@miwlvrn said:
I was unfamiliar with COMC subbing cards in to BGS under non-guaranteed service (non-g. refers to turn around time) until I saw the notice today that COMC has stopped doing it. That got me thinking, I wonder if COMC could negotiate a special contract agreement with PSA for a card sub rate similar to the cost structure offered to 4SC, since COMC would have the ongoing month to month business volume to support such a deal...
Would be intriguing to have an option to send our raw cards to COMC, and have them subsequently include them in a big group sub to PSA for a super low discount per-card grading rate, lower than any of the monthly specials would ever get. They must have a system of some sort already in place over there if they had sent group subs to BGS.
This in theory would be cool, but trusting an unknown person to handle your cards between sending them off to COMC and then on to PSA is where I would be worried. Maybe I’m just paranoid?
I guess if you trust COMC to handle and sell your cards, there shouldn't be any reason to not trust them with sending them off to be graded. You always hear "concerns" about someone swapping your card for theirs if yours looks better, etc.. but I would think that would be a concern sending your card to any grading service or third party retailer. You either trust them or you don't. I assume instances of someone swapping your better card for theirs happens(human nature and all that), but it is probably very rare. As far as getting damaged, that shouldn't be too much of a concern imo.
Just to clarify as I got that email from COMC too - they are no longer doing the non-guaranteed service with BGS because its taking up to six months but they are still doing submissions under a guaranteed time frame for an additional cost.
I actively collect Kirby Puckett. I have collections of Michael Jordan, Emmitt Smith, Roberto Clemente, Dwight Gooden, Tom Seaver, Errict Rhett and Evan Longoria.
This. Contracts with entities that guarantee a certain number of submissions, or revenue. I assume the $1 rate is for post-vintage commons that normally wouldn't have a declared value more than the holder itself... this promotes set building on the registry.
Just goes to show you how over-priced the fees are. If they can make money grading cards for $1 and $2.
They can do that for customers that guarantee X-thousand submissions every single month, month in, month out. They can't do that for everyone or the wait time would be a year and a half.
Arthur
Lets say I build fences for a living. Lets say I charge $1,500 for the typical fence and it costs me $1,000 in materials and labor to build it. If I charged you $500 because you were a home builder with 25 houses per year, I still lose $500 per fence. I could build you 1,000 fences a year, I still lose $500,000.
If you read those financials I posted(funny, nobody appears interested), you will note they say that 5 customers constitute 18% of their total business and that most of their revenue comes from coin grading and authenticating rather than cards and autographs. They also report a very high amount of expenses, which is puzzling. Also, in 2017, the average "declared value" of the 1,457,900 trading cards they graded was $6.50, which must mean the declared value for most graded cards is close to zero - which is funny, because nobody in their right mind would have a card graded that they know is worth less than the fee.
because nobody in their right mind would have a card graded that they know is worth less than the fee.
I DO IT ALL THE TIME !!!! LOL
In order to break even on a card you need the value to be at least $9.50 with the current submission rates plus you need an additional 13% for EBAY fees and then whatever you have in the card itself. There are loads of cards that get sent in that if they come back a 7, 8 or 9 are a losing proposition but should they grade a point higher are not and if they grade a 10 are big winners. You have to gamble sometimes on your subs and if you are trying to put a set together sometimes you send in a place holder. I do my best to avoid money losing submissions but it has happened to everyone at some point. It is just part of the game. Just like sending in a card and nailing a 10 and seeing its value rocket 100 fold higher is.
If I were them I would offer a super bulk special price every month; like say 1000+ cards at $3/per {assuming this is above there cogs; if they can do $1 + $2 it should be} but by doing this, the minimum dollar amount of these types of orders is $3000+; offer 90-120 day turnaround time. This would keep the coffers full at all times. I would believe at that price many more people would submit larger quantities and the set registry {and their market share} would boom even more. I for one am hesitant to submit cards that may not be worth the grading fee.
I have to much S**t; so if you working on sets or are a player/team collector, send me your want list, with conditions desired. Keep in mind I have a another job so please allow me a few days to respond.
@tonylags said:
If I were them I would offer a super bulk special price every month; like say 1000+ cards at $3/per {assuming this is above there cogs; if they can do $1 + $2 it should be} but by doing this, the minimum dollar amount of these types of orders is $3000+; offer 90-120 day turnaround time. This would keep the coffers full at all times. I would believe at that price many more people would submit larger quantities and the set registry {and their market share} would boom even more. I for one am hesitant to submit cards that may not be worth the grading fee.
Yes, with rates like that I would certainly send in a heck of a lot more cards than I would with the $5.75 to $6.25 range that is the periodic low end of the monthly specials (if you wait long enough, even if it is only a couple times a year any more). At some point it becomes a little less about the total dollars spent and more about the total necessary to recoup per card, while gambling to shoot for those 10's or even set building with low/no value items for the registry. I think there would be enough people increasing their sub quantity as a monthly group sub to make it worth PSA's while to offer a 4SC cost rate to COMC.
Lets say I build fences for a living. Lets say I charge $1,500 for the typical fence and it costs me $1,000 in materials and labor to build it. If I charged you $500 because you were a home builder with 25 houses per year, I still lose $500 per fence. I could build you 1,000 fences a year, I still lose $500,000.
>
but what if the builder guaranteed you 1000+ fences/year at 1200; or just over your cogs. His quantity would more than make up for any opportunity loss you would incur.
I have to much S**t; so if you working on sets or are a player/team collector, send me your want list, with conditions desired. Keep in mind I have a another job so please allow me a few days to respond.
A $6.50 to $6.75 a card special with a 50 card minimum of years 1956 and up would be awesome at this point.
But don't sell yourself short. The standard special for 1955 and earlier has been $6.25 for most of the last several months in a row. 1956 to present is typically $0.50 lower than the vintage specials. We will see the return of $5.75 & $6.00 eventually. Just up to the subbers to decide if the cost savings is worth the wait or not. For a 50 card sub, you're looking at a difference of around $25 to $50 over the cost of the sub. To some people it's worth waiting for several months until the price lowers, and for others not so much.
A $6.50 to $6.75 a card special with a 50 card minimum of years 1956 and up would be awesome at this point.
But don't sell yourself short. The standard special for 1955 and earlier has been $6.25 for most of the last several months in a row. 1956 to present is typically $0.50 lower than the vintage specials. We will see the return of $5.75 & $6.00 eventually. Just up to the subbers to decide if the cost savings is worth the wait or not. For a 50 card sub, you're looking at a difference of around $25 to $50 over the cost of the sub. To some people it's worth waiting for several months until the price lowers, and for others not so much.
So, while a difference of $25 or $50 at least for me makes the difference about when I choose to send in a group of items, it isn't enough to make the difference on which items I take a chance at and sub vs. keeping them raw. But, with a significantly lower discount rate of per-card grading that I would hope would be made available to a hypothetical ongoing COMC mass-volume sub, that cost difference would be enough to change my mind on sending in a bunch of items that I otherwise never would have subbed. The overall result would be that I would spend more money with PSA, but that would also increase wait time for grades to pop too (which I'd be OK with).
@miwlvrn There has been incredible growth in the 1956 forward segment because of Pokemon. I have to believe this is one of the reasons month after month we see no specials. I send in lots of cards that the difference in grading prices matters but I think PSA is trying to condition us to pay more. I mainly collect wrestling cards and there is a very small segment that is valuable with most being very low priced where the cost of grading is very important in the decision to submit. If you look at their earnings reports they are firing on all cylinders so it doesn't appear they need to deviate course.
@Dpeck100 said: @miwlvrn There has been incredible growth in the 1956 forward segment because of Pokemon. I have to believe this is one of the reasons month after month we see no specials. I send in lots of cards that the difference in grading prices matters but I think PSA is trying to condition us to pay more. I mainly collect wrestling cards and there is a very small segment that is valuable with most being very low priced where the cost of grading is very important in the decision to submit. If you look at their earnings reports they are firing on all cylinders so it doesn't appear they need to deviate course.
My kids care very very little about sports cards, but they are really big into Pokemon, that's for sure! The darn things are everywhere around the house here. The only one I know to be good is early types of Charizard but I am clueless on the rest.
(Note: they just use the cards to play it, and the 'value' of a card is tied to however advantageous it is in the game, not its condition or scarcity, and they are not into graded items at all.)
@Dpeck100 said: @miwlvrn There has been incredible growth in the 1956 forward segment because of Pokemon. I have to believe this is one of the reasons month after month we see no specials. I send in lots of cards that the difference in grading prices matters but I think PSA is trying to condition us to pay more. I mainly collect wrestling cards and there is a very small segment that is valuable with most being very low priced where the cost of grading is very important in the decision to submit. If you look at their earnings reports they are firing on all cylinders so it doesn't appear they need to deviate course.
Also, if PSA has a nice new building now, maybe there's a little more room to hire more employees for the grading process to handle the upswing in business volume? I know things are going well there; no idea what the average annual salary for a grader is but I'm willing to bet that the increased revenue from many thousands more cards per month if something like a hypothetical COMC group contract were to occur would more than cover the costs associated with an additional hire. Goodbye armchair quarterback, hello armchair business/marketing manager I guess...
Over 30,000 completed EBAY listings in how ever long their observation period is. I think we are at like six months in a row of a Pokemon set being covered in the SMR and Joe Orlando mentioned on Twitter that they had graded 350,000 cards from the various sets in just a few years. A huge growth engine for PSA and one of the reasons they are swamped with orders.
Agreed. I definitely noticed that that was occurring with Pokemon, that's for sure. And it does appear to be more of a staple than a temporary fad.
Being swamped with orders and with ongoing growth expected in my mind means being worth taking a step towards growth in taking on additional capacity to process the order volume, whether you're talking PSA, or a service provider in some other unrelated industry.
@dictoresno I didn't even think that it might be glare. i have 3 of these,2 of which i think have a shot at least a 9 but thanks for digging out a cheaper price. I clicked on the auction to see if my 3 were comparable.
Comments
I guess if you trust COMC to handle and sell your cards, there shouldn't be any reason to not trust them with sending them off to be graded. You always hear "concerns" about someone swapping your card for theirs if yours looks better, etc.. but I would think that would be a concern sending your card to any grading service or third party retailer. You either trust them or you don't. I assume instances of someone swapping your better card for theirs happens(human nature and all that), but it is probably very rare. As far as getting damaged, that shouldn't be too much of a concern imo.
Just to clarify as I got that email from COMC too - they are no longer doing the non-guaranteed service with BGS because its taking up to six months but they are still doing submissions under a guaranteed time frame for an additional cost.
I actively collect Kirby Puckett. I have collections of Michael Jordan, Emmitt Smith, Roberto Clemente, Dwight Gooden, Tom Seaver, Errict Rhett and Evan Longoria.
because nobody in their right mind would have a card graded that they know is worth less than the fee.
I DO IT ALL THE TIME !!!! LOL
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Major_League_Baseball_players_from_Panama
In order to break even on a card you need the value to be at least $9.50 with the current submission rates plus you need an additional 13% for EBAY fees and then whatever you have in the card itself. There are loads of cards that get sent in that if they come back a 7, 8 or 9 are a losing proposition but should they grade a point higher are not and if they grade a 10 are big winners. You have to gamble sometimes on your subs and if you are trying to put a set together sometimes you send in a place holder. I do my best to avoid money losing submissions but it has happened to everyone at some point. It is just part of the game. Just like sending in a card and nailing a 10 and seeing its value rocket 100 fold higher is.
If I were them I would offer a super bulk special price every month; like say 1000+ cards at $3/per {assuming this is above there cogs; if they can do $1 + $2 it should be} but by doing this, the minimum dollar amount of these types of orders is $3000+; offer 90-120 day turnaround time. This would keep the coffers full at all times. I would believe at that price many more people would submit larger quantities and the set registry {and their market share} would boom even more. I for one am hesitant to submit cards that may not be worth the grading fee.
I have to much S**t; so if you working on sets or are a player/team collector, send me your want list, with conditions desired. Keep in mind I have a another job so please allow me a few days to respond.
Yes, with rates like that I would certainly send in a heck of a lot more cards than I would with the $5.75 to $6.25 range that is the periodic low end of the monthly specials (if you wait long enough, even if it is only a couple times a year any more). At some point it becomes a little less about the total dollars spent and more about the total necessary to recoup per card, while gambling to shoot for those 10's or even set building with low/no value items for the registry. I think there would be enough people increasing their sub quantity as a monthly group sub to make it worth PSA's while to offer a 4SC cost rate to COMC.
This is not just a volume business but a volume at the right price.
Judging by their profit margins they have found a good balance in their per unit pricing.
I think we can all agree that a $4.75 special would be amazing but their is no reason to with the growth and success in their trading card business.
A $6.50 to $6.75 a card special with a 50 card minimum of years 1956 and up would be awesome at this point.
but what if the builder guaranteed you 1000+ fences/year at 1200; or just over your cogs. His quantity would more than make up for any opportunity loss you would incur.
I have to much S**t; so if you working on sets or are a player/team collector, send me your want list, with conditions desired. Keep in mind I have a another job so please allow me a few days to respond.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Major_League_Baseball_players_from_Panama
But don't sell yourself short. The standard special for 1955 and earlier has been $6.25 for most of the last several months in a row. 1956 to present is typically $0.50 lower than the vintage specials. We will see the return of $5.75 & $6.00 eventually. Just up to the subbers to decide if the cost savings is worth the wait or not. For a 50 card sub, you're looking at a difference of around $25 to $50 over the cost of the sub. To some people it's worth waiting for several months until the price lowers, and for others not so much.
So, while a difference of $25 or $50 at least for me makes the difference about when I choose to send in a group of items, it isn't enough to make the difference on which items I take a chance at and sub vs. keeping them raw. But, with a significantly lower discount rate of per-card grading that I would hope would be made available to a hypothetical ongoing COMC mass-volume sub, that cost difference would be enough to change my mind on sending in a bunch of items that I otherwise never would have subbed. The overall result would be that I would spend more money with PSA, but that would also increase wait time for grades to pop too (which I'd be OK with).
@miwlvrn There has been incredible growth in the 1956 forward segment because of Pokemon. I have to believe this is one of the reasons month after month we see no specials. I send in lots of cards that the difference in grading prices matters but I think PSA is trying to condition us to pay more. I mainly collect wrestling cards and there is a very small segment that is valuable with most being very low priced where the cost of grading is very important in the decision to submit. If you look at their earnings reports they are firing on all cylinders so it doesn't appear they need to deviate course.
(Note: they just use the cards to play it, and the 'value' of a card is tied to however advantageous it is in the game, not its condition or scarcity, and they are not into graded items at all.)
Also, if PSA has a nice new building now, maybe there's a little more room to hire more employees for the grading process to handle the upswing in business volume? I know things are going well there; no idea what the average annual salary for a grader is but I'm willing to bet that the increased revenue from many thousands more cards per month if something like a hypothetical COMC group contract were to occur would more than cover the costs associated with an additional hire. Goodbye armchair quarterback, hello armchair business/marketing manager I guess...
https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_sacat=0&LH_Complete=1&_udlo=&_udhi=&_samilow=&_samihi=&_sadis=15&_stpos=32806&_dmd=1&_ipg=200&_nkw=psa+pokemon&_sop=16
Over 30,000 completed EBAY listings in how ever long their observation period is. I think we are at like six months in a row of a Pokemon set being covered in the SMR and Joe Orlando mentioned on Twitter that they had graded 350,000 cards from the various sets in just a few years. A huge growth engine for PSA and one of the reasons they are swamped with orders.
Agreed. I definitely noticed that that was occurring with Pokemon, that's for sure. And it does appear to be more of a staple than a temporary fad.
Being swamped with orders and with ongoing growth expected in my mind means being worth taking a step towards growth in taking on additional capacity to process the order volume, whether you're talking PSA, or a service provider in some other unrelated industry.
Here's another 4SC special. I don't know what that white is in the top right corner but its not a part of the image.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1998-STADIUM-CLUB-ROYAL-COURT-RC9-MICHAEL-JORDAN-HOF-PSA-9-K2547168-846/382376263349?hash=item590766beb5:g:MgQAAOSwWktafLL0
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
you can grab it for $67.49 on their website for less. and that white spot is glare from the scanner.
www.4sharpcorners.com/1998_STADIUM_CLUB_ROYAL_COURT__RC9_MICHAEL_JORDAN_HOF_PSA_9_K2547168_846-ITEM2172172.aspx
myslabs.to/smzcards
@dictoresno I didn't even think that it might be glare. i have 3 of these,2 of which i think have a shot at least a 9 but thanks for digging out a cheaper price. I clicked on the auction to see if my 3 were comparable.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Jimmy C Pants
don't do it
don't get one of these guys to make you say the right words to get booted off the board
they are just itching