Could you work with them and return the item not through ebays system? Get an RA number directly from them, and skip the ebay return process all together? This would:
1. Get your money back in full
2. Keep your ebay bucks (which i agree is a lot and important)
3. You agree not to neg them or something
Why not call that supervisor back and ask to not return through ebay? Yes they take a hit on the FVF but that's a small price for them to pay and should be worth it to them to make a customer happy and whole after their screw up.
The problem is that there is little downside for APMEX. They ship the wrong coin, you aren't happy, they refund your money. That does not compensate for the hassle and deception (intentional or unintentional), but unless/until there is a penalty for that it will most likely continue. They are a volume dealer known mainly for bullion as far as I know, so a hit here and there from their numismatic operation might be insignificant to them.
The eBay bucks thing is a complicating factor that just adds to the frustration.
If it were me, I would go into every numismatic transaction with them with my guard up. That is based on what I have read here on the Forum.
@leothelyon said:
Discernible collectors should know better about taking coin descriptions and pictures at face value. One eventually learns what that next question is that needs to be asked with transactions. Getting to that level of agreement with the play of words between the buyer and seller is challenging, adventurous but frustrating when we lose. So with every new transaction, a better strategy/attack may be necessary until we win more times than we lose.
Leo
This has nothing to do with being a discernible collector or bubba jim with money burning a hole in his pocket. In this case, there was a specific listing that clearly stated the buyer would be getting a PCGS coin is X grade with a gold CAC sticker. I don't think anyone can disagree with this, even APMEX if they are truly an honest seller. Please go back and read the listing and tell us that this is not what should be expected.
Best, SH
Well, as I have learned, if I'm about to blow $700 on a coin with a seller I have never met, alone from ever receiving one iota of communication from them, I ask questions and get on board with what exactly I'm buying. Having a couple of questions answered could have avoided all this frustration. Large operations such as Apmex likely have people packaging up coins who are not very knowledgeable about collecting coins. There are a ton of people who buy coins and the few that don't get exactly what they thought they should get don't care or do anything about it. And Apmex and other large companies know this and try to unload coins this way. Unfortunately for them, this tactic has backfired with the OP. But as a buyer and after one goes through this garbage a half dozen times, you don't take descriptions and photos at face value, you ask questions. Sure, I'd like to live in this perfect world you speak of but it's not always cut and dry.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
@ACop said:
Depends on whats right here. I am certain they will issue a refund. But ill be out ebay bucks. The guy I spoke to didnt understand ebay bucks. Oh well. They are banned going forward.
Stay off eBay, if you can't handle a mistake here and there. And you are out ebay bucks because you get a refund? And you are po'd because you didn't get something for free?
Mistakes happen. Patterns of behavior are not mistakes.
Plus, it's not a simple mistake easily rectified, nor is it the ebay bucks exactly.
By now having $100 removed from the balance at the end of the quarter, the OP's eBay bucks balance is in a deficit situation. Before the OP gets any more eBay bucks offers (not something for 'free' but an actual customer benefit), s/he must now generate another $100 in ebay bucks. That means $10K of non-'bonus' purchases, and with a negative balance there will be no bonuses. So, s/he is out some tangible benefits due to APMEX's shenanigans.
And yes, those who peruse these boards know that APMEX is getting more and more of bad reputation on their 'numismatic sales'. Using their otherwise good reputation (deserved or otherwise....I'm pretty disgusted with their 'service' on that end too) for bullion to expand into numismatics is not a bad thing. But then not conducting themselves up to that standard is just plain dirty.
I used to be a big fan of APMEX...not so much for a couple of reasons based on personal dealings. Add in MULTIPLE threads on the bait-and-switch in such a tiny part of the numismatic world certainly is just another reason. Not worth the popcorn tins to deal with at this point, just as I'm sure they are less than caring about losing little old me as a customer.
edited to add: don't forget to file as a SNAD, so they have to pay the return postage.
@jpcz said:
Could you work with them and return the item not through ebays system? Get an RA number directly from them, and skip the ebay return process all together? This would:
1. Get your money back in full
2. Keep your ebay bucks (which i agree is a lot and important)
3. You agree not to neg them or something
Why not call that supervisor back and ask to not return through ebay? Yes they take a hit on the FVF but that's a small price for them to pay and should be worth it to them to make a customer happy and whole after their screw up.
I think this is a great idea and definitely worth trying.
I would return the coin and get a full refund. Shipping to return it should be paid by APMEX since it was their fault.
But this eBay bucks whining is over the top in my opinion. You return the coin, you lose the eBay bucks. If I bought that coin and returned it for this reason, I would expect to lose my bucks. That's just how eBay bucks work. You should lose the bucks if you return the item for any reason. If you return an item you buy with a credit card, you lose the points there too.
@jpcz said:
Could you work with them and return the item not through ebays system? Get an RA number directly from them, and skip the ebay return process all together? This would:
1. Get your money back in full
2. Keep your ebay bucks (which i agree is a lot and important)
3. You agree not to neg them or something
Why not call that supervisor back and ask to not return through ebay? Yes they take a hit on the FVF but that's a small price for them to pay and should be worth it to them to make a customer happy and whole after their screw up.
I dont know if they would go for this as they will then be the ones losing money on ebay seller fees.
@totally said:
I would return the coin and get a full refund. Shipping to return it should be paid by APMEX since it was their fault.
But this eBay bucks whining is over the top in my opinion. You return the coin, you lose the eBay bucks. If I bought that coin and returned it for this reason, I would expect to lose my bucks. That's just how eBay bucks work. You should lose the bucks if you return the item for any reason. If you return an item you buy with a credit card, you lose the points there too.
Enough people have complained about this that I’m sure they’re aware of it. At this point, they are doing it on purpose. I will still use them for rolls of silver, modern coins or 1/10th ounce gold eagles but not certified coins collector coins.
"I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
@totally said:
I would return the coin and get a full refund. Shipping to return it should be paid by APMEX since it was their fault.
But this eBay bucks whining is over the top in my opinion. You return the coin, you lose the eBay bucks. If I bought that coin and returned it for this reason, I would expect to lose my bucks. That's just how eBay bucks work. You should lose the bucks if you return the item for any reason. If you return an item you buy with a credit card, you lose the points there too.
This will cost me as much as $600 in ebay bucks.
How? If you got $100 in promotional eBay bucks for it when you purchased it and you are getting those $100 removed, I fail to see how it is going to cost you $600 in eBay bucks...
Did you guys read the posts about not getting any ebay bucks promotions until I spend $10k and make up the $100 I wil be in the negative for? That will span at least 1 quarter maybe 2. Thats countless promotions within 2 quarters varying between 8 and 15% with 500 maxes each quarter that I wont be eligible because of this putting me negative. So in fact this can have ramification over $1000.
Maybe I can simply it for those ignoring those posts.
This return will make my ebay bucks balance NEGATIVE $100
Being negative DISQUALIFIES you from any promotions until you get it back to $0
The only way to add money to it is via purchases.
My purchases will only earn me 1% ebay bucks because #2
I will have to spend $10,000 to earn $100 that go towards #1
Therefore...I will only earn $100 on 10k spent. If I spend that over 2 quarters, thats $1000 I will be losing out on that I would have gotten for those 10k spent, 500 each quarter, with an average of 8% in ebay bucks had I not been disqualified.
@ACop said:
Maybe I can simply it for those ignoring those posts.
This return will make my ebay bucks balance NEGATIVE $100
Being negative DISQUALIFIES you from any promotions until you get it back to $0
The only way to add money to it is via purchases.
My purchases will only earn me 1% ebay bucks because #2
I will have to spend $10,000 to earn $100 that go towards #1
Therefore...I will only earn $100 on 10k spent. If I spend that over 2 quarters, thats $1000 I will be losing out on that I would have gotten for those 10k spent, 500 each quarter, with an average of 8% in ebay bucks had I not been disqualified.
Not ignoring them, just not sure about the source. I have not heard anything official from eBay on this subject. I've gotten bonus offers when I'm maxed out, so it's not clear that the bucks balance has anything to do with the promotion.
@ACop said:
Maybe I can simply it for those ignoring those posts.
This return will make my ebay bucks balance NEGATIVE $100
Being negative DISQUALIFIES you from any promotions until you get it back to $0
The only way to add money to it is via purchases.
My purchases will only earn me 1% ebay bucks because #2
I will have to spend $10,000 to earn $100 that go towards #1
Therefore...I will only earn $100 on 10k spent. If I spend that over 2 quarters, thats $1000 I will be losing out on that I would have gotten for those 10k spent, 500 each quarter, with an average of 8% in ebay bucks had I not been disqualified.
if you are buying stuff open a brand new account . No one cares about a buyers feedback score. Anyway if you are into ebay bucks then you should have a half a dozen buying accounts already
Best solution is to just end the whole ebay bonus bucks program, at least until it is once again viewed as a bonus promotion and not an entitlement.
It's simple math; return a bonus buck eligible item and you return the bonus bucks. If you spent them already, yes, you now have a negative balance until your purchases once again make it positive.
I am not sure of the answer, but is it possible to not spend the $100 eBay bucks so they are there to be pulled back once the return is processed?
In any case, this thread has deteriorated into people sniping at each other rather than APMEX. I don't see any progress being made - just some rants. OP was wronged, will get $ back but get cheated on eBay bucks, end of story.
The only other option is to hire a lawyer to go after APMEX for damages (or maybe small claims court?). It MIGHT be possible to get eBay to address the bucks issue but I would not hold my breathe on that one.
@ACop said:
Maybe I can simply it for those ignoring those posts.
This return will make my ebay bucks balance NEGATIVE $100
Being negative DISQUALIFIES you from any promotions until you get it back to $0
The only way to add money to it is via purchases.
My purchases will only earn me 1% ebay bucks because #2
I will have to spend $10,000 to earn $100 that go towards #1
Therefore...I will only earn $100 on 10k spent. If I spend that over 2 quarters, thats $1000 I will be losing out on that I would have gotten for those 10k spent, 500 each quarter, with an average of 8% in ebay bucks had I not been disqualified.
Not ignoring them, just not sure about the source. I have not heard anything official from eBay on this subject. I've gotten bonus offers when I'm maxed out, so it's not clear that the bucks balance has anything to do with the promotion.
He is 100% accurate about the ramifications of a negative ebucks balance, 100%
Acop.....have you tried contacting ebay to see if they can just deduct the ebucks amount now?
I ask because I am in same boat but won't be able to spend time to contact them, or try to, until next week
@jpcz said:
Could you work with them and return the item not through ebays system? Get an RA number directly from them, and skip the ebay return process all together? This would:
1. Get your money back in full
2. Keep your ebay bucks (which i agree is a lot and important)
3. You agree not to neg them or something
Why not call that supervisor back and ask to not return through ebay? Yes they take a hit on the FVF but that's a small price for them to pay and should be worth it to them to make a customer happy and whole after their screw up.
I think this is a great idea and definitely worth trying.
They should suffer loss when they engage in fraud, it is the only way that the greedy, gaping, grasping maws of corporately shielded companies will understand the consequences of ripping people off. Because surely there are dozens of people who shuffled on without leaving problem feedback not properly turning their upset and anger against the perpetrators. This is a civic duty, not a matter of preserving "peace of mind", maintaining the status quo, "moving on", letting bygones be bygones. When I felt that PCGS was dragging its feet well after 90 days on a clear guarantee issue that JA at cac was a clear case, I filed with the state of CA. Not that it did any good as PCGS did not respond to the issue. But they did take it more seriously.
I would file with your state AG/consumer affairs which is the right civic duty thing to do addressing many of the concerns on this and other threads. It may cause reform. But APMEX gets more favorable deals with ebay, there is no way they are paying the standard fees that other top rated powersellers are.
I would much rather see MCM do well as they are a top notch company.
@derryb said:
I have received bonus buck offers while my ebay bucks balance was negative.
I'll go out on a limb and say it was either a tiny amount or the immediate quarter after......if it is prolonged, more than the quarter after, the offers stop. I have an account to prove it
Edited to add...,,that account's negative ebucks balance was also due to an apmex return. A cleaned gold coin when description was for a problem free unc
@jpcz said:
Could you work with them and return the item not through ebays system? Get an RA number directly from them, and skip the ebay return process all together? This would:
1. Get your money back in full
2. Keep your ebay bucks (which i agree is a lot and important)
3. You agree not to neg them or something
Why not call that supervisor back and ask to not return through ebay? Yes they take a hit on the FVF but that's a small price for them to pay and should be worth it to them to make a customer happy and whole after their screw up.
I dont know if they would go for this as they will then be the ones losing money on ebay seller fees.
I don't know either, so I'd suggest you ask them. Only way to find out, what's the worst they can say??
And don't spend the eBay bucks. If you know you're returning, and you know eBay will take it back, don't spend it and your acct won't go negative. You can still buy on eBay and not use the bucks towards the purchase.
@derryb said:
I have received bonus buck offers while my ebay bucks balance was negative.
I'll go out on a limb and say it was either a tiny amount or the immediate quarter after......if it is prolonged, more than the quarter after, the offers stop. I have an account to prove it
Edited to add...,,that account's negative ebucks balance was also due to an apmex return. A cleaned gold coin when description was for a problem free unc
Again, these are both anecdotes and neither is definitive. I've never had a negative balance, yet I went a year with no offers and then got 4 in 4 weeks. I'm not sure anyone except eBay knows exactly why people do or don't get offers. I can't find anything on eBay or anything but speculation anywhere else on the internet.
It's also worth pointing out, as @jpcz said: a return will not make the account go negative unless you've already spent the ill-gotten booty.
@derryb said:
I have received bonus buck offers while my ebay bucks balance was negative.
I'll go out on a limb and say it was either a tiny amount or the immediate quarter after......if it is prolonged, more than the quarter after, the offers stop. I have an account to prove it
Edited to add...,,that account's negative ebucks balance was also due to an apmex return. A cleaned gold coin when description was for a problem free unc
Again, these are both anecdotes and neither is definitive. I've never had a negative balance, yet I went a year with no offers and then got 4 in 4 weeks. I'm not sure anyone except eBay knows exactly why people do or don't get offers. I can't find anything on eBay or anything but speculation anywhere else on the internet.
It's also worth pointing out, as @jpcz said: a return will not make the account go negative unless you've already spent the ill-gotten booty.
After further review why not just keep the coin and therefore keep your ebay bucks since they seem so important to you? After all this fretting isn't even about the coin , we're just talking bout a silly little sticker. Did they not offer to swap the one they sent for one with the sticker? Maybe they can refund you the $14 and you could send in for the sticker yourself?
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
@blitzdude said:
After further review why not just keep the coin and therefore keep your ebay bucks since they seem so important to you? After all this fretting isn't even about the coin , we're just talking bout a silly little sticker. Did they not offer to swap the one they sent for one with the sticker? Maybe they can refund you the $14 and you could send in for the sticker yourself?
I agree its a silly little sticker but it has an effect on value. Let me know when you are looking to buy some coins. I'll show you some beauts with gold stickers on them. That's not the coin you will actually receive after paying me a premium for it, but hey thats cool right?
@ACop said:
Maybe I can simply it for those ignoring those posts.
This return will make my ebay bucks balance NEGATIVE $100
Being negative DISQUALIFIES you from any promotions until you get it back to $0
The only way to add money to it is via purchases.
My purchases will only earn me 1% ebay bucks because #2
I will have to spend $10,000 to earn $100 that go towards #1
Therefore...I will only earn $100 on 10k spent. If I spend that over 2 quarters, thats $1000 I will be losing out on that I would have gotten for those 10k spent, 500 each quarter, with an average of 8% in ebay bucks had I not been disqualified.
You started this thread before the ebay bucks were given out. Therefore, you knew you could lose $100 bucks when returning it. Meaning, if you did not keep $100 bucks in the account to prevent it going in the negative, that's on you. They are not costing you a dime, sorry.
@ACop said:
Maybe I can simply it for those ignoring those posts.
This return will make my ebay bucks balance NEGATIVE $100
Being negative DISQUALIFIES you from any promotions until you get it back to $0
The only way to add money to it is via purchases.
My purchases will only earn me 1% ebay bucks because #2
I will have to spend $10,000 to earn $100 that go towards #1
Therefore...I will only earn $100 on 10k spent. If I spend that over 2 quarters, thats $1000 I will be losing out on that I would have gotten for those 10k spent, 500 each quarter, with an average of 8% in ebay bucks had I not been disqualified.
You started this thread before the ebay bucks were given out. Therefore, you knew you could lose $100 bucks when returning it. Meaning, if you did not keep $100 bucks in the account to prevent it going in the negative, that's on you. They are not costing you a dime, sorry.
You are correct, and I have decided to keep the $100 in there....but you are also wrong, I am still losing the $100 bucks.
@leothelyon said:
Discernible collectors should know better about taking coin descriptions and pictures at face value. One eventually learns what that next question is that needs to be asked with transactions. Getting to that level of agreement with the play of words between the buyer and seller is challenging, adventurous but frustrating when we lose. So with every new transaction, a better strategy/attack may be necessary until we win more times than we lose.
Leo
This has nothing to do with being a discernible collector or bubba jim with money burning a hole in his pocket. In this case, there was a specific listing that clearly stated the buyer would be getting a PCGS coin is X grade with a gold CAC sticker. I don't think anyone can disagree with this, even APMEX if they are truly an honest seller. Please go back and read the listing and tell us that this is not what should be expected.
Best, SH
Well, as I have learned, if I'm about to blow $700 on a coin with a seller I have never met, alone from ever receiving one iota of communication from them, I ask questions and get on board with what exactly I'm buying. Having a couple of questions answered could have avoided all this frustration.
YOU ARE ASSUMING APMEX WOULD HAVE TOLD YOU THE TRUTH WHEN YOU ASK. WOULD THEY?
Large operations such as Apmex likely have people packaging up coins who are not very knowledgeable about collecting coins. There are a ton of people who buy coins and the few that don't get exactly what they thought they should get don't care or do anything about it.
TRACKING INVENTORY IN THIS MODERN WORLD IS VERY EASY, MANY HIGH VOLUME DEALERS TO IT. NO EXCUSE FOR APMEX FOR THIS.
And Apmex and other large companies know this and try to unload coins this way. Unfortunately for them, this tactic has backfired with the OP. But as a buyer and after one goes through this garbage a half dozen times, you don't take descriptions and photos at face value, you ask questions. Sure, I'd like to live in this perfect world you speak of but it's not always cut and dry.
WE AGREE THEN, APMEX IS DISHONEST. TAKES MANY THREADS HERE TO GET THE MESSAGE ACROSS, LIKE THIS ONE.
@blitzdude said:
After further review why not just keep the coin and therefore keep your ebay bucks since they seem so important to you? After all this fretting isn't even about the coin , we're just talking bout a silly little sticker. Did they not offer to swap the one they sent for one with the sticker? Maybe they can refund you the $14 and you could send in for the sticker yourself?
'dude - apparently you don't understand the value of a gold sticker and why he paid a premium. Go look at auction records and see why. Also, anyone knows that a high end coin that is listed on ebay, as clearly in this case (see the listing), is a unique item and no swap to another coin is ethical or acceptable............
@blitzdude said:
After further review why not just keep the coin and therefore keep your ebay bucks since they seem so important to you? After all this fretting isn't even about the coin , we're just talking bout a silly little sticker. Did they not offer to swap the one they sent for one with the sticker? Maybe they can refund you the $14 and you could send in for the sticker yourself?
'dude - apparently you don't understand the value of a gold sticker and why he paid a premium. Go look at auction records and see why. Also, anyone knows that a high end coin that is listed on ebay, as clearly in this case (see the listing), is a unique item and no swap to another coin is ethical or acceptable............
I have been a critic of CAC and that remains true, but im also not stupid and know perceived or not, liquidity and value are affected by these stupid stickers. The gold sticker was the ONLY reason I bought this coin. I mean I am looking for a proof walker for my collection, but the sticker was important for back end liquidity.(so is pepto)
@No Headlights said:
They aren’t coin dealers. They are bullion dealers. When coin collectors buy from bullion dealers they are often disappointed.
They definitely have some nice coins..
It would be nicer if the coins were actually theirs...they belong to other dealers, so you could get better service and better pricing from the actual owners.
@ACop said:
I have recalculated my losses on this deal and they actually approach $100,000
I have calculated my losses on this thread and it is approaching $10,000
You are forgetting certain opportunity costs. If you did not read this thread, you would have gone out a won the lottery or found buried treasure. I conservatively estimate your losses to be about $2.5 to $3.5 million.
@ACop said:
I have recalculated my losses on this deal and they actually approach $100,000
I have calculated my losses on this thread and it is approaching $10,000
I failed to see the losses here. I see a failed credit of $100 for future purchases.
And if you play your cards right, the $10000 figure being throw around here is just your future Ebay purchases at the price you determined to be fair (credit or not).
@ACop said:
I have recalculated my losses on this deal and they actually approach $100,000
I have calculated my losses on this thread and it is approaching $10,000
I failed to see the losses here. I see a failed credit of $100 for future purchases.
And if you play your cards right, the $10000 figure being throw around here is just your future Ebay purchases at the price you determined to be fair (credit or not).
I'm not the one with the failed credit of $100. I was just kidding because of the estimated losses of the OP.
I had $1000 in eBay bucks and I already spent them! Yay, me!!!
@ACop said:
Maybe I can simply it for those ignoring those posts.
This return will make my ebay bucks balance NEGATIVE $100
Being negative DISQUALIFIES you from any promotions until you get it back to $0
The only way to add money to it is via purchases.
My purchases will only earn me 1% ebay bucks because #2
I will have to spend $10,000 to earn $100 that go towards #1
Therefore...I will only earn $100 on 10k spent. If I spend that over 2 quarters, thats $1000 I will be losing out on that I would have gotten for those 10k spent, 500 each quarter, with an average of 8% in ebay bucks had I not been disqualified.
You started this thread before the ebay bucks were given out. Therefore, you knew you could lose $100 bucks when returning it. Meaning, if you did not keep $100 bucks in the account to prevent it going in the negative, that's on you. They are not costing you a dime, sorry.
You are correct, and I have decided to keep the $100 in there....but you are also wrong, I am still losing the $100 bucks.
The amount of time already spent on this argument already costing the OP $500 if that would be his / her average rate
I'd say...move on and liberate yourself from the emotional burden
@blitzdude said:
After further review why not just keep the coin and therefore keep your ebay bucks since they seem so important to you? After all this fretting isn't even about the coin , we're just talking bout a silly little sticker. Did they not offer to swap the one they sent for one with the sticker? Maybe they can refund you the $14 and you could send in for the sticker yourself?
'dude - apparently you don't understand the value of a gold sticker and why he paid a premium. Go look at auction records and see why. Also, anyone knows that a high end coin that is listed on ebay, as clearly in this case (see the listing), is a unique item and no swap to another coin is ethical or acceptable............
I collect coins not some dumb sticker and if you read my initial post in this thread I agreed that the Big A screwed up and should have sent the buyer what he reasonably thought he was buying. Then all the whining stated about losing ebay bucks and $10K this and that like it was the end of the world. Jesus all over a stupid little sticker. Apmex has offered a full refund, what's the problemo?
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
Comments
Could you work with them and return the item not through ebays system? Get an RA number directly from them, and skip the ebay return process all together? This would:
1. Get your money back in full
2. Keep your ebay bucks (which i agree is a lot and important)
3. You agree not to neg them or something
Why not call that supervisor back and ask to not return through ebay? Yes they take a hit on the FVF but that's a small price for them to pay and should be worth it to them to make a customer happy and whole after their screw up.
Now that is the definition of deception.
The problem is that there is little downside for APMEX. They ship the wrong coin, you aren't happy, they refund your money. That does not compensate for the hassle and deception (intentional or unintentional), but unless/until there is a penalty for that it will most likely continue. They are a volume dealer known mainly for bullion as far as I know, so a hit here and there from their numismatic operation might be insignificant to them.
The eBay bucks thing is a complicating factor that just adds to the frustration.
If it were me, I would go into every numismatic transaction with them with my guard up. That is based on what I have read here on the Forum.
They definitely have some nice coins..
Ebay does the same thing with > @spacehayduke said:
Well, as I have learned, if I'm about to blow $700 on a coin with a seller I have never met, alone from ever receiving one iota of communication from them, I ask questions and get on board with what exactly I'm buying. Having a couple of questions answered could have avoided all this frustration. Large operations such as Apmex likely have people packaging up coins who are not very knowledgeable about collecting coins. There are a ton of people who buy coins and the few that don't get exactly what they thought they should get don't care or do anything about it. And Apmex and other large companies know this and try to unload coins this way. Unfortunately for them, this tactic has backfired with the OP. But as a buyer and after one goes through this garbage a half dozen times, you don't take descriptions and photos at face value, you ask questions. Sure, I'd like to live in this perfect world you speak of but it's not always cut and dry.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
Mistakes happen. Patterns of behavior are not mistakes.
Plus, it's not a simple mistake easily rectified, nor is it the ebay bucks exactly.
By now having $100 removed from the balance at the end of the quarter, the OP's eBay bucks balance is in a deficit situation. Before the OP gets any more eBay bucks offers (not something for 'free' but an actual customer benefit), s/he must now generate another $100 in ebay bucks. That means $10K of non-'bonus' purchases, and with a negative balance there will be no bonuses. So, s/he is out some tangible benefits due to APMEX's shenanigans.
And yes, those who peruse these boards know that APMEX is getting more and more of bad reputation on their 'numismatic sales'. Using their otherwise good reputation (deserved or otherwise....I'm pretty disgusted with their 'service' on that end too) for bullion to expand into numismatics is not a bad thing. But then not conducting themselves up to that standard is just plain dirty.
I used to be a big fan of APMEX...not so much for a couple of reasons based on personal dealings. Add in MULTIPLE threads on the bait-and-switch in such a tiny part of the numismatic world certainly is just another reason. Not worth the popcorn tins to deal with at this point, just as I'm sure they are less than caring about losing little old me as a customer.
edited to add: don't forget to file as a SNAD, so they have to pay the return postage.
I think this is a great idea and definitely worth trying.
I'm glad I have enough positive things in my life that I don't need to "go to war" over a bad coin transaction that I got refunded for.
I would return the coin and get a full refund. Shipping to return it should be paid by APMEX since it was their fault.
But this eBay bucks whining is over the top in my opinion. You return the coin, you lose the eBay bucks. If I bought that coin and returned it for this reason, I would expect to lose my bucks. That's just how eBay bucks work. You should lose the bucks if you return the item for any reason. If you return an item you buy with a credit card, you lose the points there too.
Successful transactions with: wondercoin, Tetromibi, PerryHall, PlatinumDuck, JohnMaben/Pegasus Coin & Jewelry, CoinFlip, and coinlieutenant.
I dont know if they would go for this as they will then be the ones losing money on ebay seller fees.
This will cost me as much as $600 in ebay bucks.
Enough people have complained about this that I’m sure they’re aware of it. At this point, they are doing it on purpose. I will still use them for rolls of silver, modern coins or 1/10th ounce gold eagles but not certified coins collector coins.
How? If you got $100 in promotional eBay bucks for it when you purchased it and you are getting those $100 removed, I fail to see how it is going to cost you $600 in eBay bucks...
Successful transactions with: wondercoin, Tetromibi, PerryHall, PlatinumDuck, JohnMaben/Pegasus Coin & Jewelry, CoinFlip, and coinlieutenant.
I'm confused on this math. You can't get more than $100 on any one eBay bucks transaction....????
Did you guys read the posts about not getting any ebay bucks promotions until I spend $10k and make up the $100 I wil be in the negative for? That will span at least 1 quarter maybe 2. Thats countless promotions within 2 quarters varying between 8 and 15% with 500 maxes each quarter that I wont be eligible because of this putting me negative. So in fact this can have ramification over $1000.
Maybe I can simply it for those ignoring those posts.
Therefore...I will only earn $100 on 10k spent. If I spend that over 2 quarters, thats $1000 I will be losing out on that I would have gotten for those 10k spent, 500 each quarter, with an average of 8% in ebay bucks had I not been disqualified.
Not ignoring them, just not sure about the source. I have not heard anything official from eBay on this subject. I've gotten bonus offers when I'm maxed out, so it's not clear that the bucks balance has anything to do with the promotion.
if you are buying stuff open a brand new account . No one cares about a buyers feedback score. Anyway if you are into ebay bucks then you should have a half a dozen buying accounts already
Best solution is to just end the whole ebay bonus bucks program, at least until it is once again viewed as a bonus promotion and not an entitlement.
It's simple math; return a bonus buck eligible item and you return the bonus bucks. If you spent them already, yes, you now have a negative balance until your purchases once again make it positive.
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I am not sure of the answer, but is it possible to not spend the $100 eBay bucks so they are there to be pulled back once the return is processed?
In any case, this thread has deteriorated into people sniping at each other rather than APMEX. I don't see any progress being made - just some rants. OP was wronged, will get $ back but get cheated on eBay bucks, end of story.
The only other option is to hire a lawyer to go after APMEX for damages (or maybe small claims court?). It MIGHT be possible to get eBay to address the bucks issue but I would not hold my breathe on that one.
JMHO.
He is 100% accurate about the ramifications of a negative ebucks balance, 100%
Acop.....have you tried contacting ebay to see if they can just deduct the ebucks amount now?
I ask because I am in same boat but won't be able to spend time to contact them, or try to, until next week
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
They should suffer loss when they engage in fraud, it is the only way that the greedy, gaping, grasping maws of corporately shielded companies will understand the consequences of ripping people off. Because surely there are dozens of people who shuffled on without leaving problem feedback not properly turning their upset and anger against the perpetrators. This is a civic duty, not a matter of preserving "peace of mind", maintaining the status quo, "moving on", letting bygones be bygones. When I felt that PCGS was dragging its feet well after 90 days on a clear guarantee issue that JA at cac was a clear case, I filed with the state of CA. Not that it did any good as PCGS did not respond to the issue. But they did take it more seriously.
I would file with your state AG/consumer affairs which is the right civic duty thing to do addressing many of the concerns on this and other threads. It may cause reform. But APMEX gets more favorable deals with ebay, there is no way they are paying the standard fees that other top rated powersellers are.
I would much rather see MCM do well as they are a top notch company.
I have received bonus buck offers while my ebay bucks balance was negative.
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I'll go out on a limb and say it was either a tiny amount or the immediate quarter after......if it is prolonged, more than the quarter after, the offers stop. I have an account to prove it
Edited to add...,,that account's negative ebucks balance was also due to an apmex return. A cleaned gold coin when description was for a problem free unc
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
I don't know either, so I'd suggest you ask them. Only way to find out, what's the worst they can say??
And don't spend the eBay bucks. If you know you're returning, and you know eBay will take it back, don't spend it and your acct won't go negative. You can still buy on eBay and not use the bucks towards the purchase.
Dear Ebay:
Dump the Ebay Bucks program, return the seller fee to 2.5% (and no more stores) and let us get back to operating in a sane and efficient marketplace.
So is it possible to just not spend the $100 in ebay bucks so the account doesn't go negative.
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Again, these are both anecdotes and neither is definitive. I've never had a negative balance, yet I went a year with no offers and then got 4 in 4 weeks. I'm not sure anyone except eBay knows exactly why people do or don't get offers. I can't find anything on eBay or anything but speculation anywhere else on the internet.
It's also worth pointing out, as @jpcz said: a return will not make the account go negative unless you've already spent the ill-gotten booty.
ya just let them expire
Interesting. If this occurs 1x, no problem. 2x........and...and.
"Sorry, but we are in the business of selling bullion"......but don't mind taking your money if we can sell some numismatic items on the side.
I am call B.S. on this deal from APMEX.
double post.
speculation anywhere else on the internet.
LOL. No need to do that either. They are good for 30 days and the return will be handled long before that.
After further review why not just keep the coin and therefore keep your ebay bucks since they seem so important to you? After all this fretting isn't even about the coin , we're just talking bout a silly little sticker. Did they not offer to swap the one they sent for one with the sticker? Maybe they can refund you the $14 and you could send in for the sticker yourself?
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
I agree its a silly little sticker but it has an effect on value. Let me know when you are looking to buy some coins. I'll show you some beauts with gold stickers on them. That's not the coin you will actually receive after paying me a premium for it, but hey thats cool right?
You started this thread before the ebay bucks were given out. Therefore, you knew you could lose $100 bucks when returning it. Meaning, if you did not keep $100 bucks in the account to prevent it going in the negative, that's on you. They are not costing you a dime, sorry.
I'm convinced - this is the worst ebay problem I've ever heard of and there's probably no solution
You are correct, and I have decided to keep the $100 in there....but you are also wrong, I am still losing the $100 bucks.
I have recalculated my losses on this deal and they actually approach $100,000
YOU ARE ASSUMING APMEX WOULD HAVE TOLD YOU THE TRUTH WHEN YOU ASK. WOULD THEY?
Large operations such as Apmex likely have people packaging up coins who are not very knowledgeable about collecting coins. There are a ton of people who buy coins and the few that don't get exactly what they thought they should get don't care or do anything about it.
TRACKING INVENTORY IN THIS MODERN WORLD IS VERY EASY, MANY HIGH VOLUME DEALERS TO IT. NO EXCUSE FOR APMEX FOR THIS.
And Apmex and other large companies know this and try to unload coins this way. Unfortunately for them, this tactic has backfired with the OP. But as a buyer and after one goes through this garbage a half dozen times, you don't take descriptions and photos at face value, you ask questions. Sure, I'd like to live in this perfect world you speak of but it's not always cut and dry.
WE AGREE THEN, APMEX IS DISHONEST. TAKES MANY THREADS HERE TO GET THE MESSAGE ACROSS, LIKE THIS ONE.
'dude - apparently you don't understand the value of a gold sticker and why he paid a premium. Go look at auction records and see why. Also, anyone knows that a high end coin that is listed on ebay, as clearly in this case (see the listing), is a unique item and no swap to another coin is ethical or acceptable............
I have been a critic of CAC and that remains true, but im also not stupid and know perceived or not, liquidity and value are affected by these stupid stickers. The gold sticker was the ONLY reason I bought this coin. I mean I am looking for a proof walker for my collection, but the sticker was important for back end liquidity.(so is pepto)
It would be nicer if the coins were actually theirs...they belong to other dealers, so you could get better service and better pricing from the actual owners.
I have calculated my losses on this thread and it is approaching $10,000
I think Apmex is completely wrong here but I gotta hear the explanation for this.
edited to correct autocorrect which appears to be even dumber than I am.
My Ebay Store
It’s a joke/attempt at humor
You are forgetting certain opportunity costs. If you did not read this thread, you would have gone out a won the lottery or found buried treasure. I conservatively estimate your losses to be about $2.5 to $3.5 million.
I failed to see the losses here. I see a failed credit of $100 for future purchases.
And if you play your cards right, the $10000 figure being throw around here is just your future Ebay purchases at the price you determined to be fair (credit or not).
I'm not the one with the failed credit of $100. I was just kidding because of the estimated losses of the OP.
I had $1000 in eBay bucks and I already spent them! Yay, me!!!
The amount of time already spent on this argument already costing the OP $500 if that would be his / her average rate
I'd say...move on and liberate yourself from the emotional burden
I collect coins not some dumb sticker and if you read my initial post in this thread I agreed that the Big A screwed up and should have sent the buyer what he reasonably thought he was buying. Then all the whining stated about losing ebay bucks and $10K this and that like it was the end of the world. Jesus all over a stupid little sticker. Apmex has offered a full refund, what's the problemo?
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™