enough silver

1630Boston · February 8, 2017 2:24PM

Have you ever reached a momentary point in time when you said "I have enough silver" ?

derryb · February 8, 2017 2:32PM

No, but total should be a good balance of your overall portfolio. Good balance is debatable and lies at the root of much of the discussion on this forum. SHTF preppers are at one end of the scale and investors who believe the economy is in great shape are at the other end of the scale. Where you place yourself in between should determine your PM holdings percentage. Which PM to buy is another whole topic of discussion. Currently silver is under priced when compared to gold (i.e the gold to silver, GSR, ratio at work). I personally expect greater long term growth with silver.

jmski52 · February 8, 2017 4:06PM

Yes, because I tried to keep a set ratio of silver:gold:platinum as part of my allocation strategy. My silver ratio has fallen pretty far below my original ratio (and so has my platinum percentage) because I've been buying more gold than usual for a few years.

Having said that, I'm in the process of deciding what my new ratios really ought to be.

The main drawback with silver is, as you probably well know - secure storage space.

Mesquite · February 8, 2017 4:50PM

jmski52 - is your set ratio based on current monetary value or on total oz of each metal?

hchcoin · February 8, 2017 5:15PM

I get bored with stuff so I end up buying what seems the shiniest at the moment

Sometimes I like gold, sometimes I like silver, sometimes I like numismatics. I have never bought platinum or any other metals.

Downtown1974 · February 8, 2017 5:32PM

I have reached a point in terms of ounces that I am content with. While my main reason for accumulating silver was strictly for diversification of my investments, I must admit- I really enjoy the collecting aspect of it.

AUandAG · February 8, 2017 5:47PM

I've always felt you should have your own weight in silver,,,,,,,,ugh I'm still gaining pounds!

bob:)

crazyhounddog · February 9, 2017 12:36AM

Never enough silver but I got a lot it never ends. I have a huge appetite for the pretty stuff.

dpoole · February 9, 2017 7:11AM

I've bought silver bars in the past, but have limited PM purchases in recent years to items with some numismatic relevance and potential. I haven't considered ratios, so much as opportunity.

1630Boston · February 9, 2017 7:34AM

@AUandAG
Very interesting idea.

asheland · February 9, 2017 11:00AM

Not me.

Baley · February 9, 2017 12:15PM

Once I had more silver than I could barely carry all by myself,
I began (continued, rather) to put new PM money into gold, platinum, and numismatic coins.

Nowadays, if I want new bullionesque silver items, I sell off less interesting bullionesque silver items.

because as much as I can carry is enough for me.

ricko · February 9, 2017 12:30PM

Content with my stack at this point... still pick up an interesting piece now and then... Cheers, RickO

bigzestee · February 9, 2017 5:17PM

You mean there's an enough point? Joking aside never buy more than you can afford to have sit.You have to be willing to wait and have that money tied up for a while.Keeping it within what you can afford is the key to any investment.

Weiss · February 9, 2017 9:07PM

It's hard not to pick up interesting things when the price is right, even though I'm comfortable with where I am in my ratio.
But it has to be really interesting. And the price has to be really right.

cohodk · February 10, 2017 4:49AM

This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

More doldrums to follow.

tneig · February 10, 2017 8:03AM

When it got to heavy to easily carry/store it changed my view.
Been waiting for a decent swing to convert some to gold.

BAJJERFAN · February 10, 2017 8:57AM

@cohodk said:
This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

More doldrums to follow.

This place isn't even a drop in the bucket of stackers out there.

BAJJERFAN · February 10, 2017 8:59AM

@tneig said:
When it got to heavy to easily carry/store it changed my view.
Been waiting for a decent swing to convert some to gold.

If you can sell your stack for a profit, why wait?

Baley · February 10, 2017 9:23AM

@BAJJERFAN said:

@cohodk said:
This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

More doldrums to follow.

This place isn't even a drop in the bucket of stackers out there.

Well, if "the stackers out there" haven't bought by now, what are they waiting for?

I've asked this before, who are the New buyers of precious metals? Folks buying because William Devane advised them?

BAJJERFAN · February 10, 2017 9:46AM

@Baley said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@cohodk said:
This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

More doldrums to follow.

This place isn't even a drop in the bucket of stackers out there.

Well, if "the stackers out there" haven't bought by now, what are they waiting for?

I've asked this before, who are the New buyers of precious metals? Folks buying because William Devane advised them?

How would I know who they are? There are a number of places that have PM discussion groups and message boards and BST type boards and PMs seem to sell. Google is your friend you know.

My point was that this place is hardly the pulse of the PM market, just like the BST is hardly the pulse of the coin market.

For 7 working days into the month, the mint's output of just 250,000 ASEs would maybe indicate a slowdown in demand.

cohodk · February 10, 2017 2:17PM

@BAJJERFAN said:

@cohodk said:
This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

More doldrums to follow.

This place isn't even a drop in the bucket of stackers out there.

You don't need a large sample size to extrapolate a high confidence interval. I've found this forum to be a great indicator of market sentiment and have benefitted greatly.

1630Boston · February 10, 2017 4:12PM

Statistical analysis, when properly employed and interpreted, is a very powerful toy

OnlyGoldIsMoney · February 10, 2017 6:22PM

I plan to cease purchasing silver at 12,000 ounces.

DoubleEagle59 · February 10, 2017 8:03PM

At the current GSR - NEVER!!

tneig · February 11, 2017 6:09AM

Not profitable to do that right now. But on a swing I could do some more conversion with the hope of covering some of the conversion loss.
I know the ratio time is not the best to go from silver to gold, but that only relates if a person would be utilizing a ratio in the proper way. Most probably don't and not likely I would be able to do it correctly either.

@BAJJERFAN said:

@tneig said:
When it got to heavy to easily carry/store it changed my view.
Been waiting for a decent swing to convert some to gold.

If you can sell your stack for a profit, why wait?

BAJJERFAN · February 11, 2017 11:06AM

@tneig said:
Not profitable to do that right now. But on a swing I could do some more conversion with the hope of covering some of the conversion loss.
I know the ratio time is not the best to go from silver to gold, but that only relates if a person would be utilizing a ratio in the proper way. Most probably don't and not likely I would be able to do it correctly either.

@BAJJERFAN said:

@tneig said:
When it got to heavy to easily carry/store it changed my view.
Been waiting for a decent swing to convert some to gold.

If you can sell your stack for a profit, why wait?

Would selling at a loss make you or break you? At current GSR I wouldn't sell silver at a loss to buy gold tho I did sell silver at a gain and bought some gold. Depending on your cost, I'd be looking to buy silver to DCA down so I could get out. unless you like looking at a closet full of silver. In order for GSR to change favorably, Ag is going to have to go up a lot or Au is going to have to fall a lot. The chance of either happening any time soon is small IMO. With new money I wouldn't let the GSR influence my thinking at this point. Depends on if you're buying to hold/stack or flip for a profit if/when a sufficient price rise happens. Another biggie is having good sources to buy from and sell to.

BAJJERFAN · February 11, 2017 11:08AM

@cohodk said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@cohodk said:
This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

More doldrums to follow.

This place isn't even a drop in the bucket of stackers out there.

You don't need a large sample size to extrapolate a high confidence interval. I've found this forum to be a great indicator of market sentiment and have benefitted greatly.

Great for you if it works. I know this place used to be a lot better to sell from than it is now. Don't know if it's due to more people selling or people not being as flush with cash as they used to be.

bigzestee · February 11, 2017 3:13PM

Great for you if it works. I know this place used to be a lot better to sell from than it is now. Don't know if it's due to more people selling or people not being as flush with cash as they used to be.

If prices are higher here than somewhere else they'll go somewhere else.Some want to buy for spot/melt/under market and most won't sell for it.Some won't buy from someone out of the core group for understandable reasons.There's a lot of factors at play here.I don't think cash flow is the main culprit.A person won't sell much at 20% over market and won't buy much at 20% under market.

BAJJERFAN · February 11, 2017 3:51PM

@bigzestee said:

Great for you if it works. I know this place used to be a lot better to sell from than it is now. Don't know if it's due to more people selling or people not being as flush with cash as they used to be.

If prices are higher here than somewhere else they'll go somewhere else.Some want to buy for spot/melt/under market and most won't sell for it.Some won't buy from someone out of the core group for understandable reasons.There's a lot of factors at play here.I don't think cash flow is the main culprit.A person won't sell much at 20% over market and won't buy much at 20% under market.

FWIW, my pricing was competitive with or slightly better than places like JMBullion, etc. People here have only so much money to spend whether it be coins or bullion. Again the sales potential here is just a teeny tiny fraction of the BIG market out there.

bigzestee · February 11, 2017 4:04PM

@BAJJERFAN I wasn't saying you specifically.In fact I don't know what you're trying to sell.I see things from various members priced higher than market average.Which is fine it's their items and they can ask whatever they want.They're not going to sell it if it can be found cheaper other places.Flippers can't make any quick money and collectors aren't going to overpay.Not trying to step out of line but I think a good chunk of what's "for sale" here is nothing more than eye candy.Like I said cash flow isn't the main culprit.It may play into it but it's not the main issue.

BAJJERFAN · February 11, 2017 5:40PM

@bigzestee said:
@BAJJERFAN I wasn't saying you specifically.In fact I don't know what you're trying to sell.I see things from various members priced higher than market average.Which is fine it's their items and they can ask whatever they want.They're not going to sell it if it can be found cheaper other places.Flippers can't make any quick money and collectors aren't going to overpay.Not trying to step out of line but I think a good chunk of what's "for sale" here is nothing more than eye candy.Like I said cash flow isn't the main culprit.It may play into it but it's not the main issue.

I mentioned me, so there's that. I was just commenting that based on my experience from years past that it seems to be harder to sell certain PMs here than it used to be.

cohodk · February 11, 2017 6:17PM

@BAJJERFAN said:

@cohodk said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@cohodk said:
This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

More doldrums to follow.

This place isn't even a drop in the bucket of stackers out there.

You don't need a large sample size to extrapolate a high confidence interval. I've found this forum to be a great indicator of market sentiment and have benefitted greatly.

Great for you if it works. I know this place used to be a lot better to sell from than it is now. Don't know if it's due to more people selling or people not being as flush with cash as they used to be.

It's due to most everyone having enough.

BAJJERFAN · February 11, 2017 7:50PM

@cohodk said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@cohodk said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@cohodk said:
This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

More doldrums to follow.

This place isn't even a drop in the bucket of stackers out there.

You don't need a large sample size to extrapolate a high confidence interval. I've found this forum to be a great indicator of market sentiment and have benefitted greatly.

Great for you if it works. I know this place used to be a lot better to sell from than it is now. Don't know if it's due to more people selling or people not being as flush with cash as they used to be.

It's due to most everyone having enough.

Maybe here, but I see it sell quick enough in other places. Then again it's likely the case that in small groups such as here a fair number of folks are tapped out. As long as one has the funds there is no such thing as having enough.

Baley · February 11, 2017 9:24PM

This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

It's due to most everyone having enough.

As long as one has the funds there is no such thing as having enough.

Sure there is. Many of us have just said we have enough silver

The Funds get invested in something we feel has greater potential to increase in value.

BAJJERFAN · February 11, 2017 9:35PM

@Baley said:

This thread is telling me that stackers are largely satiated.

It's due to most everyone having enough.

As long as one has the funds there is no such thing as having enough.

Sure there is. Many of us have just said we have enough silver

The Funds get invested in something we feel has greater potential to increase in value.

Well some feel that way, but not all. Even I would probably reach a saturation point if money was no object. It would probably be much higher than it is now.

Then again, 50,000 ounces would be a royal PITA to get rid of; esp. if it was some of the oddball stuff that some people stack.

Baley · February 11, 2017 10:02PM

It would be very easy to get rid of, just let certain folks know you have left it unguarded and it will disappear.

It wouldn't be hard to sell for some amount less than melt, the buyer would probably either pick it up or pay for shipping.

Ah, but selling 50000 ounces piecemeal, AND getting the "premium"?

Yep, royal PITA!

PerryHall · February 12, 2017 6:13AM

@BAJJERFAN said:>
Then again, 50,000 ounces would be a royal PITA to get rid of; esp. if it was some of the oddball stuff that some people stack.

Agree. Some of the "oddball stuff" such as rare bars are not very liquid. Your local coin shop will most likely only pay melt for it. These rare bars can only be sold on eBay or a similar auction venue unless you know a fellow rare bar collector that wants your rare bar and is willing to pay the big premium over melt for your bar. I have several rare bars that I paid a modest premium over melt for but I have no illusions that it will be easy to get that premium back.

JohnnyCache · February 12, 2017 12:26PM

I have, what I consider to be, a sufficient amount of gold and silver, as things stand right now.
The caveat may be the "as things stand right now" part, but I grow tired of worrying about the endless potential disasters.

I believe holding some portion of assets in pm's is most definitely worthwhile, and I don't currently have any intentions to part with pm's I've already purchased. However, I find myself questioning whether or not further investment into the metals would be the best use of available funds.

I have always thought, and still hope, that the pm's I've acquired will be held by me and, at the time of my death, pass on to my children. But I've have begun to consider that acquiring any more pm's, than what is already being held, could prove to be more of a bother to my children.
Would it not be better to leave more of other assets, or even just cash savings?

When different bullion producers ** first** started to introduce new shapes and sizes of silver bullion I was intrigued. I bought a number of objects and rounds. I had been bored with silver eagles. Then the market exploded and everyone was producing all kinds of shapes and figures of bullion. That's when I felt like the silver bullion market jumped the shark, and I stopped buying odd items. I went back to my boring silver eagles, of which I only buy a couple of tubes per year.

I think it's a personal decision, not a one size fits all, as far as "what is enough".
For me, I feel I have enough.

bigzestee · February 12, 2017 2:58PM

50,000 ounces is easy to get rid of.Just list at spot or slightly above and money will come in from everywhere.Some people are just cheap and don't want to pay premiums.While trying to sell here I've heard several "if I wanted to pay ebay price I'd buy from ebay not some newbie" and "I'm a good buyer it just has to well below ebay so I can flip" bs responses and I haven't been here that long.

WildIdea · February 12, 2017 10:52PM

I've asked myself this many times. What is enough?

It's a simple question of does it make me a little nauseous if silver drops .20 cents and I (basically) lost X in the time I got dressed in the morning? Then yes, I have enough. A term I call fully invested. Means I'm not comfortable plunking more cash into something I really don't intend to sell.

Now, I still have the habit of going to my B and M and visiting and maybe buying a trinket for old times sake.

Transitioning into other interests as well. I've realized I can buy parts for my classic car restoration instead and for mostly the costs of a few silver oz or bars. And frankly, I'm realizing there us a lot more upward potential in selling that someday than my PMs.

DoubleEagle59 · February 13, 2017 6:03AM

It was earlier posted:

------But I've have begun to consider that acquiring any more pm's, than what is already being held, could prove to be more of a bother to my children.
Would it not be better to leave more of other assets, or even just cash savings?--------

Aren't we all in agreement that given two choices (PM's or US cash) to leave to your children (meaning a long term venture) that PM's is the prudent and therefore ONLY choice?

cohodk · February 13, 2017 6:40AM

@DoubleEagle59 said:
It was earlier posted:

------But I've have begun to consider that acquiring any more pm's, than what is already being held, could prove to be more of a bother to my children.
Would it not be better to leave more of other assets, or even just cash savings?--------

Aren't we all in agreement that given two choices (PM's or US cash) to leave to your children (meaning a long term venture) that PM's is the prudent and therefore ONLY choice?

It must really suck to feel you only have 2 choices. Like life or death. That a terrible way to think.

BAJJERFAN · February 13, 2017 9:37AM

@DoubleEagle59 said:
It was earlier posted:

------But I've have begun to consider that acquiring any more pm's, than what is already being held, could prove to be more of a bother to my children.
Would it not be better to leave more of other assets, or even just cash savings?--------

Aren't we all in agreement that given two choices (PM's or US cash) to leave to your children (meaning a long term venture) that PM's is the prudent and therefore ONLY choice?

At least they aren't likely to sell the cash for 50 cents on the dollar. It's the safest thing to leave to them.

derryb · February 13, 2017 11:16AM

@BAJJERFAN said:

@DoubleEagle59 said:
It was earlier posted:

------But I've have begun to consider that acquiring any more pm's, than what is already being held, could prove to be more of a bother to my children.
Would it not be better to leave more of other assets, or even just cash savings?--------

Aren't we all in agreement that given two choices (PM's or US cash) to leave to your children (meaning a long term venture) that PM's is the prudent and therefore ONLY choice?

At least they aren't likely to sell the cash for 50 cents on the dollar. It's the safest thing to leave to them.

On the other hand 1913 dollars sell for about .03 cents on the dollar. Inflation/currency destruction are the reason most prefer PMs (and other money protectors such as real estate), and not cash, in their estate. Ever since Nixon freed gold in 1971, history shows that time is gold's best friend and, since 1913 (creation of the Federal Reserve), currency's worst enemy.

BAJJERFAN · February 13, 2017 11:28AM

I'd posit that in many cases that time will not be your children's/heirs' best friend because they'll want the money NOW. Just sayin!

derryb · February 13, 2017 11:32AM

@BAJJERFAN said:
I'd posit that in many cases that time will not be your children's/heirs' best friend because they'll want the money NOW. Just sayin!

Can't have it till I die. Hope time is on my side as much as it is for gold.

The longer one expects to live the more important to have an estate that maintains value.

PerryHall · February 13, 2017 11:48AM

For you guys with lots of gold and silver that worry that your children won't know how to dispose of it, I just want you to know that I'm available for adoption.

Downtown1974 · February 13, 2017 12:22PM

@PerryHall said:
For you guys with lots of gold and silver that worry that your children won't know how to dispose of it, I just want you to know that I'm available for adoption.

Haha....I would be willing to inherit everyone's silver here without putting you through the pain staking adoption process. Plus, if you adopt PerryHall....you'll have to feed him. Think of the money you'll save just by giving me your silver.

cohodk · February 13, 2017 2:42PM

@derryb said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@DoubleEagle59 said:
It was earlier posted:

------But I've have begun to consider that acquiring any more pm's, than what is already being held, could prove to be more of a bother to my children.
Would it not be better to leave more of other assets, or even just cash savings?--------

Aren't we all in agreement that given two choices (PM's or US cash) to leave to your children (meaning a long term venture) that PM's is the prudent and therefore ONLY choice?

At least they aren't likely to sell the cash for 50 cents on the dollar. It's the safest thing to leave to them.

On the other hand 1913 dollars sell for about .03 cents on the dollar. Inflation/currency destruction are the reason most prefer PMs (and other money protectors such as real estate), and not cash, in their estate. Ever since Nixon freed gold in 1971, history shows that time is gold's best friend and, since 1913 (creation of the Federal Reserve), currency's worst enemy.

Oh really, how much silver will you have to trade to acquire a federal Reserve $1bill from the teens or early 20s?

derryb · February 13, 2017 4:20PM

@cohodk said:

@derryb said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@DoubleEagle59 said:
It was earlier posted:

------But I've have begun to consider that acquiring any more pm's, than what is already being held, could prove to be more of a bother to my children.
Would it not be better to leave more of other assets, or even just cash savings?--------

Aren't we all in agreement that given two choices (PM's or US cash) to leave to your children (meaning a long term venture) that PM's is the prudent and therefore ONLY choice?

At least they aren't likely to sell the cash for 50 cents on the dollar. It's the safest thing to leave to them.

On the other hand 1913 dollars sell for about .03 cents on the dollar. Inflation/currency destruction are the reason most prefer PMs (and other money protectors such as real estate), and not cash, in their estate. Ever since Nixon freed gold in 1971, history shows that time is gold's best friend and, since 1913 (creation of the Federal Reserve), currency's worst enemy.

Oh really, how much silver will you have to trade to acquire a federal Reserve $1bill from the teens or early 20s?

Guess I should clarify for the comprehension impaired: Inflation/dollar devaluation has destroyed 97% of the dollar's purchasing power since 1913.

So let's jump to 1971 (when gold prices became subject to price discovery). You're pops put away $10,000 cash in his mattress for you and you got it last week when he passed away. Would you rather have that $10K in cash or would you rather have the 238 ounce of gold ($291K) he could have bought with it? Hint: $10K sure ain't what it used to be.

enough silver

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