How Easy it is to Mislead Buyers w/ Photo Color Enhancement (AKA "Juicing)
BustHalfBrian
Posts: 4,192 ✭✭✭✭
A recent conversation with member stealer got me thinking how often eBay images could be "enhanced" without any of us even realizing until after we've purchased the coin. Today's photo-editing programs are so advanced that we're able to select just portions of an image we'd like to enhance (juice), i.e. the coin., without making it look terribly unnatural.
For veteran toned-coin collectors, it's usually pretty easy to notice when a photo's color has been enhanced, either by obvious quality distortion and/or discoloration (that "pink tint" you might see on the slab label from the saturation of colors used in an editing program), but there are ways to eliminate this "tint" altogether. With a little crop selecting, it's easy to enhance just the coin's color, avoiding the discoloration of any other portion of the image.
Examples;
Case 1) Here is a completely original, unedited version of a Morgan dollar in a slab. Note the color is rather dull and luster looks subdued.
Case 2) Here is the same photo but I've now ellipse selected (crop selected) just the coin via a free online photo editing program. Notice the color is now exaggerated, luster is bright, and the coin has much more eye-appeal.
Case 3) Here I have "juiced" the entire image (coin, slab, background). Notice the discoloration of the background (granular surface of copy stand) compared to the former case. The background is lighter and has a blue-ish pink hue to it. To veterans, it is easy to tell the color of the label is abnormal and the "pink tint" is evident.
Now, here is a side-by-side example of both Case 1 and Case 3 images. The misleading differences are obvious.
All this being said, many would still find all the images I've provided above to be perfectly acceptable and would never be suspicious of them having been juiced (Case 2 & Case 3) if they had not seen the original image in Case 1. More so, notice how deceptive the image in Case 2 could be to the buyer - no discoloration or distortion has occurred.
Unethical? Yes. But this is the reality of eBay, so it is paramount that we beware of cases like these and know how to spot when an image may have been juiced. Personally, for the very reasons I mentioned, I avoid purchasing toned coins on eBay altogether.
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Additional comparisons between original and "juiced" photos;
edit for syntax
For veteran toned-coin collectors, it's usually pretty easy to notice when a photo's color has been enhanced, either by obvious quality distortion and/or discoloration (that "pink tint" you might see on the slab label from the saturation of colors used in an editing program), but there are ways to eliminate this "tint" altogether. With a little crop selecting, it's easy to enhance just the coin's color, avoiding the discoloration of any other portion of the image.
Examples;
Case 1) Here is a completely original, unedited version of a Morgan dollar in a slab. Note the color is rather dull and luster looks subdued.
Case 2) Here is the same photo but I've now ellipse selected (crop selected) just the coin via a free online photo editing program. Notice the color is now exaggerated, luster is bright, and the coin has much more eye-appeal.
Case 3) Here I have "juiced" the entire image (coin, slab, background). Notice the discoloration of the background (granular surface of copy stand) compared to the former case. The background is lighter and has a blue-ish pink hue to it. To veterans, it is easy to tell the color of the label is abnormal and the "pink tint" is evident.
Now, here is a side-by-side example of both Case 1 and Case 3 images. The misleading differences are obvious.
All this being said, many would still find all the images I've provided above to be perfectly acceptable and would never be suspicious of them having been juiced (Case 2 & Case 3) if they had not seen the original image in Case 1. More so, notice how deceptive the image in Case 2 could be to the buyer - no discoloration or distortion has occurred.
Unethical? Yes. But this is the reality of eBay, so it is paramount that we beware of cases like these and know how to spot when an image may have been juiced. Personally, for the very reasons I mentioned, I avoid purchasing toned coins on eBay altogether.
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Additional comparisons between original and "juiced" photos;
edit for syntax
Lurking and learning since 2010. Full-time professional numismatist based in SoCal.
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Comments
bob
Very informative and helpful.
Erik
Amat Colligendo Focum
Top 10 • FOR SALE
I see nothing wrong with editing them to where the image looks like the coin in hand. I for one have found it
next to impossible to get the original photo to look like it does in hand with out some editing.
I personally believe that the unedited images still look better in hand but not like your "juiced" imaged.
Therefore I would say that it is in between the two images.
I also have to think that one needs to learn to interpret what the real toning and luster looks like, sometimes
you win and sometimes you lose but then again life it of itself is a crap shoot
Very good examples btw.
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CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
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Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
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More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC
<< <i>While I do agree that there are many coins that get photoshoped or edited too much, in my opinion
I see nothing wrong with editing them to where the image looks like the coin in hand. I for one have found it
next to impossible to get the original photo to look like it does in hand with out some editing.
I personally believe that the unedited images still look better in hand but not like your "juiced" imaged.
Therefore I would say that it is in between the two images.
I also have to think that one needs to learn to interpret what the real toning and luster looks like, sometimes
you win and sometimes you lose but then again life it of itself is a crap shoot
Very good examples btw. >>
I agree, coinsarefun. The OP is directed more at the eBay sellers that go overboard by over-saturating their images, to the point where it is misleading to bidders because their images suggest a vibrant, colorful coin, when in-hand it's really a lightly-toned coin with average eye-appeal.
I agree getting color accurate on a "raw" original photo is difficult, and editing is often (if not always) needed to accurately portray the coin. This is absolutely acceptable. I even "refine" my own images a tad when I feel they don't quite capture the coin as it looks in-hand.
But like I said - just don't go overboard
2) I also learned that in many ways, buying a coin from an image is no different from buying a coin from a Coin World ad circa 1970.
3) If I, or someone I trust can't see the coin, I don't buy it.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
<< <i>1) I haven't bothered looking at e-bay in fifteen years. >>
Wow. I wish I could say that. I can't seem to cut the tether. Someday soon perhaps.
<< <i>2) I also learned that in many ways, buying a coin from an image is no different from buying a coin from a Coin World ad circa 1970. >>
Same old issues but with an updated scenario to fit our modern-day setting. I can dig that. Thirty years from now our kids will complain about the insecurities of buying via holographic virtual reality auctions. It's all a cycle!
Amat Colligendo Focum
Top 10 • FOR SALE
I make my living making killings on coins, tokens and medals I buy on eBay that are way undervalued and reselling through a number of venues.
The altered photos of these coins end up being a lot of returned items from me to the seller. Because of the photo games that can be played I only buy from sellers with a return policy.
See the thread I just posted about my most recent eBay purchases. A Washington North Wales 4 stars below harp, 1794 Flowing Hair Cent Starred reverse and others. Sometimes the very bad pictures that get posted work for me. The poor quality of photos posted makes it difficult to see the VERY valuable attributes on coins, so nobody bids on a mega coin but me.
Always more to know!
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
However, a key point missing here is what lighting the buyer uses when they get the coin. Many times coins will look like the original image if viewed in ambient light. However, view the coin under a 100W incandescent like graders use, and the coin will come alive and look like one of your saturated images. So, it's more complex than a simple ethical vs unethical.
The problem with buying toned coins off eBay is not only from program enhancement of pictures
but also from camera and lighting angle. The biggest is from the angle and the type of lighting used
when taking the pictures. I have learned over the pass 14 years of constantly buying & selling on
eBay I feel there is a safe way to purchase toned coins, DON"T DO IT! Well not at any large dollar
amount at least.
As we've seen here on this forum where a member will ask, "How will it look in hand?" as I myself
have asked too, about a coin in question is posted and everyone makes a comment and when it arrives
it's not even close to the auction picture. You must use " Due Diligence " when buying a toner from a
picture but I think that most real tone coin collectors know that. As pointed out, check the seller's return
policy before you buy.
The OP has posted very informative comparisons and should be remembered when buying any coin not just toned
ones from any auction site but mostly eBay since there is no uniform pictures like on Great Collections, Teletrade,
HA.com or any other site that uses just one form of posting pictures.
Thanks to the OP, and we also must remember that silver is one of the toughest things to photograph and get "right".
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>Interesting post.
However, a key point missing here is what lighting the buyer uses when they get the coin. Many times coins will look like the original image if viewed in ambient light. However, view the coin under a 100W incandescent like graders use, and the coin will come alive and look like one of your saturated images. So, it's more complex than a simple ethical vs unethical. >>
Often a photo does not come out looking like the coin would look in hand under the lighting that a grader or collector would use. Adjusting color or brightness is not misleading if done to make the image look more accurate.
<< <i>
<< <i>Interesting post.
However, a key point missing here is what lighting the buyer uses when they get the coin. Many times coins will look like the original image if viewed in ambient light. However, view the coin under a 100W incandescent like graders use, and the coin will come alive and look like one of your saturated images. So, it's more complex than a simple ethical vs unethical. >>
Often a photo does not come out looking like the coin would look in hand under the lighting that a grader or collector would use. Adjusting color or brightness is not misleading if done to make the image look more accurate. >>
I have been told by others who know a lot more about the subject than I do, that it's a rare coin pic that doesn't need some sort of tweaking.
<< <i>
<< <i>Interesting post.
However, a key point missing here is what lighting the buyer uses when they get the coin. Many times coins will look like the original image if viewed in ambient light. However, view the coin under a 100W incandescent like graders use, and the coin will come alive and look like one of your saturated images. So, it's more complex than a simple ethical vs unethical. >>
Often a photo does not come out looking like the coin would look in hand under the lighting that a grader or collector would use. Adjusting color or brightness is not misleading if done to make the image look more accurate. >>
Read my reply to coinsarefun's comment on the first page regarding this.
Thanks for the valuable input and kind words, all
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
<< <i>Not only is it extremely easy, but eBay even has free built-in editing tools when you go through the upload process to list your item. In addition to crop, you can enhance brightness, contrast and sharpness - all within the web browser. >>
Not Good!
Rob
Successful Trades with: Coincast, MICHAELDIXON
Successful Purchases from: Manorcourtman, Meltdown
Point is, you really need to see coins "in-hand" and obtain a clear right of refusal from the owner before any purchase agreement is made.
Empty Nest Collection
<< <i>
<< <i>Interesting post.
However, a key point missing here is what lighting the buyer uses when they get the coin. Many times coins will look like the original image if viewed in ambient light. However, view the coin under a 100W incandescent like graders use, and the coin will come alive and look like one of your saturated images. So, it's more complex than a simple ethical vs unethical. >>
Often a photo does not come out looking like the coin would look in hand under the lighting that a grader or collector would use. Adjusting color or brightness is not misleading if done to make the image look more accurate. >>
I agree with both replies above.
I admit that there was a time when I'd look at the label colors in an effort to judge the accuracy of the coin colors....but as the OP illustrated that's very easy to get around, too. Nice post and Morgan, too.
What free software did you use? Nice photos!
As with everything that is sold the seller is going to usually try to show it to be as attractive as possible. Just check out any fashion add.
Successful card BST transactions with cbcnow, brogurt, gstarling, Bravesfan 007, and rajah 424.
Taylor
I am a YN and I do not want anybody to question my IQ Level! I don't know everything and came here to learn!