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Anybody in Central California Have Interest in 1943-S Copper?
planonit
Posts: 525 ✭✭
There is no need being cryptic anymore.
I have had contact with about hour south of Sacramento who may (emphasis on may) of found a 1943-S Copper in pocket change.
I can say with 99.98% (It is never 100%) the guy is not a scam artist and he genuinely hopes it is real as well. Now I have spent a long time talking with this guy and last year I had him send me some scans which I sent to Sam Lukes who looked at the scans and said "Maybe". Obviously scans are limiting.
Coin has been weighed and all good there but seen plenty of very, very, very good altered dates.
It is just hard to work out schedules. I can't fly all the way to San Fran or Sacramento just to inspect this. Being blunt the odds are very unlikely to be real BUT in of all the ones offered to me this is the only one that I have said "Well Hell. Might be the real deal here."
If any experienced members on here are in this area please send me a PM. Like to set up a meeting at a bank around this area.
Thanks
I have had contact with about hour south of Sacramento who may (emphasis on may) of found a 1943-S Copper in pocket change.
I can say with 99.98% (It is never 100%) the guy is not a scam artist and he genuinely hopes it is real as well. Now I have spent a long time talking with this guy and last year I had him send me some scans which I sent to Sam Lukes who looked at the scans and said "Maybe". Obviously scans are limiting.
Coin has been weighed and all good there but seen plenty of very, very, very good altered dates.
It is just hard to work out schedules. I can't fly all the way to San Fran or Sacramento just to inspect this. Being blunt the odds are very unlikely to be real BUT in of all the ones offered to me this is the only one that I have said "Well Hell. Might be the real deal here."
If any experienced members on here are in this area please send me a PM. Like to set up a meeting at a bank around this area.
Thanks
I have plans....sometimes
0
Comments
means very little - most of the counterfeits
are struck on genuine, common copper planchets.
If the weight is correct, the next thing to
do is to see if it's a struck counterfeit.
If you or the owner wants to email me
good, large, clear, crisp photos/scans,
I'll be glad to view them (or put 'em up here).
I'm glad to view the coin in my office, but if
the person wants to drive 6-7 hours down
here to L.A., he's welcome to - but I'll
look at the coin carefully, and if I believe
it's a counterfeit, I'll say that, spend just
a few minutes talking to the person, and then
have to get back to work. Not sure if it's
worth the long drive, when a few good photos
--should-- be good enough, hopefully, to make
a determination.
Or, he can have a local dealer send the coin into
PCGS directly. They'll look at it in the PCGS
offices, and if it's obvious, probably won't even
send the coin to me.
Did you tell him to try to stick it to a magnet?
Yes. Passed that as well
Guy is very nervous about handing the coin off to anybody to ship.
If I can't find anybody close he will be taking the coin to a show the 1st week of November in Sacramento.
One time I did travel 7 hours by car to Montreal by car to look at a restored classic muscle car ($18K) that by photos looked to be exactly what I was looking for. And the owner described the restoration in detail. It was about the most sure thing I could imagine. Yet when I got there, a 7th grade shop class must have done the work because the resto was so botched (right down to the paint and bodywork) that it needed another whole restoration....lol. I wouldn't have paid $10K for that mess. And the irony of this entire deal was that in that same garage the owner had a mint, mid-1960's Max Wedge race car that was perfect and detailed to the nth degree. He clearly knew the difference.
I live in the SF Bay Area, and often drive through Manteca on weekends
(on Friday and Sunday nights, though - probably not the afternoon meeting at a bank
the owner is likely seeking).
So I could potentially take some better photos if those would help.
I'm not an expert on die struck counterfeit 1943-S cents, though.
Check out my iPhone app SlabReader!
I wouldn't trust a coin shop. Remember the 1913 nickel that was declared fake and sat in a closet for decades? And I certainly wouldn't take the word of another collector who happens to live in the area. If the coin is really convincing it should be validated by a respected TPG.
Lance.
On the sole occasion when I attended the A.N.A. summer seminar, I witnessed just such a test in the physics department of Colorado College, when an alleged '43 copper cent that had been submitted to ICG was tested by J.P. Martin and some Colorado College staff. The coin did not pass as genuine, because the actual percentage of copper content did not match the Mint standard of 1942.
Even a quick scan with a portable X-Ray Fluorescence gun would probably define the elemental composition sufficiently to determine if the coin is genuine, without having to go through the protocol for accessing SEM/EDX equipment.
There are several enterprises in my immediate area that have provided quick and efficient use of their portable XRF scanners for elemental analysis of medals and jewelry.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
Lance.
That wasn't just any old coin shop....that was Stacks of New York City, probably the biggest and sharpest dealer at the time that made that dermination.
How are you going to buy it if it turns out to be real? What will be the price? How will you even make an offer unless it is sent in for authentication?
The only way I could remotely see this happening would be for you both going to a show together, with a written contract in place to purchase it, pending the outcome of the grading. Do the 4 hour service and they will probably tell you it has to go back to the shop anyway.
If I owned that coin and was not a scammer, I would drive to PCGS and drop it off, if I was so paranoid about shipping. He lives in CA per your message. He would then auction it off and get the money it is worth.
There is no chance this is legit. Sorry.
I agree. The odds that it's a scam are far higher than the coin and seller being legit.
Wishful thinking by non experts is probably even more common than scams.
The odds are long but certainly not impossible. I think it's possible that there may be one or more 1943 copper cents still undiscovered but the odds of something like a new 1894S dime are smaller.
The problem with composition analysis is that won't tell you if it's an altered date.
Wishful thinking by non experts is probably even more common than scams.
The odds are long but certainly not impossible. I think it's possible that there may be one or more 1943 copper cents still undiscovered but the odds of something like a new 1894S dime are smaller.
I agree with this 100%. Analysis of the composition will just mean it has the same composition. Gotta look for altered date as well. I agree with you, I'm sure somewhere in a jar of copper cents that someone collected that there is a 1943 copper sitting waiting to be found. This may not be it though.
And come on, of course the owner hopes its real... There is 6 figures on the line. Anyone who would have that would HOPE it's real. But hope doesn't mean it is. This is probably the most faked error coin in existence - granted I don't know much about errors so I am assuming this.
I, like many others here, believe that in the age of the internet, the owner of this coin would have immediately had some idea of the magnitude of this coin if it was real with just a simply 5 second google search and would not have dillydallied at all about sending it in to have it authenticated. With $200,000+ on the line, if the owner really thought this was real, it would have been his top priority, assuming he's not some billionaire.
The long beach coin was show this month, why didn't he drive down? I would think that with $200,000 on the line, he could make time in his schedule for this.
Successful transactions with: wondercoin, Tetromibi, PerryHall, PlatinumDuck, JohnMaben/Pegasus Coin & Jewelry, CoinFlip, and coinlieutenant.
This sounds like the same guy that called me about a year or two ago. He was convinced it was the real deal, but never showed me any photos or scans.
Can you PM me his phone #?
Did you tell him to try to stick it to a magnet?
Yes. Passed that as well
Does it pass the CoinStar machine test? Or is it rejected?
Did you tell him to try to stick it to a magnet?
Yes. Passed that as well
Does it pass the CoinStar machine test? Or is it rejected?
LOL
Did you tell him to try to stick it to a magnet?
Yes. Passed that as well
Does it pass the CoinStar machine test? Or is it rejected?
Cracked me up. Thanks for this.
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The problem with composition analysis is that won't tell you if it's an altered date.
That is what electron microscopes are made for.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.american-legacy-coins.com
I think it is rare but don't know where to sell it.
In fact I don't even know where it is now. I found it when I was 12 or 13 and the screwdriver slipped a few times while I was discovering the error.
Can any of you suggest where I could find this coin?
And sell it when I do.
We'd have to meet at a bank or something though.