Coins and Happiness
giorgio11
Posts: 3,824 ✭✭✭✭✭
My alma mater Yale is offering numerous online courses through Coursera.org, including one smash hit taught by Dr. Laurie Santos called "The Science of Well-Being," simplified to "Happiness."
Without stealing her thunder or lessening the enjoyment of folks who might want to take this course, one of the bottom lines in the opening sessions is that many of the things people think will make them happy--good grades, a good job, more money, a great love life, a perfect body--in fact do not make them happier. In fact, some of these things beyond a certain point make them less happy.
It got me to thinking about the things that make me happy.
Without giving away my own answers (which are personal and not very relevant to anyone else, I don't think), I'd like to hear from you.
- What makes you happy?
- Do coins make you happy? What part of "coins/numismatics" makes you happy? Is it having coins? Is it having more coins? Is it learning about new series/new discoveries? Other?
- Is there a point of diminishing returns, i.e. a point at which having too many coins makes you less happy? (And since I would like to hear serious, informed opinions and discussion about this, please go out of your way to let other readers know if you are being ironic/sarcastic).
- Do you find that the prospect of buying a new coin actually makes you happier than receiving or having that coin?
Talk amongst yourselves ... and thanks for your answers.
Kind regards (and wishing you more happiness),
George
Comments
If you're asking these sensible questions, you're obviously too well adjusted to be in this hobby. Before you go off to focus on experience-based happiness with people instead of things, sell us all your cool stuff cheap on the BST.
@Washingtoniana I'll think about that ... and whether it would make me more or less happy.
Kind regards,
George
I think PCGS should add another clicking option, NLOL (nervous laughter out loud).
Anyone who relies on coins for an appreciable element of happiness in life needs to get out more.
I suspect most coin collectors expect (or at least hope) that they will make money when they sell. It's about MONEY, not LEARNING. This is a good part of the reason why so few coin collectors assemble working numismatic libraries that might help them learn some things about what they are collecting.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
They say that money and material items can't buy happiness but I'd rather cry in a Mercedes than on a bicycle.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Of course, the comparison should be crying in a Mercedes vs. not crying.
So @Sonorandesertrat , is it learning about coins that makes you happy? BTW I read your interesting post in another thread where you were talking about pulling back from buying coins and that battle between the tarantula and the, was it a hawk? Fascinating ...
So @Walkerfan is it a Mercedes that you think would make you most happy? Or more money in general? What do you think having more money would get you (besides more stuff) that you do not already have?
Kind regards,
George
@giorgio11 and @Zoins money doesn't buy happiness but rather it buys comfort. We all face challenges no matter our economic status but nobody suffers like the poor. I just think that it's important to remember not to put money before God and other people.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Giorgio11,
A tarantula hawk is related to more common wasps, but can be the size of a juvenile hummingbird.
I have a large numismatic book/catalogue/ephemera collection. This kept me interested in numismatics, far more so than actual coins, tokens, or medals. This notwithstanding, I have pulled back from the hobby to a large extent. Looking for things to keep my pea brain busy until the coin lust returns.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
@Sonorandesertrat #4 out of 4 on the Schmidt pain index: "If one bites you just go ahead and lie down and start screaming."
https://wired.com/2015/07/absurd-creature-of-the-week-tarantula-hawk/
Kind regards (and ouch),
George
Exactly (but you worry about being stung, not about being bitten). I watched that battle, taking care to stay at least 15 feet away.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
Brain fart
Kind regards,
George
@Walkerfan I'm still trying to figure out what about coins makes you happy. Is it having more Walking Liberty halves? Is it the prospect of having more Walking Liberty halves? Is it the prospect that one day you will sell your coins and have more money for more of that comfort you mention? I'm really just looking for specific answers from people who are willing to share them ... and thanks
Kind regards,
George
Another story on the road to happiness is finding joy wherever you are. It's often a bumpy ride along the way.
The fact that they are beautiful, valuable and rare really presses my happy button. Personally, I feel that there is a saturation point that I will have reached, as soon as I complete my set. Then I will just enjoy owning and studying them and maybe buying a few from time to time. I really enjoy the camaraderie and sharing of knowledge and friendship, as well.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
Well, that's true. Stuff happens to people whether they do coins or not. But, @TwoSides2aCoin, you have joined the list of people who are not answering the questions! Care to share?
Kind regards,
George
@Walkerfan thank you for that and Happy Collecting! I too think Walkers are beautiful.
Can I ask what things or kinds of things _apart from coins _make you happy?
Kind regards,
George
Happy Happy Joy Joy
Pete
"A dog breaks your heart only one time and that is when they pass on". Unknown
".....more money, .....--in fact do not make them happier. "
Whoever coined the phrase, "Money can't buy happiness" wasn't rich.
Great transactions with oih82w8, JasonGaming, Moose1913.
Spending time with family and friends. I also enjoy the outdoors.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
@ms70 This is glib but oversimplification. There are also filthy rich people who are miserable. As Americans, we enjoy a standard of living that most of the world does not. In countries where they lack basic amenities, of course increased money does buy increased happiness. But in developed countries, It turned out that increased happiness (above a certain income level) was due to other things than money, and in fact people with more money than that tended to be less happy. These are all averages ... your mileage may vary.
Have you ever known someone who had an all-consuming greed? Someone for whom enough is never enough? I have ... and without naming names, they are extremely unhappy people.
Kind regards,
George
Thanks @1Mike1 for your answers! A fellow Lincoln Wheat cent fan ...
Kind regards,
George
what makes me happy??
My GF, although that can be tenuous at times!!
My car, but I bought that about 5-6 weeks ago so it'll probably wear off.
My dog.
Laying down at night and considering the day and all it's brought.
As far as coins are concerned, I don't look at them in that sense, they tend to help me relax.
Lots of things make me happy. Friends and family make up most of the pie chart. For some unfortunate people, their family is a constant source of misery. I'm grateful that isn't my lot in life. Doing something for others that they can't do for themselves and doing it well is also high on the list. I'm lucky to have a job that allows me that satisfaction. Learning. A long walk in the mountains. Working with a good bird dog. Travel. Hobbies are there too, but they're down the list a bit. Coins are probably second or third in my list of hobbies.
No, coins aren't nearly powerful enough to "make me happy". Getting an upgrade, making a profit, completing a set, or finding a long-sought piece bring satisfaction, but that fades pretty quickly. Happiness is measured in decades, years at the very least. Having coins is nice. Having more coins is nice. Learning about them is satisfying.
There is always a point of diminishing returns. The first kiss, first drive, first airplane ride, first double-eagle, first trip outside the US, and first grandchild is always special. Adding the 100th ounce of gold to the pile or the 999th coin to the collection doesn't have the same emotional impact. I've caught myself pondering about this when I add a 4-figure coin to my collection that is just another "part of the set" when to others it would be the keystone of their entire collection.
I suppose anyone who actually collects does so for the emotional pleasure they derive from it (or mental illness...... or maybe they're indistinguishable).
I don't really see the difference between buying a coin it and receiving it, unless there's an unexpected surprise when it shows up.
The connection between happiness and money, fame, material things, or accolades is an interesting concept. Average people today enjoy comforts and pleasures that royalty had no access to a couple hundred years ago. Air conditioning anyone? Fruit in the winter? Hygiene? Air travel? Medications that actually work? I can tell you from personal experience that an overnight transition from a below-average wage to one that is many multiples of that didn't change all that much. Sure, I have more stuff and spend less time worrying about how to survive, but within a few months it was just the new normal. It's just as easy to have debt problems.... easier, really. Fear of losing it all is a new concern. Marriage and raising good kids gets no easier. I can't really convince anyone it's true, and I'm sure many of the people who know me harbor secret jealousies (I did), but just being "rich" isn't that great. There are new headaches (40-50 page tax return), friends who aren't really your friends, and other problems. When I see videos of lottery winners jumping up and down I feel bad for them. No, their troubles are NOT all over now.....
Well put, @BryceM. Thanks for sharing.
Kind regards,
George
George,
1. I'm generally a happy guy.
2. Coins never made me happy. They give me an escape from things that do not necessarily contribute to my happiness.
3. There's a point where I buy too much inventory (sometimes), that doesn't help my stress levels but um ....I’m having fun.
4. No. I think finding "NEW" coins makes me happy but I do buy new coins for those who like to keep up on their collections, and this contrbutes to my happiness. There’s enjoyment. Yet, too much of a good thing doesn't necessarily make anyone, especially me, happy. On the contrary, it's a heavier weight to carry. For instance : I just rec'd an MS 70 Gold Buffalo for resale. I was happy to get it. But I'll be happier when the guy who ordered it pays for it. If he stiffs me, It won’t make me happy but I still have the gold. If I lost all the gold, I'd still be happy. Happiness is basically a state of being happy. I'm not HAPPY every moment. Some days I could spit fire and you would think the devil and me are cousins, or that I was an offspring of a politician or something.
Look, it's a bumpy ride. I said that already. Now, I have questions : Are you writing a book or promoting continuing education ?
What makes your numismatic juices flow ?
I recently saw my grandpa’s implement dealership in a photo. Not sure if that’s my grandpa, or not.
I remember that despite his woes, (losing it all during the Depression and dust storm) he was happy. I only knew him as a retired grocer.
I’d say the same for my own dad. While I can’t speak for anyone, it seems most people in my family are also happy...relative to their existence.
Believing and knowing “ to dust we shall return.” ( an old farmer said in a rainstorm, once )
George, when you attended Yale did you have a "Safe Space"?
OK @TwoSides2aCoin, fair enough. I still enjoy plugging an empty hole in a Whitman folder, or its cyberspace Registry Set equivalent. All those years I was a dealer I enjoyed doing shows and buying and selling coins. But does any of that make me really happy? No. What makes me happy? Petting a cat. Having a wife that I can confide in, anything, going on now 33 years. Being able to go to Italy and finally see Venice in 2016, and conduct and sing in a musical group (I have sung in the Yale Russian Chorus or its alumni offshoot for over 50 years, wonderful music), being able to stay in a little town called Aquileia in a B&B where I could pluck ripe apricots and figs right off the bushes, that gave me happiness that does not fade with time. Yes, lifelong learning has been a passion, and I usually spend a few hours studying something every day. No, I am not writing a book. No, I'm not promoting continuing education; either someone wants to do it or they don't.
All those years I was a Heritage cataloger I got to think and write about why coins were made where they were made, how many or how few, and learn more about that ... even though there is still so much that is unknown. But having coins and knowing about coins has always been a profession or an avocation. Having (or getting) money to me was never an end in itself, but a way to self-insure, to a degree, and to be able to fund those experiences that @Washingtoniana guessed at in the second post in this thread. I'm having a harder and harder time convincing myself to buy more material (particularly those high-dollar items that @BryceM mentioned, either for my own collections or to acquire more inventory. So, I'm just questioning why I'm doing what I'm doing, and why other people do the same thing.
I think in the final essence that I may be struggling with the question, "But if you didn't do coins, what would you do?" And yes there are answers to that question, and some of them might provide me much more happiness than coins are. It's a process of figuring out which ones ...
I think self-examination is a healthy process, and it is certainly helpful to hear how some other acquisitive, intelligent collectors have answered the same questions that I am posing.
Kind regards,
George
Yes. Music. I couldn't afford coins back then.
Kind regards,
George
I agree with George.
Best place to buy !
Bronze Associate member
Efficiency in all things. Lack of waste. Purchasing anything efficiently. Getting the most for my time and effort.
Family. Friends. Fun.
Trying to leave everything and this world in better shape than I found it.
Time to enjoy what I do have. Time to do all the things I want done. Seeing the effects of what I've done.
Clad and all coins.
Time and people are really first but without the others my relationship to time and people would be "hollow". Without coins I'd have worn myself ragged because I have a tendency to burn the midnight oil (and the candle) at both ends and the middle.
Oh, I'd probably be golfing, but there's sleet today.
I am just plain happy.... very happy.... I had a bad day 47 years ago.... vowed I would never have such a day again. And, I have not. I wake up happy, go through each day happy, and go to sleep happy...and dream happy dreams. No magic involved.... I enjoy life, look for the positive in everything and stay away from anyone or anything that brings negativity. Cheers, RickO
I try not to over analyzed whether I am happy; less happy or not happy at all in any given time. That would make me un-happy. Just the facts that I have all my senses to live another day is a blessing.
Coins, shells or deep fishing are icing on the cake for me.
My MO is to share whatever blessing I have with people around me
You know of what you speak. The first (and only) one I ever saw was when I was out hunting.
I ...shot... it. Yep, SHOT a bug.
A BIG bug.
Hah, a philosophy thread on a coin board!
I think the key to living a happy life is being grateful and to communicate to others your appreciation.
My collection brings me smiles, but is such a minute aspect of my life. Within this little slice of experience, I am most happy being at winter FUN with money to spend and looking for one or two coins that really grab me.
I am generally a happy person. This place makes me happy and indeed coins also do. It's mostly my coin friends that make it all so great.
My YouTube Channel
Really interesting thread. I shall try to answer.
What makes me happy? The #1 thing is car shows. That is when I am the most happy, yet they almost always cause me intense pain...it's worth it to me to experience the event even though I know I will suffer later. They also cause me some anguish, knowing that I can't save every classic car I see...i can't save any. Working on my website makes me happy. I've maintained it since 2004 and it's essentially a photo documentation of my life. I am also documenting all my various collections, which is a lot because for most of my life every cent was spent on collecting various things. My main hobby is actually trading cards and they make me quite happy as well.
Coins make me happy in that I can collect them and they have a very long history, which occasionally lets me type in unusual dates in my collection files. It also allows me access to times in history I can't possibly experience and places I can never go. But really, the coins are more a means to an end, I enjoy documenting them more than actually having them. I find, actually, that I enjoy the documenting more than the actual having in pretty much everything. But I don't have anything to document if I don't add to my collections.
I would say that there is no place or circumstances where I would say a collection is too big, unless you have everything and run out of things to add. I'm nowhere near that place in any of my hobbies, even the one where I have the largest known collection in the hobby. (Racing Champions 1/64 NASCAR diecast replicas) Storing and physically moving things may be a challenge in some circumstances but not a real detriment to adding more. I already had to get two storage units and need physical help to do pretty much anything in them. Coin collecting has a bit more detriment to it than some of my other hobbies, in that there's a lot of things that are priced out of my price range. The curse of the collector is there is always something more, and we tend to focus on what we don't have than what we do. I also find that the general sense is that more people care about making a profit than the actual item they are supposedly collecting. I find that off-putting as I care solely about what it is, not what it sells for, in everything.
I touched on question 4 a bit already, but actually buying something does not excite me, especially if done on the internet. Actually getting something is exciting, but entering it into my Excel chart, scanning it and then putting the scans in their proper place on my website and in my archives, that is what I find truly exciting. (Cards, coins, currency, stamps, comics, they all get scanned. Non-flat items get photographed)
I am not actually a happy person. My entire life is built around hobbies, and I've been a collector since I was born-my first hobby started at 5 days old, it was started for me and I'm still in it- but my health has never been all that good and I live in pain 24/7, 365. I can't do what I wanted to do with my life, which is restore classic cars and be an archaeologist and/or museum curator. I physically cannot do it and it's very depressing to not be able to do simple things all the time...and the medicine that I need to live costs $500 or more a box, (varies constantly) and a box lasts 9 days. And that's just one of them. I probably have the lowest hobby budget of any person on here, about $30 per month which I try and spread over 6 different hobbies. My hobbies actually give me the only happiness I ever really experience. Luckily, most of my collections were built in the 90s and early 00s because I could not afford to build them now. But working on documenting them IS bringing me some pleasure, even the hobbies I'm no longer in or don't add to very often...I say I have 6 active hobbies but I have not added anything new to several of them in multiple years. If I didn't have my hobbies to work on my life would have no real meaning or purpose, something I'm aware of but try not to think about.
At least, by posting my collection documentation online, I can sort of run my own digital museum, at least.
Wow @BillyKingsley thanks for sharing, it sounds like you are trying to make the most of your situation and I admire anyone who can do that or attempt to. I also agree with @Ricko about avoiding negativity although there are a couple on this board. I thank God every day I'm able to get out of bed and do whatever, exercise, help Mrs VDB cook a good meal, work on my hobbies and interests (coins, learning, languages, music, investing, not as much travel as I would like, helping some young people), and I feel extremely fortunate to be able to do those things.
Thanks to all who are sharing here (and @BillyKingsley that includes your online collections)! It gives me a better outlook as well.
Kind regards,
George
I would like to give it a try and get back with you later.
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Great thread, George. I'll play along.
What makes you happy?
Going on a road trip with my partner, getting out on the golf course as often as possible, spending time with family/friends/cats, eating at nice restaurants, going for a walk on a warm day. There's lots more, but these are a few that come to mind.
Do coins make you happy? What part of "coins/numismatics" makes you happy? Is it having coins? Is it having more coins? Is it learning about new series/new discoveries? Other?
Coins in and of themselves do not make me happy. A great find, writing a good description or article, handling a great collection, making some kind of discovery, flipping a coin for profit, and meeting new people are what I enjoy about numismatics. The coins themselves are almost just a medium. They deliver experiences I enjoy.
Is there a point of diminishing returns, i.e. a point at which having too many coins makes you less happy? (And since I would like to hear serious, informed opinions and discussion about this, please go out of your way to let other readers know if you are being ironic/sarcastic).
There's a level of quality I would like to maintain in the coins I own, but the nature of the beast is that good coins sell easily and lesser pieces do not. Thus, I am at point where I feel stuck with an abundance of material (remnants from collections), and that certainly doesn't make me happy. It doesn't make me unhappy, though. I can think of a lot worse to have to deal with.
Do you find that the prospect of buying a new coin actually makes you happier than receiving or having that coin
That would depend on the coin. Finding a good coin is always fun. So is receiving it. Receiving a coin can also be disappointing, but that happens less often. Personally, owning a coin is a mixed bag. There are some pieces I swear I would never sell. But the pleasure I derive from owning them inevitably fades with time.
Ultimately, happiness is experiential (my opinion). Owning things does not necessarily make me happy. It's what I do with the things and people that I have in my life that are important.
Dealing in Canadian and American coins and historical medals.
Great, reasoned responses @QCCoinGuy thanks for sharing!
Kind regards,
George
I feel happiest when:
1) I am with people (and pets!) that I love
2) I feel I am doing something that makes the world better
3) I am reading a great book
4) I am immersed in something wholeheartedly, whether work or pleasure
And the last comment leads to coins. I recall the joy I felt as a kid looking at the details of a Lincoln cent or Buffalo nickel. It was so cool to soak up the design and all the little differences in wear and condition. I do not GENERALLY feel that same joy as an adult. The BEST time I've had with coins as an adult is when my son and I decided to try to assemble a Jeff set from circulation and we searched about $1,000 of roles. The excitement of discovery was pure joy, and I was amazed at how much we were able to find. Now that neither of my kids are interested in coins, I am pretty sure I will not feel that kind of "coin joy" again.
GREAT THREAD TOPIC! THANKS!
Tarantula hawks are AWESOME. I've only seen two, one in Costa Rica, the other in Ecuador, and could not believe how big they were.
Back to the topic, I wonder if there are any folks here for whom buying too many coins has been a Problem. And how did they work through it? I know in my case, I only worked seriously on one Registry Set, although I was pretty obsessive about it. But I did OK when I sold my stuff. I don't feel that burning desire to achieve a top spot any more.
Kind regards,
George
This is a great example of someone with attitude! I find it interesting that you are still counting the years since that "bad day" 47 years ago. I come here often, but don't tend to comment as often as I am tempted to because I am still feeling like a grasshopper..... trying to listen and soak in knowledge...still amazed at the tremendous wealth of inspiration a person can find in these posts.
I keep trying... can't give up, that would do no good. Sometimes I don't succeed in my attempts but I will never give up.
I have been thinking about this more and I realize that (and I'm sure a lot of other collectors here feel the same way), there is a real drive to completion of a series going on when I collect. It's not so much occupying any particular spot in a Registry whatever or having a certain number of coins, but the mere fact of knowing that All of These Objects Belong in That Set gives me a tremendous impetus to want to collect them all, and acquiring those last few, precious (usually pricey) coins gives a real feeling of Happiness--which is, after all, the subject of this thread.
What say you, fellow numismatists-dealers-collectors? Do you share that same desire to complete a set? If and when you do complete a set, are you happy? Happier? Can't wait to start on something else? Temporary high? What?
Kind regards,
George
Decades ago, I completed a set of Barber halves in 55-58 (today's standard). It was exhausting. The high was fleeting, I was in a cynical mood, and I vowed never to do that again. I sold the coins 11 years ago, and now only own three Barber coins (for type).
The development of coins boards, and later albums, was brilliant marketing, but many series are getting (or have gotten) too pricey for many collectors to complete. The registry fad has partly brought set completion back to a modest level of importance, even driving some to collect P01 coins. At the end of the day, set completion is more of a marketing concept that benefits dealers, rather than collectors. I have seen some boxes of 20, posted on this forum, that contained interesting, attractive coins. Conversely, I have seen sets that were complete, but largely contained coins having negligible eve appeal. Go figure.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]