1964 SMS coins
JesseD88
Posts: 8 ✭
Hey guys I have some side by side comparison pics that I wanted people to see. My coins will be on the left side and PCGS's coins are on the right in every photo.. just wanted the opinions of other people because I personally believe they are SMS.. any input is greatly appreciated. Im not done with the side by side pics of the nickel or penny yet.
0
Comments
All the SMS coins all came from internal mint sources (Eva Adams) to one dealer (Lester Merkin) and eventually to one auction (Stack's, 1990's) when his estate was sold. Jess Lipka bought them and dispersed them around 1993. I could have bought them all from Jesse, and wish I had, but I didn't recognize the importance they would have after registry sets became the rage. They were not released to circulation or in any other way that additional examples could be discovered.
They did re-use the dies for circulation strikes right?
Collector, occasional seller
Quite a few dies have die polish, die lines or die scratches on them (whatever terms you would like to use), but this does not mean they are SMS coins. I see no real indication that your coins might be SMS.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
Your coins don't look like the PCGS coins you posted.
Nice Try and very close! I don't think they are from the same dies. Did you buy them in a set? I would like to see the cent. The lines are bolder in it IMO.
The Quarter and the Half(reverse) appear to be from the SMS dies, unless those are hub defects I am seeing on each. They don't appear to have the same quality as the SMS coins though.
Collector, occasional seller
Just early strikes off new dies - nothing more. Certainly nice and with a great true pedigree. But not "SMS" or anything else. Compare to SI coins.
I inherited them from my grandfather when he passed away.. He collected coins his entire life and he kept these locked up in a safe, which is why I'm wondering about them.. the Kennedy even has the dangling 4 and from what I read, I understood that the teardrop was a sure fire way to identify it as SMS. I took all the pics with my phone so the quality is ehhh but I'll post the best pic I have that shows it..
I appreciate everyone's input
@JesseD88... Welcome aboard....Nice coins, but I do not think they are SMS.....Cheers, RickO
I thought you were going to send these in?
Kind regards,
George
If nothing else, you deserve a "E' for Effort.
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
All you have to do is look at the fields.
Nope.
Here’s a regular mint set on the left compared to what I believe could be one of (2) 64 D SMS pennies on the right. I got a 5,000 collection a little over a year ago. Some really amazing coins were in the large collection. In fact one of them I sent to PCGS and it came back tied for best known. It’s a 1922 2 1/2 Fr. Anyways, the flawless franc was found in a bag of foreign coins including come with mold on them showing even with how nice this was the owner didn’t bother to set this gem to the side in a special holder. The point I’m making is that out of the entire lot, only 2 sets of coins were put in special baggies. Just ziplock bags containing what I assumed to be (2) 1964-D mint sets. Then I looked closer and read the stories @nd checked the diagnostics. I’m in the process of building my case but I think it’s strong. Here’s a comparison of a plain mint set 64d Cent on left vs my possible Satin SMS 64d Cent on right.
None of the 1964 SMS coins had a mintmark. Maybe it was a mint set coin (your 1964-D above, I mean), but there is a world of difference ... and confusion ... between the two.
Sorry, but what you have is an ordinary penny.
Kind regards,
George
They do not look like SMS to me.
I disagree. SMS Satin Finish coins are not as easy to spot as people may think. The Smithsonian didn’t even know it had the 1964-D SMS Satin Finish until just a few years ago. The Denver Mint SMS does exist for 1964 and now that that’s a proven fact... it’s closed minded to 100% rule out that the Denver Mint only made one SMS Satin Finish for 1964 and yet the Philadelphia minted somewhere around 50 sets. Maybe the story just hasn’t surfaced yet.
Examine the true "first strike" coin in the Smithsonian before believing the story of "1964 SMS" coins and all the false embellishments associated with "vapor coins."
One of the half dollars dated 1964-D in the Smithsonian is what I consider to be a Special Strike coin. I grant you that. But I don't see anything remarkable about your cent. And I do not believe that any 1964 or 1964-D SMS coins are out in circulation and available to the general public. It's possible, but I have never heard of it happening. Believe me, I have been contacted many times by eager, fervent numismatists who are sure they are on to the next big payoff. Guess what? Not one has seen the moola yet.
Kind regards,
George
As they say "money talks, (other stuff) walks."
I think most collectors would LOVE to see a new and valuable discovery made, but proof, not persuasion, is necessary.
Which one is that, Roger? What date and denomination? And why do you believe it is a "true first strike"? We would all appreciate some real information.
Kind regards,
George
Some of the images are compelling, but when a certified set is viewed next to a really nice Mint Set, the difference with just the aid of the eye distinguishes the two as the SMS coins are by far more superior.
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
.
I see your point.
The coins are part of annual groups donated to SI by the US Mint. They are generally among the first pieces made off new dies. Anyone can go check the inventory and accession files there.
Everything about the phony "1964 SMS" is speculation. It's sad that so many get caught up in this drivel. Nothing more need be said.
The "phony 1964 SMS" coins are certified by your hosts on this forum. This crosses the line.
i almost thought it was pointless but realized it wAsent
given what Rick said in tracing the origin of the coins, added to the fact that they all have very specific die markers, should dissuade anyone from thinking they'll find a coin in an estate safe somewhere
I always thought this nickel had PL characteristics, but assumed the lack of FS precludes there being anything special. And now I see I didn't capture the 'chrome' look in the photos very well either:
Nice coin.
1964-D will come once in a while PL like this.
I might have the real deal
Welcome to the forum.
That does not look like an SMS example.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Please read the posts in this thread. They provide information from some of the top numismatists and researchers in the country. They are not YouTube hacks giving you incomplete/erroneous information just to get clicks.
Can you trace the provenance of your coin back to former Mint Director Adams or dealer Lester Merkins, or was it authenticated by a TPG (I believe all were originally certified by ANACS but they were later crossed to others)? If not, then you don't have. The YouTube "get rich from pocket change" hacks conveniently leave out those parts of the story
I saw and graded quite a few of them, while at NGC - I believe it was in the early to mid 90’s. I don’t think they were originally certified by ANACS.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Good to know. I recall reading about the ANACS authentication on the 64SMS auction listings in the Heritage site, but that was for coins consigned and sold a while ago
To bad Rodger is not available to chime in on this thread!
a.k.a "The BUFFINATOR"
@Cottonecoins ....Welcome aboard....but that does not appear to be an SMS Jefferson...Cheers, RickO