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Planchet Flaw or PMD???

JeffMTampaJeffMTampa Posts: 3,282 ✭✭✭✭✭

I have a real interest in flawed coins produced by the New Orleans Mint post Civil War. I picked up an1897 O Half recently with issues; I'm trying to understand whether the coin was struck on a defective planchet or is there just post mint damage:



The obvious damage is at the 5:00 position on the reverse, but there also seems to be a lamination issue on the reverse at the 11:00 position (between the D and S). My best guess is the coin was struck through some scrap metal which fell out after striking. If this is PMD I can't figure out how it would have been done.

Can anyone give me some additional insight?

I love them Barber Halves.....

Comments

  • howardshowards Posts: 1,239 ✭✭✭

    At 11:00, those are a couple die cracks. At 5:00, that's PMD. The coin got whacked with something - no way to know what.

  • ChrisH821ChrisH821 Posts: 6,536 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I think what you have at 5:00 is a planchet flaw. You can see the shape of the L continuing into it where it is shallow. What is going on with the edge of this coin? It appears to have heavy damage all around it.

    Collector, occasional seller

  • MsMorrisineMsMorrisine Posts: 33,440 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Delamination

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • JeffMTampaJeffMTampa Posts: 3,282 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Is Fred Weinberg in the house?

    I love them Barber Halves.....
  • seanqseanq Posts: 8,691 ✭✭✭✭✭

    All I can tell for sure is that flaw wasn’t there when the coin was struck, as the design opposite it is fully realized. It could have been struck through something which fell out later, it could be a planchet lamination that separated post strike, or it could be PMD. My guess is a lamination, based on the irregular surface of the defect, but the subsequent wear on the coin leaves me less than 100% certain.

    Sean Reynolds

    Incomplete planchets wanted, especially Lincoln Cents & type coins.

    "Keep in mind that most of what passes as numismatic information is no more than tested opinion at best, and marketing blather at worst. However, I try to choose my words carefully, since I know that you guys are always watching." - Joe O'Connor
  • BLUEJAYWAYBLUEJAYWAY Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The obverse at about 3:00 has an issue as well. Not sure as there is not enough magnification, but looks like a possible lamination or a deep gouge (PMD?)

    Successful transactions:Tookybandit. "Everyone is equal, some are more equal than others".
  • JeffMTampaJeffMTampa Posts: 3,282 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BLUEJAYWAY said:
    The obverse at about 3:00 has an issue as well. Not sure as there is not enough magnification, but looks like a possible lamination or a deep gouge (PMD?)

    Yep, the obverse is all PMD. At 3:00 there's a gouge/ scratch. From what I see the weird stuff is all on the reverse.

    I love them Barber Halves.....
  • ms70ms70 Posts: 13,954 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 22, 2018 7:11PM

    First impression was delamination, but I'm curious about that straight line gouge that goes from the rim towards the eagle's foot. I wonder if a nail or some device was at one time hammered or drilled into the rim (maybe to create a loop for a necklace) and the chunk broke off. In comparison to the coin, that gouge is thin but maybe it didn't split evenly and the wider part went with the piece that broke away.

    Just a theory.

    Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.

  • CommemKingCommemKing Posts: 2,202 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Lamination. Not PMD.

  • ms70ms70 Posts: 13,954 ✭✭✭✭✭

    How about a pic of the edge?

    Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.

  • BLUEJAYWAYBLUEJAYWAY Posts: 9,488 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 23, 2018 4:24AM

    There is a lamination crack on the claw grasping the bundle of arrows. This may or may not be/have a connection to the missing area of metal.

    Successful transactions:Tookybandit. "Everyone is equal, some are more equal than others".
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    There appears to be two parts to the 'missing' area... The large part may be a detached lamination... the smaller part has part of the L continuing into the missing area, indicating something was wrong with the surface at striking in that area and further damage occurred post strike...Cheers, RickO

  • WoodenJeffersonWoodenJefferson Posts: 6,491 ✭✭✭✭

    The exposed area of the de-lamination has all the characteristic of metal that did not bond during the rolling of the strip, there is post mint damage on the coin but the focal area in question was originally a lamination, that's my opinion.

    Chat Board Lingo

    "Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,307 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I would say 99% sure that is it a lamination (or de-lamination) error, reserving the 1% doubt for the possibility of a massive strike-through as Sean suggested. Definitely Mint made.

    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • FredWeinbergFredWeinberg Posts: 5,859 ✭✭✭✭✭

    l believe it's a lamination, not a struck thru, imo

    Retired Collector & Dealer in Major Mint Error Coins & Currency since the 1960's.Co-Author of Whitman's "100 Greatest U.S. Mint Error Coins", and the Error Coin Encyclopedia, Vols., III & IV. Retired Authenticator for Major Mint Errors for PCGS. A 50+ Year PNG Member.A full-time numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022.
  • JeffMTampaJeffMTampa Posts: 3,282 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Thanks for all the great responses; it's great to learn from everyone's ideas. I've started collecting Post Civil War New Orleans Mint messed up minting process coins. They certainly seemed to have their problems.

    I love them Barber Halves.....
  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,768 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Great find, and another one that amazes me that it circulated for so long. Although I suppose in those days 50 cents was real money.

  • JeffMTampaJeffMTampa Posts: 3,282 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited March 23, 2018 9:12AM

    So what are the odds our hosts would striaght grade this coin??

    I love them Barber Halves.....
  • ChrisH821ChrisH821 Posts: 6,536 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JeffMTampa said:
    So what are the odds our hosts would striaght grade this coin??

    I would think close to 0%. The rim damage and scratches on the obverse would details it.

    Collector, occasional seller

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