'No Rays' PCGS Proof-64 Shield Nickels for less than $500 Each!

Analyst

Over the last eight years, I have not heard many collectors talk about Shield Nickels. How do the members of this forum feel about them? Are many of you working on sets? Do members of this forum focus upon Proofs or business strikes or both?

According to John Albanese, there is not much "downside risk" in collecting Proof-64 Shield Nickels. Current prices are much lower than they were in the past! I say that it would be fun to build a set of Proofs of the 'No Rays' type, which would be missing just the 1877 and the 1878!

While Proof 'With Rays' nickels cannot be purchased for less than $500, neat business strikes can be. Overall, Shield Nickels may be effectively collected for less than $500 per coin.

Classic U.S. Coins for Less than $500 Each, Part 23: Proof Shield Nickels

Traz

I have a nice set. In my comments you can see that it's obvious crack outs are always trying to get better grades. Most of these were top pops when I bought them. I've since moved on to more stable coins pop wise such as older dated gold and proof gold. I will finish the complete proof nickel set when the right coins come along.



My shields are here. My sig should have the whole nickel proof



http://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset.aspx?s=72283

tradedollarnut

Love them. The 67 rays proof is one of the fallen rarities.

howards

Stupid website give me error code 113 everytime I try to respond to this.



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ERROR: One of the values in the url has not passed validation.



Error Code: 113

ricko

I like these coins in proof.... Cheers, RickO

Jackthecat1

I find high grade Shield Nickels to be very attractive.

messydesk

I was thinking the general popularity of Shield Nickels suffers due to lack of a portrait on the coin, but 3 cent nickels and Liberty nickels are probably just as neglected. The only Shield nickel I have in my collection is a 67 Rays in AU58.



It does look like there's something's wrong in the article:



"In March 1980, Proof-64 Shield nickels were selling for about one-sixth of current prices, like 16 cents on the dollar! In 1989 or 1990, they got to only about half of their March 1980 levels, but still three times current levels. They are probably down 30% since 2007"



How can 1990 prices be half of 1980 and 3 times current prices if 1980 prices were 1/6 of current prices?

Analyst

JA (as quoted by me): In March 1980, Proof-64 Shield nickels were selling for about one-sixth of current prices, like 16 cents on the dollar! In 1989 or 1990, they got to only about half of their March 1980 levels, but still three times current levels. They are probably down 30% since 2007

Messy: How can 1990 prices be half of 1980 and 3 times current prices if 1980 prices were 1/6 of current prices?

Please refer to current price level for Proof-64 Shield Nickels as X. According to JA, the price level in March 1980 was 6X. Therefore, current prices are one-sixth of the corresponding prices in March 1980. Also according to JA, the peak in 1989 or 1990 was 3X, which was half the March 1980 level and three times the current level.

I thank MessyDesk for raising such issues, and I hope that this article is clear enough. JA is referring to dealer-bid prices, which I did not wish to emphasize in the article. It is often a good idea for collectors to pay retail prices. When collectors attempt to buy at wholesale levels, they often end up with sub-par or doctored coins. Additionally, the concepts of wholesale and retail price ranges were beside the point of the article. By citing various auction and "Internet-sale" results therein, readers are given an idea of the market levels for Proof-64 Shield Nickels. As some dates are scarcer than others, and every certified 'Proof-64' Shield nickel is not of the same quality, it would not have been a good idea to publish one number as relating to all 'Proof-64' Shield Nickels, IMO.

In another article, I discuss the meaning of auction prices:

What are Auction Prices?

I thank MessyDesk for raising such issues, and I hope that this article is clear enough.

Traz: My shields are here. My sig should have the whole nickel proof

http://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/alltimeset.aspx?s=72283

No kidding, although I do not draw conclusions from viewing images, this does seem like it is an exceptional set. I saw Eliasberg's name mentioned. It might be interesting to note some additional pedigrees.

Traz: I've since moved on to more stable coins pop wise such as older dated gold and proof gold.

This is more of an issue in regards paying sharp premiums for 66 to 68 grade, early 20th century nickel or silver coins, which are not rare at all. The values of many gem 20th century coins have been hurt by grade-inflation and related matters.

howards

Originally posted by: tradedollarnut

Love them. The 67 rays proof is one of the fallen rarities.

The '67WR proof well-deserves to be a fallen rarity (fallen at least, in price). While many reference books list the mintage as 25, this is in error. The mintage is much higher than 25. In fact, the '67WR proof was struck several times over many years after 1867 for collectors.



The supposed mintage of 25 rests on mint records which say 25 proofs were delivered delivered in February 1867. I believe that these 25 pieces were no rays proofs with the prototype Judd J-507 reverse. If you want to read more about this, the ANA published my article about it. You can read it here:



http://www.shieldnickels.net/a...1867Proofs/errata.html

howards

I originally started to build a complete set of nickels 1866 to present. But while I was starting on the shield nickel section, I discovered the fantastic varieties available in shield nickels. I had been a VAM collector for several years, and shield nickels beat them by a mile.



I am not that attracted to proof shield nickels. It is true that Pr64 are nearly constantly available for all dates at reasonable prices. That's what makes them uninteresting compared to the varieties, some of which I still haven't found after searching for decades. The proof shield nickels that I do own are varieties (1868 RPD and 1879/8). Neither of these is rare or even scarce.



I do have a friend who decided to collect all of the shield nickel proofs BY DIE PAIR. It's a feasible project since not that may dies were used. He is almost 100% complete.



I probably have over 600 shield nickel varieties catalogued. No one will ever own them all. A small number of the varieties I own are thought to be unique. Most of them have a small handful known at best (less than 20 or rarer). They were available at reasonable prices, which is another reason I like shield nickels. I could not afford to collect such great rarities in any other US series.

howards

For anyone else struggling with the error 113, I discovered by trial and error that including a less than sign in my post was causing the issues.

messydesk

Please refer to current price level for Proof-64 Shield Nickels as X. According to JA, the price level in March 1980 was 6X. Therefore, current prices are one-sixth of the corresponding prices in March 1980. Also according to JA, the peak in 1989 or 1990 was 3X, which was half the March 1980 level and three times the current level.

OK. In that case the sentence about "In March 1980, ... for about one-sixth of current prices" is backwards.

astrorat

Originally posted by: messydesk

Please refer to current price level for Proof-64 Shield Nickels as X. According to JA, the price level in March 1980 was 6X. Therefore, current prices are one-sixth of the corresponding prices in March 1980. Also according to JA, the peak in 1989 or 1990 was 3X, which was half the March 1980 level and three times the current level.

OK. In that case the sentence about "In March 1980, ... for about one-sixth of current prices" is backwards.

You are correct. I imagine the quote was transcribed incorrectly.

“There is very little downside to buying Proof-64 Shield nickels now,” declares John Albanese. “In March 1980, Proof-64 Shield nickels were selling for about one-sixth of current prices, like 16 cents on the dollar! In 1989 or 1990, they got to only about half of their March 1980 levels, but still three times current levels. They are probably down 30% since 2007,” John adds. Albanese is the founder and president of Certified Acceptance Corporation (CAC)."

March 1980 price is 1/6 of current price.
1990 price is 1/2 of March 1980 price

Current price is X.
March 1980 price is X/6
1990 price is (x/6)/2

So, based on the article quote attributed to JA, if the current price of a PF-64 Shield nickel is $600, then in March 1980 the price was $100 and the price in 1990 was $50.

It seems much more compelling to collect proof Shield nickels if the the current price is 1/6 of the historical price of March 1980, rather than the other way around.

291fifth

I collected mint state shield nickels in the 1990's. I sold them at a major auction in 1999. My advice regarding shield nickels is simple ... avoid them like the plague. My wallet still hurts from the extent of the loss I took when they were sold. They are an unpopular series and are likely to stay that way.

Analyst

Astrorat: I imagine the quote was transcribed incorrectly.

Yes, I am not sure how that happened. A couple words need to be changed, and I will ask an editor to change them. I take responsibility. I am glad that MessyDesk and Astrorat noticed this issue. Next time, please send an e-mail,

Insightful10@gmail.com

MrEureka

The way I see it, collectors have been relatively uninterested in most proof type coins since the late 70's. Mostly, I think, because the coins are relatively uninteresting, available and expensive. In other words, collecting proof type is more about spending money than about the thrill of the chase. This holds true for virtually all proof type from 1858 to date, copper through gold. And it also holds true for some other types of coins, most obviously silver and gold commems.

Of course, there are ways to make proof type collecting more challenging. You can go for colorful coins, or cameos, or finest knowns. Those coins are still in great demand, of course. But the majority of the coins in the market - including all PR 64 Shield Nickels - are of little interest to collectors. And I wouldn't recommend them to a collector, except maybe as an investment. Investors love proof type coins. They have low mintages, they're shiny, they're easy to understand and easy to buy. When and if investors come back to coins in a big way, proof type should have a nice run.

Baley

Coins without an image of a human being on them, or at least an animal, face an uphill battle with collectors.