What if the gold in Ft. Knox was stolen?
EagleEye
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There is about $200 billion worth of gold in ft. Knox at current levels.
People worry that it is not there, like it would wreck the economy or something.
To put it in perspective, it is about the same as the net worth of Vladimir Putin, the chief Russian oligarch.
It is 1/7 of what the Congress just committed to add to the debt, just to give a handout to the American oligarchs and corporations, which they say, are people (oligarchs) too.
If no one cares about increasing our debt by $1.4 Trillion at a time when we should be paying it down, then why should we care if a measly $200 Billion is still held there, costing us money to store and not paying interest.
Rick Snow, Eagle Eye Rare Coins, Inc.Check out my new web site:
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We shouldn't care if it's there. We should care why they would tell us it's there if it really isn't there.
Confidence is what keeps the dream alive.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
I'm confident that my taxes are payable in FRNs. I'm pretty confident I can buy a range of goods and services with them, in the US and worldwide. I'm not so confident they'll be worth much, compared to today, when I retire. I have trouble comprehend the numbers of FRNs that are in existence.
I'm not sure what any of this has to do with having confidence in the gold in Ft. Knox. It's simply not relevant to the economy, or the government.
The value of any fiat currency is determined by how widely and how fiercely the illusion of stability is believed. It is our faith that the next guy will also accept if for payment, even knowing it probably lost a little value since we accepted it as payment, that keeps this illusion going. Witness what happens to value when stability is questionable (i.e. Venezuela, Argentina, Wiemar Republic, etc.).
Imagine what finding out a government squandered/lost it's massive gold holdings (and then lied about it) would do to confidence. Greed and fear drive markets and economies. Confidence fuels greed while lack of it fuels fear. It's all a confidence game
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Well put Rick!
Tax cuts when unemployment is so low is just a waste of money (as if the wealthy need more of it.)
You just couldn't help yourself but to make this political.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
You have to have something there first before it can get stolen !!!
Judging by the "disagrees" we have some putin fans in the audience.
Country first.
17 people care that it is there.
Gold does not make the USA.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
It’s the gold on my finger that makes me feel like I have a ring in my nose. Forget Fort Knox.
Schrodinger's Gold
Already gone... just lead bars painted gold in there
Menomonee Falls Wisconsin USA
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistr...dset.aspx?s=68269&ac=1">Musky 1861 Mint Set
Really just a matter of confidence for people who do not understand economics and a symbolic hoard for international purposes. I am more interested in my gold - and it IS there.
Cheers, RickO
I like what Ricko said. Also it's my humble opinion that Gold is viewed as More important outside the USA.
100% Positive BST transactions
Government gold ownership is like a shell game... they are never straight forward or clear about it.
IMO there is likely gold in Fort Knox... but ownership is another matter. With the games that are played with it such as swaps, loans, etc.... who knows who actually holds title to any that remains?
Possession is 9/10ths of the law
Menomonee Falls Wisconsin USA
http://www.pcgs.com/SetRegistr...dset.aspx?s=68269&ac=1">Musky 1861 Mint Set
Russian politics is offensive to you!
Everything else is economics. If economics offends you then you need to chill out.
Russia is not America's friend (some of you need to get that through your "fake news" heads.)
Not a political thing, it's a country thing.
It is 1/7 of what the Congress just committed to add to the debt, just to give a handout to the American oligarchs and corporations, which they say, are people (oligarchs) too.
oligarchs?
uh, yeah, like Buffett (who buys himself a senator to stop a pipeline so that his railroad makes money (instead of using a cheaper and less hazardous mode of oil transport) and then who also becomes a key vote in forcing another bogus tax (per the Supreme Court, although not sold as, or enacted as a tax) on actual real-life working class wage earners, no doubt for the benefit of his insurance companies' earnings statements), or Gates (who sticks his finger in the eye of actual Americans who then suffer the indignity of being forced to train their cheaper foreign replacements before being given the axe.) yeah, like those oligarchs. It's a country thing, you know. But it's economics you know, nothing personal, of course.
Russia is not America's friend (some of you need to get that through your "fake news" heads.)
uh, yeah, like the fake news about a secretary of state grabbing about $140,000,000 in "donations" for a tax dodge foundation, not just from the Russians, but half the middle east oil sheikdoms who incidentally hate our guts. yeah, it's a country thing alright. And we're simply talking economics, you know. So chill.
Get real, folks.
I knew it would happen.
So.... PerryHall, you were saying?
Double standard, expected response.
I knew it would happen.
If you would like to discuss politics, please name the political site and I will join you there.
Then it must be because our debt is a good investment
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Outperformed gold over the last decade.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Lot's of paper promises did.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Your affirmation is noted.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
What if ? It seems it was, (stolen) way back in ‘33. Lest we forget Israel Switt.
Why or how else did it supposedly end up on an Army post ?
I wonder what so many people would do if it were not for conspiracy theories. I know a couple of individuals that live and breathe these things.... and they BELIEVE them....ALL of them.... Of course, just because they are theories, does not faze them in the least.... facts are lies and theories are facts. Cheers, RickO
100% agree here. I was raised to believe the facts and that "alternative facts" are falsehoods (simple enough you would think.) When people start believing everything they are told without doing the research for the truths, then what good are we? Easy to frighten and herded along the wrong paths.
Really?
Dollar Suffers Worst Year Since 2003 (And The Future Looks Even Grimmer)
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Yup. You can try to provide "alternative facts", but the truth remains that an investment in the 10 yr treasury 10 years ago would leave you with more money today than an investment in gold.
I'm glad to see you still support your Russian news outlets.
Thanks for bringing the aforementioned conspiracy nonsense full circle. You da best!!
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Wouldn't the bulk of that money you are left with be a "promise" for money (the bond itself)?
I don't wear blinders when seeking the facts. As you have shown it results in a narrow view.
"Russian news outlets?" Sounds like you have been sold another conspiracy theory.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
.....the truth remains that an investment in the 10 yr treasury 10 years ago would leave you with more money today than an investment in gold.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Lol at the politics in this thread. The whole point of fiat currency is that it's worth what it's worth because the government says so. FRNs are built around the concept that the government has taxing authority and US government debt securities continue to be auctioned off to pay for our bills. m1, m2, m3 are different supplies and measures of what coinage/currency is actually in circulation versus the balances attributed to any deposits/investments at any institution (or all combined)...there doesn't have to be 100% of FRNs and coins to add up to the amount of money that the government agrees there is and acknowledges exists at the banks and will back up to $250,000 of with the FDIC. Fiat currency makes more sense than a commodity backed currency because how do you control supply and demand and monetary policy to tighten or ease flow of money and rates if you have to mine a certain amount of gold to issue the currency the federal reserve has determined needs to flow into the economy? You can't. It is too difficult and restrains things and makes bad situations worse. There are plenty of things you can put your money in if you don't like inflation and don't like having your cash sit around earning nothing.
If you really want to get political, what do you think about Steve Mnuchin's teeth? What a handsome smile he has!
Fiat currency's worth is determined by the holder's faith that the next person to receive it will give it the same value. Governments don't determine what a currency is worth, those exchanging it do. And these days we have been conditioned to accept the fact that it will be worth a little less each passing day.
Funny how a gold backed dollar worked for decades at keeping government spenders from digging deeper into our pockets, protecting currency value for those chose to save it, and keeping inflation under control. Why should anyone be forced to take risks with investments just to protect their purchasing power? A gold standard provided a store of value in the currency itself.
The difference between a consumer in Zimbabwe and the US is how rapidly they see their purchasing power erode. Slow it down enough and it's barely noticeable and apparently acceptable.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Well derry, it looks like you are one of the few people without said "faith." It is confidence, not faith. If you want to buy gold and stock up on green beans in your nuclear fallout shelter, you're free to do that, but you won't be getting ahead economically. A gold standard is ridiculous and ancient. The economy would be too tied to the mining of gold in order to issue currency. If the economy is falling and the government realizes it is in their best interests to increase the supply of money dramatically and immediately, what do you do? Send your workers out to the mines? What if they don't find enough gold? How do you issue that currency?
Like many here, I hold a variety of investments. Dollars are at the bottom of my list. The problem with your belief is in leaving it to money printers, who are no longer limited by a peg, to do what is in "their best interests." They saved you in 2008 by diluting your dollars when they should have been reducing their debt.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
The banks were allowed to reclassify their bad debts as assets in 2008 when the FASB buckled under to political pressure from Washington DC. That, and the fact that interest rate derivatives (and others) have continued to increase about every kind of leverage in the stock & bond markets makes for a very tenuous foundation.
The pressure on the economy is caused by debt maintenance, and when interest rates rise this will become more apparent just as it did when the taper tantrum reared its head. In other words, the dollar is screwed.
Why is bitcoin doing what it's doing? It's certainly not because of confidence in the dollar or in gov.com
I knew it would happen.
I agree with most of what you say, except that we are and have been in a low inflation period. Perhaps that will change, but not yet. The problem I was trying to address is that the Congress (who controls the purse strings) have signaled that the debt doesn't matter. Just pile more on and we'll reap the benefits now and oh, by the way, NOBODY LOOK AT WHAT IT COSTS US!
Now, the political stuff - Those who disagree with me about tax cuts and piling on $1.4T debt, must be brainwashed into believing the rising economy will offset the debt cost. It will never happen. The gold in Ft. Knox (in the form of debt) has been stolen by the politicians.
So the debt is expected to rise 10+trillion over the next few years and we are worrying about the 1.4t that has a political statement to make and has a slight chance of saving a few tax dollars for the working class.. Why aren’t you on here complaining about the other expected 8.5 trillion. Because it isn’t the talking point of the day? Or because we want to pretend it hasn’t double under the las5 couple administrations. Doesn’t make for good gloom and doom headlines or conspiracy theories or end of the world predictions.
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This isn't true. Gold mined out of the ground wasn't tied to the issue of currency. Also "the government realizes it is in their best interest to increase the supply of money" is exactly the problem.
The government can't be trusted to determine anything on an objective basis, because its corrupt.
Indeed, the nonpartisan Tax Policy Center found that increased growth would be counteracted within a few years by the drag of higher deficits; overall, the plan would increase deficits by $2.4 trillion during the first decade.
Where did you pull that info from? Better wipe afterwards.
This is six years old, so recent events are not covered:
theweek.com: What caused national debt - 6 culprits
@EagleEye said:
Seems like some good paper to wipe with
https://nytimes.com/2017/01/24/us/politics/budget-deficit-trump.html
https://thebalance.com/us-debt-by-president-by-dollar-and-percent-3306296>
So forgive me if my math isn't top notch, but the debt is going to rise significantly over the next several year or decade. Much more significantly than this 1.4t. The difference is that the rest of the debt goes to entitlements, infrastructure and military spending. Two of which the political party not in power seem to never have a problem with. The Johnny come lately deficit hawks. The tax cut isn't Armageddon.
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