CDN Newsletter question CPG

Coin Finder

What does CPG stand for?

So the "monthy Review" published by CDN, is not the Greysheet correct? These are retail prices?

Dealers I go to have the old small Greysheet and now the big Greysheet. Its kinda of confusing..

morgandollar1878

CPG = Consumer Price Guide
The monthly review is the new version of the Greysheet. Everything has been combined in to one printing per month.

JohnF

@thebigeng said:
What does CPG stand for?

So the "monthy Review" published by CDN, is not the Greysheet correct? These are retail prices?

Dealers I go to have the old small Greysheet and now the big Greysheet. Its kinda of confusing..

CPG stands for "Collector's Price Guidance". CPG values are based directly on the wholesale Greysheet & Greensheet values.

"CPG Coin & Currency Market Review" is a quarterly publication with these values published.

The new "Monthly Greysheet" combines the former weekly Greysheet, Monthly Supplement, Quarterly I,II,III, Bluesheet and Goldsheet (modern China issues) into a single monthly edition of wholesale values.

It's a little confusing in the transition, but a LOT less confusing than explaining to potential subscribers why we created all those different sheets.

Coin Finder

Thanks guys! I guess my concern is this. I have a 1881 cc pcgs ms64 CAC morgan. IN the small old greysheet it is priced at $485. IN the new greysheet it is higher and then follow the column to the cac part and it is above $700..... No one will pay it becasue they have the old greysheet number.., In fact 20% back that number.

TwoSides2aCoin

What people pay and what the guides say rarely jive. ( in my estimation). But we need the calibrating tools, just the same.

Coin Finder

Well its seems some folks sell generic stuff to Heritage for example, and they publish their buy prices. So what are they using? Old grey sheet or new one? Probably the new one as those prices for generic stuff doesn't change that much...

ricko

Price guides are just that... guides. And during the changeover that is occurring with the CDN literature, there will be confusion for a while. Some dealers I have seen at shows, were using sheets that were six months old...now the situation may be even more dramatic. Cheers, RickO

Coin Finder

@ricko Exactly!! This is what I am getting at. There is lots of confusion. I have been talking to a lot of what I will call "old time dealers", dealers who have been doing this since the 70's or 80's... They are telling me they are not subscribing until this all shakes out. Now this is what they are saying... I think in time the old small greysheet will be to old to be relevant.

JohnF

@thebigeng said:
Thanks guys! I guess my concern is this. I have a 1881 cc pcgs ms64 CAC morgan. IN the small old greysheet it is priced at $485. IN the new greysheet it is higher and then follow the column to the cac part and it is above $700..... No one will pay it becasue they have the old greysheet number.., In fact 20% back that number.

Actually you are confusing the Monthly Greysheet (wholesale) with the CPG Price Guide (retail). The 1881-CC $1 MS64 CAC is valued at $550 in the Greysheet and $715 in the CPG Guide. This forms a logical buy-sell spread for dealers and collector to work under.

JohnF

@ricko said:
Price guides are just that... guides. And during the changeover that is occurring with the CDN literature, there will be confusion for a while. Some dealers I have seen at shows, were using sheets that were six months old...now the situation may be even more dramatic. Cheers, RickO

Agreed. Not a good idea to use old sheets. Prices are constantly in flux in this market.

Cougar1978

They greysheet (CDN Bid) is wholesale. My offers for coins presented to me at my table at shows are usually in a range between grey and blue sheet bid based on market conditions. The CPG represents a fair retail price for buyers based on CDN Bid. I find it very useful in pricing many coins. I input this number in my pricing spreadsheet along with other FMV sources - CW Trends, TPG Price Guide. For me CDN Bid has always been my markup platform of choice and the CPG is the super tool I have been looking for. I use the CDN App which is a super real-time tool.

I love the new format it is a fantastic innovation and reflects the superior organization skills of the new owners - everything in one place, once a month. They have done a fantastic job both in much needed updating expansion and organization.

Cougar1978

@thebigeng said:
Thanks guys! I guess my concern is this. I have a 1881 cc pcgs ms64 CAC morgan. IN the small old greysheet it is priced at $485. IN the new greysheet it is higher and then follow the column to the cac part and it is above $700..... No one will pay it becasue they have the old greysheet number.., In fact 20% back that number.

The number above $700 is a retail number for CAC. Whether they offer you the wholesale CAC bid reported in the sheet or not is at the disgression of the dealer and what they think they can sell the coin for. If u want sell at your price suggest an eBay store. Their offer based on what they think sell for and make plan markup - ROI. What some sheet or price guide says is not the trump card - what dealer need for material is / can flip it for is assuming it meets their standards and current market conditions offer positive outlook.

I have monthly subscr to GS and Greensheet. The app is free along w CPG. I can get grey, blue, and CPG w my app from my phone. It gives CAC bid and CPG on this issue.

It costs me up to 17 pct operate on eBay with my commission and non eBay OPEX tacked on need 32 pct margin or 1.47 MU over cost as minimum MUF. So on your coin assuming my target sell is $725 would not want pay more than than $493. Shows are different - local show fee is $250 so if sales GM less lost money / wasted my time. Lately w Oil Price Depression outlook here in Houston crapshoot.

Coin Finder

Ok thanks everyone, I get it now. This thread has been very helpful. Unfortunately there are on occasion some bad players with misinformation. I am liking the new format better and better. This reminds me a little bit of 1986 and the whole slabbing controversy.

Cougar1978

Pricing can be complex plus values can change rapidly. Any price guide is just that a guide. When in doubt I just use cost or BV plus. Many dealer price lists good source too.

Many I have noticed like deer in headlights in selling experience and expertise. It takes playing both sides of ball.

CF a fantastic price research source. I don’t just look at one.

giantsfan20

For anybody who has a CPG other than Winter 2018 ? version.

Were their any price changes made in any series?

My copy shows no +_- etc.

Thanks for any replies

JohnF

@giantsfan20 said:
For anybody who has a CPG other than Winter version does it indicate any plus or minus changes in any series?

The version does not show any changes.

We don't include price movements in the CPG at this time. We show price movements in the Monthly Greysheet, which is geared towards professionals.

RogerB

CPG = "Cherry Picker's Guide"

oih82w8

@RogerB said:
CPG = "Cherry Picker's Guide"

This is what I thought as well.

koynekwest

Yes-"CPG" is Cherypicker's guide to me.

giantsfan20

So if prices do not change then no need to purchase upcoming issues or subscribe since prices are the same.

JohnF

@giantsfan20 said:
So if prices do not change then no need to purchase upcoming issues or subscribe since prices are the same.

the prices change. we just don't note the changes with up/down arrows as we do in the wholesale sheets.

giantsfan20

It would be helpfull to most if a plus-minus was used.. That you could look at a glance and say Mercury Dimes are down in grade x or up etc for all the series and trends as to which prices are going for all areas.

CCGGG

I pulled it down today and printed off the entire package to look over. (I like a hardcopy) What a waste of time, money, paper and ink. I only needed a few pages and certainly not all the advertisements. I'll be selective of what pages I print in the future. On the positive side, even though the fonts are still small, they are easier to read.

hchcoin

@JohnF

Any chance the CPG will get staples? I find it hard to keep the pages from sliding all over the place.

Coinosaurus

@giantsfan20 said:
It would be helpfull to most if a plus-minus was used.. That you could look at a glance and say Mercury Dimes are down in grade x or up etc for all the series and trends as to which prices are going for all areas.

Bear in mind that CPG can be freely accessed via the CDN app, and other outlets such as the monthly Numismatist. CDN is a commercial venture and likely wants to reserve a few features for the paid (Monthly Greysheet) subscribers.

cucamongacoin

I agree with hchcoin above; a couple staples would be a great improvement. Also think their production costs are less, and advertising is up, so a better subscription price would be nice.

Coin Finder

Bluesheet is for dealers buying sight unseen correct?

JohnF

@hchcoin said:
@JohnF

Any chance the CPG will get staples? I find it hard to keep the pages from sliding all over the place.

I would love staples as well. My printer is unable to do them on their press and so far no luck finding another printer to do so. In the meantime, we are creating a plastic binder which will cover the sheets and hold all the pages in place, and staples would probably hinder that process. The binders should be available in early July.

JohnF

@thebigeng said:
Bluesheet is for dealers buying sight unseen correct?

Bluesheet values (now published inside the Monthly Greysheet with their corresponding Greysheet values) represent the "sight unseen" or "I would buy this in the holder without looking at it" value for PCGS and NGC coins. In cases where representative bids don't exist for items (quite often, actually) we designate the Bluesheet value as the lowest recent reported trade or public auction.

JohnF

@CCGGG said:
I pulled it down today and printed off the entire package to look over. (I like a hardcopy) What a waste of time, money, paper and ink. I only needed a few pages and certainly not all the advertisements. I'll be selective of what pages I print in the future. On the positive side, even though the fonts are still small, they are easier to read.

Best for folks who wish to print an entire sheet to convert from PDF download subscription to print. We will mail you the full color copy every month. It was a lot more important to have access to PDF downloads when we published new sheets every week.

JohnF

@giantsfan20 said:
It would be helpfull to most if a plus-minus was used.. That you could look at a glance and say Mercury Dimes are down in grade x or up etc for all the series and trends as to which prices are going for all areas.

This information is available in the Monthly Greysheet.

thebeav

@thebigeng said:
Well its seems some folks sell generic stuff to Heritage for example, and they publish their buy prices.

Can you tell me where these prices are published ? Thank you.......

JohnF

@thebeav said:

@thebigeng said:
Well its seems some folks sell generic stuff to Heritage for example, and they publish their buy prices.

Can you tell me where these prices are published ? Thank you.......

Best for you to contact the Heritage wholesale dept directly on that.

TwoSides2aCoin

I have no clue why I didn't say NO (on a renewed subscription), but Fig's rag got me for another year. I would encourage it. It makes my life simpler (at work). I think that signature photo of Billie is hot. She has a way of keeping customers with her correspondence.

You have an awesome publication, JohnF.

Coin Finder

Thanks John Im going to buy a subscription soon, just needed some preliminary info... I have wondered about bluesheet for a long time. I am often offered blue sheet prices for coins I am selling over the counter. But my argument is that the people can see the coin, so why use a sight unseen price?

JohnF

@thebigeng said:
Thanks John Im going to buy a subscription soon, just needed some preliminary info... I have wondered about bluesheet for a long time. I am often offered blue sheet prices for coins I am selling over the counter. But my argument is that the people can see the coin, so why use a sight unseen price?

It not the "act" of seeing the coin that makes a coin Bluesheet value, or not. It's generally the quality of the coin. So, Bluesheet now represents the "least" a coin should be worth in that holder. The spread between Bluesheet and Greysheet is where dealers can negotiate. Of course, premium quality coins, old holders, etc will often trade well above Greysheet. So these levels are meant to be indicators as many have remarked.

JohnF

@TwoSides2aCoin said:
I have no clue why I didn't say NO (on a renewed subscription), but Fig's rag got me for another year. I would encourage it. It makes my life simpler (at work). I think that signature photo of Billie is hot. She has a way of keeping customers with her correspondence.

You have an awesome publication, JohnF.

Thank you for this wonderful endorsement! Really appreciated. Billie had a chuckle as well...

Coin Finder

I guess "quality" will always be subjective regardless of Third Party Grading and CAC!! I know over the years I have gotten much more picky about what I buy and will pay the price for quality. I just do not like it when a quality coin is not treated as such when its time to sell...

amwldcoin

When I am offered Bluesheet for a coin at a show...unless it's truly a dog or one not easy to be found I tell them I will be happy to sell and ship them one at that price next week!

@thebigeng said:
Thanks John Im going to buy a subscription soon, just needed some preliminary info... I have wondered about bluesheet for a long time. I am often offered blue sheet prices for coins I am selling over the counter. But my argument is that the people can see the coin, so why use a sight unseen price?

Kkathyl

I take the PCGS price guide in the app then divide by 2 Common coins

If it is a really top notch coin, I pay what it takes to get it if I can.

asheland

After getting used to the new format I give it a thumbs up.

Veep

Really like the binder idea. My sheet travels lots of places and is in and out of the brief case a lot. It’s holding up ok but there’s another half month to go

thebeav

@JohnF said:

@thebeav said:

@thebigeng said:
Well its seems some folks sell generic stuff to Heritage for example, and they publish their buy prices.

Can you tell me where these prices are published ? Thank you.......

Best for you to contact the Heritage wholesale dept directly on that.

Thank you John. i appreciate that.
I thought that their list might have been 'published' on the website or something.

blitzdude

A coin is worth only what one is willing to pay. A sheet or guide is just that. A tool for the common human to set a reasonable value. What one may or may not be willing to pay is an entirely different story. Remember, slabs and stickers don't make a coin. It's the coin that MOST collectors are after.