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Stickers on PO1 - the phone call
messydesk
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So a previous thread inspired me to shoot an e-mail to CAC asking about what a sticker, rejection for a sticker, means for a PO1 coin. This led to a phone call with JA.
If a PO1 coin has a sticker, it means it's a coin that, while completely worn out, doesn't have too many other issues like minor damage, uneven wear from being bent and straightened, or signs of corrosion or stains or scratches that grading services may consider market acceptable for the grade. It does not mean that a PO1 is any closer to either a FR2 or a completely smooth planchet. It means it's a "wholesome" coin.
They have never put a gold sticker on a PO1 coin and he said that in order to do that, the coin would have be closer to AG-G.
He hasn't given consideration to the increased desirability for a coin that is worn "above and beyond" the requirements for PO1. While he admits that people pursue these because they think it is fun, and thinks it's great that they do, CAC doesn't participate in the ultra-low grade premiums, so those coins would get the same bid as other solid PO1 coins.
If a PO1 coin has a sticker, it means it's a coin that, while completely worn out, doesn't have too many other issues like minor damage, uneven wear from being bent and straightened, or signs of corrosion or stains or scratches that grading services may consider market acceptable for the grade. It does not mean that a PO1 is any closer to either a FR2 or a completely smooth planchet. It means it's a "wholesome" coin.
They have never put a gold sticker on a PO1 coin and he said that in order to do that, the coin would have be closer to AG-G.
He hasn't given consideration to the increased desirability for a coin that is worn "above and beyond" the requirements for PO1. While he admits that people pursue these because they think it is fun, and thinks it's great that they do, CAC doesn't participate in the ultra-low grade premiums, so those coins would get the same bid as other solid PO1 coins.
John
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
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``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
I just got this back from CAC:
That brings up good insight into another question that comes up frequently. That gold stickers most likely mean a coin is solid for at least 2 grade points higher not just good for the next grade up. Thanks for the curiosity Mess
I wouldn't go that far. We just discussed the concept of a gold sticker on a PO1, which has never been awarded. What they mean at other levels may not be the same.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
But doesn't that mean that CAC holds PO01 to a different standard than all of the other grades?
In any case, if they pass on a PO01, then in my opinion it should be considered a more desirable lowball example. Since PCGS does a fine job on their own of weeding out damaged/cleaned/problem PO01 coins and body bagging them. Those would be labeled as such with a details lowball number attached. Or genuine not gradable.
Ahh, I'm flattered that I inspired someone.
But doesn't that mean that CAC holds PO01 to a different standard than all of the other grades?
I didn't bring up the word "wholesome" in the discussion, but perhaps I should have thought to. I think that's what the sticker means in the low circ grades.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know what CAC bids for stickered P01 Morgans?
$15 for generics as of yesterday.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Thanks for calling JA and clearing the air on this topic.
I just got this back from CAC:
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``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
i guess that would be kind of fun having a sticker on a coin in every grade range. Ah, but which coins would I put in my box of 70 ?
Technically that would be box of 30 in the Sheldon Scale , if my calculations are correct,.. and reasoning.
PO 01
FR 02
AG 03
G 04, 6
VG 8, 10
F 12,15, 18
VF 20, 25, 30, 35
XF 40, 45
AU 50,53,55, 58
MS 60,61,62,63,64,65,66,67,68 & 69
I don't think JA would sticker any 70's .
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
Ahh, I'm flattered that I inspired someone.
But doesn't that mean that CAC holds PO01 to a different standard than all of the other grades?
In any case, if they pass on a PO01, then in my opinion it should be considered a more desirable lowball example. Since PCGS does a fine job on their own of weeding out damaged/cleaned/problem PO01 coins and body bagging them. Those would be labeled as such with a details lowball number attached. Or genuine not gradable.
By its nature and origin, a circulated coin shouldn't be expected to be problem free and most aren't. Therefore as a collector one tries to get the most "wholesome" example for the grade whether it be AG or high ms. Look around on eBay and try to find common date xf Walkers that are wholesome, that is without dings, scratches, etc. and with good eye appeal. They are few and far between.
I would call something like this a wholesome example.
This one not so much.
Wanting the poorest grade doesn't necessarily mean that one wants the poorest condition.
Why would people spend money for stickers on PO01 coins? Interesting, but I would rather spend the money on coins.
I think people spend money on coins for their enjoyment. I know I do. I often ask myself after spending money on grading why I can't do that myself, too. The answers vary. It depends on who's answering them, but ___ knows eBay won't allow it.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
Doug Winter currently has this one for sale... I think it's pretty cool, actually:
Oh man, that's sweet! If I hadn't just replaced my water heater, I'd be all over it....coincidentally, the prices are very close.
Why would people spend money for stickers on PO01 coins? Interesting, but I would rather spend the money on coins.
I think people spend money on coins for their enjoyment. I know I do. I often ask myself after spending money on grading why I can't do that myself, too. The answers vary. It depends on who's answering them, but ___ knows eBay won't allow it.
In a nutshell, a TPG opinion commands more respect than yours or mine or that of most other coinists!
Why would people spend money for stickers on PO01 coins? Interesting, but I would rather spend the money on coins.
I think people spend money on coins for their enjoyment. I know I do. I often ask myself after spending money on grading why I can't do that myself, too. The answers vary. It depends on who's answering them, but ___ knows eBay won't allow it.
In a nutshell, a TPG opinion commands more respect than yours or mine or that of most other coinists!
It can also command more money than the underlying coin itself. Us collectors are a weird bunch
Just out of curiosity, does anyone know what CAC bids for stickered P01 Morgans?
$15 for generics as of yesterday.
That is melt value. I wonder what he would pay for nickel and copper generics... Face value?
(This is not meant as criticism to CAC; I would only pay melt as well).