Brady looks 65

Dave99B

About time....

Dave

galaxy27

his cohorts on the other side of the ball made Alex Smith look like Johnny U on anabolic steroids and a rookie back the second coming of Marshall Faulk

DIMEMAN

I hope everybody is not counting NE out because of 1 bad game.

They WILL make adjustments and recover.

Coinstartled

Not a Pats fan but one game means little. See where they are at after 4 or 5.

perkdog

They looked awful, the Defense especially and Brady is missing Edelman big time. Maybe they just had a bad game? A few more games will tell, I remember when KC beat the bag out of them and everyone was talking about Brady being done blah blah blah and 2 Super Bowls later the haters are hating more lol

bronco2078

@perkdog said:
They looked awful, the Defense especially and Brady is missing Edelman big time. Maybe they just had a bad game? A few more games will tell, I remember when KC beat the bag out of them and everyone was talking about Brady being done blah blah blah and 2 Super Bowls later the haters are hating more lol

Brady was benched that game , well they didn't call it that but he was on double secret probation

lightningboy

I think its back to 35 again.

grote15

It's foolish to think this guy isn't an elite QB, still, after one bad game.

DIMEMAN

@grote15 said:
It's foolish to think this guy isn't an elite QB, still, after one bad game.

Exactly!

bronco2078

What a bum this guy is , only another 4th quarter game ending TD drive .

erikthredd

The guy just took a beating from the best front 7 in football and still managed to throw for 5tds & a 146% passer rating. Man its gonna suck for us Pats fans when he's gone lol.

lightningboy

Make that 25.

DIMEMAN

@erikthredd said:
The guy just took a beating from the best front 7 in football and still managed to throw for 5tds & a 146% passer rating. Man its gonna suck for us Pats fans when he's gone lol.

He has spoiled you. No matter who you get to replace him......it will be a downgrade.

erikthredd

He has and I love it. I'm hoping that Garoppolo is the next guy and i'm not really worried about the downgrade when they play in a division with 3 horrible teams every year lol. I've been waiting on investing in Garoppolo rookies until we see if he's actually gonna be playing in NE for awhile.

Justacommeman

He is just incredible. Best that ever was

mark

perkdog

I don't even bother responding to the Brady not being the best ever anymore because it's so obvious to everyone that he is. Even Dave99B believes it but he is still so butt hurt over the Seahawks handing the Pats a ring he will never admit it lol

galaxy27

Few thoughts on that game yesterday, as I watched it.

First, Brady is still a badass. I actually think he is hovering around his peak at 40.

Second, the Texans still do not know how to close out games. On three separate plays they had an opportunity to ice it: 1) needing a yard and coming up short prior to the game-winning Pats drive, 2) not recovering Brady's fumble on the game-winning drive, 3) Corey Moore dropping an INT on the game-winning drive. If you give Brady multiple lives, you're the one who is going to die a slow death.

Finally, and this irks me beyond comprehension, I really wish refs would start scrutinizing offensive PI in equal fashion. On the game-winning drive, Brandin Cooks shoved a Texans' d-back with both hands and created all kinds of separation, resulting in a completion and a ~35-yard swing (if he had been flagged). It may or may not have mattered with the GOAT working his magic, but I am so sick of it. It's difficult enough playing defense in the NFL nowadays, so when receivers are allowed to create air space illegally, you can forget about stopping anyone.

fergie23

Another classic from Brady. He is a top 3 current QB (top 1 in my book) in the NFL which is amazing at his age. Just hoping he stays injury free, the wear and tear from a 16 game season seems to have a bigger impact as QBs get older.

The Pats defense needs to improve if they want to compete in the playoffs. Long way to go so hopefully they can gel.

Robb

grote15

The best ever. No doubt in my mind at this point.

DIMEMAN

His record speaks for itself. He is amazing.

grote15

Pats D, on the other hand, does look 65..

erikthredd

@grote15 said:
Pats D, on the other hand, does look 65..

Time to give Vince Wilfork a call then go trade for a vet DE. This current front 7 aren't getting it done.

bronco2078

Nate Solder is getting tossed around , Malcom Butler is playing well finally though.

erikthredd

$%#@^&* Gilmore!

erikthredd

Great win by Carolina. They were able to finish unlike Houston last week. Stephon Gilmore just cost them this game.

bronco2078

@erikthredd said:
Great win by Carolina. They were able to finish unlike Houston last week. Stephon Gilmore just cost them this game.

He also cost the Patriots a lot of money, and so far I don't see why he was worth it. They should have just paid Butler

erikthredd

Butler is still in NE though. They should have paid Logan Ryan. Ryan,Butler & Rowe were a great trio last season. It is what it is at this point,Gilmore isn't going anywhere anytime soon and thursday night they have to face Mike Evans & Desean Jackson so its not going to get any easier.

perkdog

They need to address this horrible Defense. Uughhhhhk

Darin

I guess if you exclude Montana, he may be the best ever.
If memory serves, don't remember Montana losing any Super Bowls'.

grote15

@Darin said:
I guess if you exclude Montana, he may be the best ever.
If memory serves, don't remember Montana losing any Super Bowls'.

True, but Montana didn't reach the Super Bowl 7 times, or win 5, either.

Brady also didn't have Jerry Rice.

Darin

The Seahawks gave away one of those, he really should be 4-3 in the Super Bowl. No credit for that one.

Montana beat Elway and Marino in the Super Bowl, not to mention Boomer who was
a really good QB. The only notable QB Brady has beaten is the Falcons current QB.
Oh wait, speaking of the Falcons, Brady should be 3-4 in Super Bowls.

Justacommeman

@Darin said:
The Seahawks gave away one of those, he really should be 4-3 in the Super Bowl. No credit for that one.

I know you're only trolling but In that case Brady should have 7 since the Giants had two miracle plays and he already has 5.

The Royals should only have one World Series with your line of thinking. 1985 *

However-------"you are what your record says you are" - Bill Parcells

m

grote15

@Justacommeman said:

@Darin said:
The Seahawks gave away one of those, he really should be 4-3 in the Super Bowl. No credit for that one.

I know you're only trolling but In that case Brady should have 7 since the Giants had two miracle plays and he already has 5.

The Royals should only have one World Series with your line of thinking. 1985 *

However-------"you are what your record says you are" - Bill Parcells

m

Exactly.

If doesn't cut it in sports.

Justacommeman

@grote15 said:

@Justacommeman said:

@Darin said:
The Seahawks gave away one of those, he really should be 4-3 in the Super Bowl. No credit for that one.

I know you're only trolling but In that case Brady should have 7 since the Giants had two miracle plays and he already has 5.

The Royals should only have one World Series with your line of thinking. 1985 *

However-------"you are what your record says you are" - Bill Parcells

m

Exactly.

If doesn't cut it in sports.

It does if you're trolling

m

Darin

Notice you said the Royals. The team. Not any individual. Not even the star, George Brett.
The Pats have won 5, but I don't think Brady should get credit for all of them.
He definitely gets credit for last year beating the Falcons, but still the defense
deserves a lot of that credit.

I still say Montana was better. And the 49'er dynasty was better than the Pats.
Didn't Steve Young also win a couple Super Bowls with the niners.

Justacommeman

And of course the Pat's did it during the salary cap era which makes it even more remarkable. He's done it with 40 some odd different running backs and 50 some odd different receivers. Montana was great but Brady is the greatest

Mark

grote15

Salary cap has completely changed the landscape in the NFL. Teams had a much easier time building and retaining a dynasty back in the 70s and the 80s and 90s versus today, which makes what the Pats have accomplished even more impressive as they haven't had the luxury of keeping HOF players like the Niners did.

I had Montana ranked ahead of Brady till last Super Bowl. What Brady did in that game to carry the team from behind to win a 5th ring puts him in front of Montana.

Name one HOF receiver (other than an aging Randy Moss) or back Brady has had the benefit of playing alongside during his career. The parts keep changing, the Pats keep winning, and what is the constant you see on the field? Brady.

Darin

trolling what? You have a lot more posts the last couple days than me.
I'm not sure the definition of trolling, but aren't you and Grote trolling
Dimeman's thread about beckman of the Giants. See any posts
by me in that one.LOL. Lay off the guy once in a while, well ya?

Justacommeman

@Darin said:
trolling what? You have a lot more posts the last couple days than me.
I'm not sure the definition of trolling, but aren't you and Grote trolling
Dimeman's thread about beckman of the Giants. See any posts
by me in that one.LOL. Lay off the guy once in a while, well ya?

Oh I'm guilty of something for sure in that thread.

m

Darin

I'll just say this - Montana was great, Brady is great.
I would love to see them play against each other in a SB when both were in their prime.

But Montana beat Elway and Marino in their prime, so would probably dispatch Brady also.

Justacommeman

@Darin said:
I'll just say this - Montana was great, Brady is great.
I would love to see them play against each other in a SB when both were in their prime.

But Montana beat Elway and Marino in their prime, so would probably dispatch Brady also.

And I'll add this and leave it alone as I loved Montana------ Brady would have won every Super Bowl that the Niners QB's did if he was Quarterbacking those teams. I don't think Montana would have won 5 if was in New England. Of course we will never know

mark

erikthredd

Lmao Brady's defense loses another home game and we're now hearing the Montana comparison again. The ONLY stat any Montana fan can try to use in any argument is that 4-0 in SBs,that's it and 5 wins trumps 4 wins no matter how you look at it. Brady's career stats just destroy Montana's and that was with Montana playing with about a handful of HOF teammates while Brady had Moss for 52 games & Gronk. The only Pats players that might make it after that are Ty Law,Wilfork & Vinatieri and i think Vinatieri is the only lock to make it.
Sure Montana played in one SB each against Elway & Marino but i don't see how that makes him better than Brady or even relevant at all to this argument. Montana's 49ers had the better teams that's why they won.

This is only the 3rd time ever in the SB era that a QB has thrown for 1300yds & 10tds over the first four weeks of the season and Brady has done it twice. What he's done at the age of 39-40 has been better than most HOF QBs best seasons.
I just love that his team loses a couple games early in the season because of their defense and we start seeing the "well this guy is better than Brady" arguments again.

perkdog

Like I said I don't even bother arguing about Brady being the best anymore. It's a waste of time, people that hate the guy will never listen to logic. And there is ZERO logic behind any argument against him being the best ever.

erikthredd

It just cracks me up that we're hearing it now after his team just lost their second game like it was his fault they lost. Where were these debates 3 days ago,or a month ago or during the offseason? This topic has been here for 3+ plus weeks and its only now after his team is sitting at .500 after 4 games that we're hearing "well this QB is better than Brady anyways" arguments. Its happening over on ESPN as well.
Its hilarious. They must have missed Brady bringing his team back from down 14 in the 4th quarter yesterday against the NFL's best defense to tie it. Not to mention his comeback & game winner last week against the next best defense in football. The guy has his offense ranked 1st overall while averaging 32pts a game right now and the only reason anyone is still starting these debates again is because NE's defense can't stop anyone right now and it has the Pats sitting at 2-2.
Last time NE started 2-2 we were hearing they need to change QBs and Belichick needs to step down as GM because he overpaid for Revis who wasn't worth the money. I'm pretty sure things worked out just fine for NE that year when it was all said and done. End rant

keets

**I don't even bother responding to the Brady not being the best ever anymore **

Otto Graham.

my hunch is that his career was over before you were an NFL fan.

erikthredd

Yes Otto was done playing long before i was born in the 70's but you can't tell me he's a better QB than Brady when he played against the athletes from the 50's and just 12 NFL teams.

perkdog

Keets I was born in 1970 so yes I didn't see Otto Play but I do know football, I probably forgot more about the vintage era than you know.

perkdog

It's the same tired topic, Brady is dodging 300 pound behemoths that are fast while Otto faced at best a bunch of working class 240 pound guys.. You can't compare now to eras of the past you just can't do it because there is no comparison with the size and speed of the athletes today.

keets

it is interesting to note that Otto Graham still holds the NFL record for average yds/attempt.

you are correct, I won't try to tell you that Graham is better than Brady and I won't argue that Brady is better than Graham, either. it is hard to compare, the two eras being different. I will only say that all things being equal Otto Graham was probably more dominant at his position while he was playing than Brady currently is. another record held by Graham is the highest winning percentage for a starting QB, .814.

those two records, held for going on 70 years now, should at least cause others such as yourself to at least pause and consider Otto Graham whenever there is a "greatest of all-time" conversation.

I believe it is a little ridiculous to announce that Brady is hands down the best ever when many fans watching him today have little objective perspective. they don't even know who Otto Graham was and when they hear his name he is dismissed. I would trust the perspective of those few survivors who witnessed both of them playing.

erikthredd

So the numbers you are using to make Otto's case is his YPA at a time when QBs had half the yearly passing attempts than current QBs & winning percentage in a league with 12-13 teams were less than half finished under .500? Yeah good luck with that.

His career statistics are on the level of a Ryan Fitzpatrick or a Matt Schaub during an era where the players were no where near as fast or strong as the athletes are now.

I respect that you like one guy over the other,its all just opinions anyways but my rant above had more to do with Why was this debate brought up again,last night of all times,when this thread has been here since September 8th?
I'll tell you why,because the New England Patriots are 2-2 to start the season and some people are screaming the sky is falling because of it. Brady is playing the best he ever has at age 40,which is saying something, but he can't control his defense from giving up 30+pts a game.

galaxy27

~250 yards more than the next worst defense. Bottom half in rushing. If the Pats go deep this year Brady may be the most valuable player in the history of the solar system