@80sOPC said:
Uh, if you truly just pulled it from wax, how could you have questions about authenticity?
The box was beat up. It still had the seal, and a lot of the packs were beginning to open on the back. I cant imagine anyone filling a 36ct box and just putting it in there for shits and giggles. I just thought there were no more left. And I trust the opinions on here. Might have worded it a bit wrong, but I did pull it. How much do you think it would cost me to grade it?
@nam812 said:
PSA will only upcharge you on grading fees if the grade of your card puts you in a higher service level and higher return postage situation. So it is actually a problem you want to have.
For example, if you use $499 as your declared value, the cost to grade the card would be $20 (economy). If the card gets a PSA 8 grade, it will become a $5,000 card and it has to move up in price for grading to $200 (super express), and a little increase for return shipping value too since more insurance will be needed to get it back to you.
Now that is EXACTLY what I needed to hear man. Thank you. I didnt know the process. Thay was super helpful, and I appreciate it. I'll be back and let you all know what the grade is!!! Thanks man!
@countdouglas said:
I'm sorry, but I'm becoming a "doubting Thomas" more and more with each post. I'd like clarification on what "4th card in" means. Was the card in the half of the pack closest to the gum or the half of the pack closest to the wax seal? There are other cards missing black ink that would have been on the same print sheet as the Thomas, also. Can you look through your other cards from the prior 35 packs that you opened from that box and post some photos of any others that are missing ink? I don't believe they're missing their names, but rather black ink in the borders. If you can find additional errors from the box that you opened, it supports the idea that the Thomas could be legit.
I already looked. I only found 1 other thomas. With the name.
I apologize for upsetting you. You are the one that originally queried if the card was legit. I'm trying to suss out as much information as I can before offering an opinion. It does matter which half of the pack that you found the card, as well as what other cards were before and after, as the collation of the sheets that the cards were cut from is something that those who fake packs do not often get correct. Also, there would almost certainly be other player's cards from that same box also missing black ink. It is highly unlikely that the only error card in the entire box would just happen to be the golden ticket. I will step back now and see what others have to add. Good night, and good luck.
Apology accepted but not needed. I found a Griffey with a scar, but I threw all the others in the bin. I had absolutely no idea of these blackness cards. Legit. I probably just threw away some nice errors. I'm an idiot. A gentleman explained what an upcharge is and I understand now. I'm not a dealer, I dont have money to spend, within reason, but 200 for an upcharge for a double digit card would be worth it. I apologize for getting upset as well. I just have a hard time transferring thoughts to words on a text. Little bit of a TBI in OIF. I'll let you all know the grade....Rich
It would be worth your while to get the other cards out of the trash if it wasn’t long ago. The other blackless errors are fairly well sought after even if they have been in the trash.
Your card looks legit but if you can scan it or take some clearer pictures we could give you a better idea of how it would grade. Also I am curious what the yellow mark/stain is down by Frank’s knee.
As for the shrink wrapping, I’ve seen people/dealers shrink wrap old boxes after the fact for the purpose of resale and transportation. That could be why his 1990 Topps box was wrapped at the flea market.
@80sOPC said:
Uh, if you truly just pulled it from wax, how could you have questions about authenticity?
The box was beat up. It still had the seal, and a lot of the packs were beginning to open on the back. I cant imagine anyone filling a 36ct box and just putting it in there for shits and giggles. I just thought there were no more left. And I trust the opinions on here. Might have worded it a bit wrong, but I did pull it. How much do you think it would cost me to grade it?
@West22 said:
It would be worth your while to get the other cards out of the trash if it wasn’t long ago. The other blackless errors are fairly well sought after even if they have been in the trash.
Your card looks legit but if you can scan it or take some clearer pictures we could give you a better idea of how it would grade. Also I am curious what the yellow mark/stain is down by Frank’s knee.
Omg. Lol I couldnt figure out what you meant. That was a flake or something, it's not there now. I changed the penny sleeve.
@West22 said:
As for the shrink wrapping, I’ve seen people/dealers shrink wrap old boxes after the fact for the purpose of resale and transportation. That could be why his 1990 Topps box was wrapped at the flea market.
@nam812 said:
PSA will only upcharge you on grading fees if the grade of your card puts you in a higher service level and higher return postage situation. So it is actually a problem you want to have.
For example, if you use $499 as your declared value, the cost to grade the card would be $20 (economy). If the card gets a PSA 8 grade, it will become a $5,000 card and it has to move up in price for grading to $200 (super express), and a little increase for return shipping value too since more insurance will be needed to get it back to you.
It looks good to me. The better fakes out there have a blackless area on Frank’s right arm that is a smidge too low. They also have unusually high contrast - ie they look a bit too dark and not enough details in the shadows. I think if you can manage to get a scan of the card it will show correct contrast as photos don’t always paint the whole picture so to speak.
And plus, you pulled it from a pack. Unless you are trying to sell it raw to someone else, that is all you really need to know. If you are trying to sell you should just bite the bullet and get it graded Beckett or PSA. No offense intended here, but your first hand story will not be enough for most buyers. Especially over the Internet
Now if I saw a legit scan, I’d be willing to buy raw over the internet. With the T/B centering at 65/35 and right to left slightly off, and considering wear in lower right corner, my opinion is your card looks like a 7 or so. That’s not a slight. In the current market graded 7s should bring around $3,000 in auction, maybe more if you put it on EBay BIN and someone’s in the mood.
@countdouglas said:
I'm sorry, but I'm becoming a "doubting Thomas" more and more with each post.
This is entirely fake. Very obvious and one such tell is the deeply saturated/shadowed image. Extremely common on a number of the recent low quality fakes.
@junkwaxgems said:
This is entirely fake. Very obvious and one such tell is the deeply saturated/shadowed image. Extremely common on a number of the recent low quality fakes.
>
I noticed the over contrasted image but wanted to give the OP the benefit of the doubt since he claimed he pulled it from wax himself. I’ll hold off judgement until I see a HQ scab but I think if the OP is looking for offers/legitimacy of this card he should post a HQ scan.
@junkwaxgems said:
This is entirely fake. Very obvious and one such tell is the deeply saturated/shadowed image. Extremely common on a number of the recent low quality fakes.
>
I noticed the over contrasted image but wanted to give the OP the benefit of the doubt since he claimed he pulled it from wax himself. I’ll hold off judgement until I see a HQ scab but I think if the OP is looking for offers/legitimacy of this card he should post a HQ scan.
I'll try to find a scan machine. But how could this be fake if it came out of my pack? Yea the wax on the back of the packs were a lot less sticky but they are 35 years or so old so I expect that to be normal. All 36 packs were the same. I dont see how someone would open a pack, insert this, reseal it then sell it. Theres a gentleman on here that has been helping me via email. I'll put a few more up. I found a good light but still am using my phone camera.
But at this point I dont want to sell it I just wasnt aware of the value of this when I posted it the first time.
The most innocent answer as to why someone would ever insert a fake Thomas error into a pack is that someone is having fun at your expense. Their sick sense of humor has them amused that they have caused someone to get spun out with overwhelming excitement.
Such asses huh? I'm 100% on this one thou. The National, told to me by the gentleman helping me out above and beyond, is in NJ this year. I'm gonna take it personally there. I live in Massachusetts so I can drive there and I dont trust the mail system. ON ANOTHER NOTE, Kobe Bryant??? RIP. Wow, what a tragedy. I'm gonna keep these. I know this is a baseball site but I feel he deserves shout out to his family..
Am I misremembering, or did you say you pulled a "regular" Thomas out of the same box. I know nothing about the way these were distributed, but I would consider two variations in one box decidedly odd.
@junkwaxgems said:
This is entirely fake. Very obvious and one such tell is the deeply saturated/shadowed image. Extremely common on a number of the recent low quality fakes.
>
I noticed the over contrasted image but wanted to give the OP the benefit of the doubt since he claimed he pulled it from wax himself. I’ll hold off judgement until I see a HQ scab but I think if the OP is looking for offers/legitimacy of this card he should post a HQ scan.
Sorry, but the McDonald is not an error in the sense that it is unique or demands a premiuim. It is a printing error, but just a slight misalignments on the plates/registration error. You'll find this is not a unique occurance if you open enough junk wax.
@cardshark0131 said:
I hear this one is a rare find as well!!!!
>
No, it really is not.
But back to the Thomas. The border colors are off. Way too saturated. The cardstock looks fishy (revealed by nicks on edge, etc). Even the black print on back doesn't look like it came from a press, rather, a xerox of a card that did. Top to bottom OC on front and back are swapped. Just a poor effort overall.
Sadly, this is a very common ($10 BIN) reprint using "old" Topps stock. Not even one of the quality, 90s era ones, at that. Could I possibly be wrong? Sure but I strongly doubt it.
Comments
I dont think these boxes came with a seal.
This is another one I think is a error. He has a scar on his arm, and my other one isn't the same...@countdouglas is this wha
t you are asking?
Now that is EXACTLY what I needed to hear man. Thank you. I didnt know the process. Thay was super helpful, and I appreciate it. I'll be back and let you all know what the grade is!!! Thanks man!
Apology accepted but not needed. I found a Griffey with a scar, but I threw all the others in the bin. I had absolutely no idea of these blackness cards. Legit. I probably just threw away some nice errors. I'm an idiot. A gentleman explained what an upcharge is and I understand now. I'm not a dealer, I dont have money to spend, within reason, but 200 for an upcharge for a double digit card would be worth it. I apologize for getting upset as well. I just have a hard time transferring thoughts to words on a text. Little bit of a TBI in OIF. I'll let you all know the grade....Rich
It would be worth your while to get the other cards out of the trash if it wasn’t long ago. The other blackless errors are fairly well sought after even if they have been in the trash.
Your card looks legit but if you can scan it or take some clearer pictures we could give you a better idea of how it would grade. Also I am curious what the yellow mark/stain is down by Frank’s knee.
As for the shrink wrapping, I’ve seen people/dealers shrink wrap old boxes after the fact for the purpose of resale and transportation. That could be why his 1990 Topps box was wrapped at the flea market.
It was just shrink wrap. Not the Topps seal wrap
Omg. Lol I couldnt figure out what you meant. That was a flake or something, it's not there now. I changed the penny sleeve.
Yea it was like saran wrap thin..
Thanks man!
You're welcome, and good luck.
I’ve got 13 boxes of vending sitting here. Making me wanna rip into them.
PSA HOF Baseball Postwar Rookies Set Registry- (Currently 80.51% Complete)
PSA Pro Football HOF Rookie Players Set Registry- (Currently 19.80% Complete)
PSA Basketball HOF Players Rookies Set Registry- (Currently 6.02% Complete)
It looks good to me. The better fakes out there have a blackless area on Frank’s right arm that is a smidge too low. They also have unusually high contrast - ie they look a bit too dark and not enough details in the shadows. I think if you can manage to get a scan of the card it will show correct contrast as photos don’t always paint the whole picture so to speak.
And plus, you pulled it from a pack. Unless you are trying to sell it raw to someone else, that is all you really need to know. If you are trying to sell you should just bite the bullet and get it graded Beckett or PSA. No offense intended here, but your first hand story will not be enough for most buyers. Especially over the Internet
Now if I saw a legit scan, I’d be willing to buy raw over the internet. With the T/B centering at 65/35 and right to left slightly off, and considering wear in lower right corner, my opinion is your card looks like a 7 or so. That’s not a slight. In the current market graded 7s should bring around $3,000 in auction, maybe more if you put it on EBay BIN and someone’s in the mood.
Do it!!!
Thank you everyone for your help. You guys rock!
Don't rip. All known nnof Thomas's came from wax. You won't find any in vending unfortunately
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
This is entirely fake. Very obvious and one such tell is the deeply saturated/shadowed image. Extremely common on a number of the recent low quality fakes.
>
I noticed the over contrasted image but wanted to give the OP the benefit of the doubt since he claimed he pulled it from wax himself. I’ll hold off judgement until I see a HQ scab but I think if the OP is looking for offers/legitimacy of this card he should post a HQ scan.
I'll try to find a scan machine. But how could this be fake if it came out of my pack? Yea the wax on the back of the packs were a lot less sticky but they are 35 years or so old so I expect that to be normal. All 36 packs were the same. I dont see how someone would open a pack, insert this, reseal it then sell it. Theres a gentleman on here that has been helping me via email. I'll put a few more up. I found a good light but still am using my phone camera.
But at this point I dont want to sell it I just wasnt aware of the value of this when I posted it the first time.
The most innocent answer as to why someone would ever insert a fake Thomas error into a pack is that someone is having fun at your expense. Their sick sense of humor has them amused that they have caused someone to get spun out with overwhelming excitement.
Such asses huh? I'm 100% on this one thou. The National, told to me by the gentleman helping me out above and beyond, is in NJ this year. I'm gonna take it personally there. I live in Massachusetts so I can drive there and I dont trust the mail system. ON ANOTHER NOTE, Kobe Bryant??? RIP. Wow, what a tragedy. I'm gonna keep these. I know this is a baseball site but I feel he deserves shout out to his family..
-cdn.net/6027503/uploads/editor/ag/yq13qgyr41tq.jpg "")
Am I misremembering, or did you say you pulled a "regular" Thomas out of the same box. I know nothing about the way these were distributed, but I would consider two variations in one box decidedly odd.
Found another error!
I hear this one is a rare find as well!!!!
McDonald Tiffany misprint? The incomplete circle?
Both version
Both Versions, McDonald Tiffany and Base both have errors...
That's all I found in the box with the Thomas. Obviously not the Tiffany's. But the Base....
Sorry, but the McDonald is not an error in the sense that it is unique or demands a premiuim. It is a printing error, but just a slight misalignments on the plates/registration error. You'll find this is not a unique occurance if you open enough junk wax.
>
No, it really is not.
But back to the Thomas. The border colors are off. Way too saturated. The cardstock looks fishy (revealed by nicks on edge, etc). Even the black print on back doesn't look like it came from a press, rather, a xerox of a card that did. Top to bottom OC on front and back are swapped. Just a poor effort overall.
Sadly, this is a very common ($10 BIN) reprint using "old" Topps stock. Not even one of the quality, 90s era ones, at that. Could I possibly be wrong? Sure but I strongly doubt it.
Did that pack also have an MJ, and Stockton and Rodman rookies?
Just kidding.......I believe the guy. This just reminded me of that glorious schittsh0w!!