the dies. They
also swap out dies at the very first sign of wear (~30,000 strikes) rather than using them
for up to a couple million strikes like the dies for circulating coins. Often the dies will get
special treatment which can include basining. Planchets are sometimes polished or, more
commonly, burnished. Mint set coins are washed and dried after coining.
Mint set coins aren't always very good because they're often banged up but they are al-
most always well made. Of course there are wide variations in quality within the mint sets
and in the circulating issues and all moderns don't appear in the mint sets. But with relativ-
ely few exceptions the finest of each date and mint mark will come from a mint set. There's
no way to positively differentiate a circulation issue from a mint set coin but so few circula-
tion issues of most dates survive you can almost just assume any given coin is mint set and
this goes many times over if it's well made.
With the satin finish things have been complicated somewhat. Mint set dies are retired while
still almost new so most of them are reused to strike circulation issues. More and more of
these have been showing up in circulation for years and not every coin in the mint sets have
the full SF treatment.
<< <i>daonlybg: But, did the dealer address with his customer the more serious potential issue raised by many folks here that the coin might actually be a mechanical error Satin Finish coin worth well under $100?
As always, just my 2 cents
Wondercoin >>
Wondercoin: probably not- I don't think this dealer specializes in recent modern coins, but I'm not exactly sure myself. It's not like I know the guy too well, I just met him at CSNS and spoke with him for a bit. It's possible that his client saw the sticker (as opposed to the coin) and got excited about owning such a rarity. The assumption of TPG's infallibility can prove to be quite costly, as the $4,993.75 figure shows... according to the dealer, he thought the whole pursuit was a bit irrational, but his client insisted. I guess some people have more money than they know what to do with it.
<< <i>You need to let that guy know his client needs to have the coin reviewed by PCGS due to the spot at 4:30. Because the other bidder just may be a bit more articulate and not want that coin later down the road. >>
You're absolutely correct in that the other bidder might not want it down the road. I sure wouldn't, lol. However, suppose that PCGS did review the coin. Then what? Suppose they downgraded the coin to whatever grade they saw fit. The client still loses money. Would PCGS refund him the money he chose to spend in a huge auction? Would the auction house refund him the money? I don't think anyone would, to be honest. The mistake happened when this client decided he wanted to spend whatever on getting this coin. I guess for the sake of the hobby, it's much better for PCGS to give out more accurate grading by acknowledging the carbon spot... but is this client ready to lose a huge amount of money (in his mind, anyway)? Maybe he is, idk. He did, after all, pay $5000 for a 2010-D penny..
Interests:
Pre-Jump Grade Project
Toned Commemoratives
<< <i>
<< <i>Well, here's the link for the term uncirculated. There you will find in the definition; Uncirculated coins are manufactured using the same process as circulating coins, but with quality enhancements such as slightly higher coining force, early strikes from dies,
The business strikes, also known as circulation strikes, also known as coins made for circulation are nothing more that a lesser quality of coin struck from the same dies that were used to make the higher quality coin for Mint sets.
My advice, don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation. The mint set coins are your better choice for quality. Same goes for coins made after 2010 because the US Mint is still using higher hammer pressure for the coins for the mint sets and lower pressure for the coins made for circulation.
>>
The mint has been using enhancements to strike mint set coins since they sent the old
proof coin presses to San Francisco to make SMS coins in 1965. Year in and year out they
have used higher pressures and lower speeds to bring out all the detail of the dies. They
also swap out dies at the very first sign of wear (~30,000 strikes) rather than using them
for up to a couple million strikes like the dies for circulating coins. Often the dies will get
special treatment which can include basining. Planchets are sometimes polished or, more
commonly, burnished. Mint set coins are washed and dried after coining.
Mint set coins aren't always very good because they're often banged up but they are al-
most always well made. Of course there are wide variations in quality within the mint sets
and in the circulating issues and all moderns don't appear in the mint sets. But with relativ-
ely few exceptions the finest of each date and mint mark will come from a mint set. There's
no way to positively differentiate a circulation issue from a mint set coin but so few circula-
tion issues of most dates survive you can almost just assume any given coin is mint set and
this goes many times over if it's well made.
With the satin finish things have been complicated somewhat. Mint set dies are retired while
still almost new so most of them are reused to strike circulation issues. More and more of
these have been showing up in circulation for years and not every coin in the mint sets have
the full SF treatment. >>
Nicely put Cladking! OK to add this to my website?
Some areas of the coiled strips of metal will get a touch more polishing to give some coins a prooflike appearance. Other than that there's nothing out of the ordinary to look for since circulating coins are exactly the same coin as received in mint sets but more inferior. Don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation!
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
<< <i>
Nicely put Cladking! OK to add this to my website? >>
Sure.
<< <i>Some areas of the coiled strips of metal will get a touch more polishing to give some coins a prooflike appearance. Other than that there's nothing out of the ordinary to look for since circulating coins are exactly the same coin as received in mint sets but more inferior. Don't waste your money on coins that were made for circulation! >>
Until '86 I suspect the majority of polished planchets were accidently polished and a few were
stray or rejected proof planchets. But, they started burnishing some planchets for the mint sets
when they got the equipment around 1986.
Generally, I agree that finding Gems in mint sets is like shooting fish in a barrel. In theory you can
find just as good in circulation but in practice finding coins of similar quality can be almost impossible.
A few coins have to come from rolls because there are no mint sets and some mint coins can be so bad
that you need to search rolls but in most cases most of the Gems and all of the finest coins come from
mint sets. The fact rolls can be highly elusive just makes this all the more true.