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Hindsight 20/20

GazesGazes Posts: 2,315 ✭✭✭✭✭
Question---if you had put a majority of your investments into coins when you started collected---would you have done better than the investment strategy you in fact actually took. Now a few comments. I realize everyone started collecting at different times. That's ok ---just answer for yourself. Second, I know it is impossible to know what you would have bought and sold. However, use your best guess knowing your collecting style what you would have bought. I think you can assume you sold as much as you sold your actual investments (if you never sell stocks than assume you never sold any coins ). I know there is no precise way to do this but I would be curious to hear everyone's thoughts. Thanks

Comments

  • Cougar1978Cougar1978 Posts: 8,723 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I would have done better.

    When first started doing shows in 1990 wish had gone more into large size US Currency, especially Gem Nationals. Also would have concentrated more in world and bullion US gold.

    Your question addresses. But what if you wish you had invested more money in coins vs spending it on travel and entertainment related things which once that money spent gone forever.
    Coins & Currency
  • OKbustchaserOKbustchaser Posts: 5,541 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I'd be broke....

















    and deservedly so.
    Just because I'm old doesn't mean I don't love to look at a pretty bust.
  • YorkshiremanYorkshireman Posts: 4,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    As someone who works for a major firm in the financial advisory profession, I must admit that I cringed as I read your thread.



    While very high end coins have been good investments over the extremely long term, even most dealers warn collectors not to treat their coins as investments because that market is so unpredictable and inefficient.

    I would rather have my tactically managed portfolio of stocks and ETFs.
    Yorkshireman,Obsessed collector of round, metallic pieces of history.Hunting for Latin American colonial portraits plus cool US & British coins.
  • gripgrip Posts: 9,962 ✭✭✭✭✭
    But so are the stocks and ETF's unpredictable. Sorry makes no sense to me.
  • YorkshiremanYorkshireman Posts: 4,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: grip

    But so are the stocks and ETF's unpredictable. Sorry makes no sense to me.





    The movement of the investment markets can not be predicted, but there are trends that can be tracked and followed.
    Yorkshireman,Obsessed collector of round, metallic pieces of history.Hunting for Latin American colonial portraits plus cool US & British coins.
  • TopographicOceansTopographicOceans Posts: 6,535 ✭✭✭✭
    Not even close.

    In fact I'd need my investments to cover my losses from buying coins.
  • hchcoinhchcoin Posts: 4,836 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I know I wouldn't have done better but I would have one heck of a large collection of coins compared to what I actually own.
  • mariner67mariner67 Posts: 2,746 ✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: TopographicOceans
    Not even close.

    In fact I'd need my investments to cover my losses from buying coins.


    +1
    Successful trades/buys/sells with gdavis70, adriana, wondercoin, Weiss, nibanny, IrishMike, commoncents05, pf70collector, kyleknap, barefootjuan, coindeuce, WhiteTornado, Nefprollc, ajw, JamesM, PCcoins, slinc, coindudeonebay,beernuts, and many more
  • GazesGazes Posts: 2,315 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Enjoying these responses to my thread ! Thank you
  • BryceMBryceM Posts: 11,850 ✭✭✭✭✭
    No comparison. It's astonishing to me how just the dividends from stocks add up over time. Coins have too much of a buy/sell spread and too many liquidity problems to make a fair comparison, but I'd take some losses if I sold now, especially if the time frame was short and I couldn't personally coax and prod each piece though the sale process. Selling an entire portfolio of stocks & bonds takes just a few minutes......



    For me, I find it healthier to keep the concepts of investing and collecting in different sectors of my brain. It's probably not a good idea to put money you can't afford to lose in something as ephemeral as collectibles. It's a hobby for me, and just something that's supposed to generate enjoyment. If it makes a few bucks, fine. If it loses a bit, fine. It's the thought of total collapse of the coin market that's uncomfortable.



    I try to rationalize the collection as a diversified tangible asset, but the opportunity costs of holding non-producing items are real.
  • 291fifth291fifth Posts: 24,595 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I wouldn't have done very well because I was not selective enough when I started collecting. If I knew then what I know today and bought accordingly I would have done much better.
    All glory is fleeting.
  • chumleychumley Posts: 2,305 ✭✭✭✭
    I would now be too poor to afford this internet connection
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Life is to be lived.... a narrow focus such as this (devoting funds, time, energy - all to one

    thing) detracts from the pleasure of life. Sure, some will disagree, but such a narrow life scope limits one's experiences and pleasures. I do not know of anyone who, on their death bed, summoned the strength with their last breath, to say "I wish I had worked harder and longer."

    Cheers, RickO
  • JedPlanchetJedPlanchet Posts: 908 ✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: ricko
    Life is to be lived ...



    image
    Whatever you are, be a good one. ---- Abraham Lincoln
  • amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I collected world coins the better part of 40 years. So much more bang for the buck and very few were interested in world coins at the time. I always felt that as the rest of the world economy grew so would the market for other country's coins. You know what? I was right! I have done extremely well! I puled every cent I had out of the stock market in the mid nineties and put it into coins. I would wager I would be worth 1/5th of what I am now if I had left that money in the stock market! I started selling my world coins about 10 years ago and am still selling. I wish I had waited a bit longer as many of the coins I sold early have gone up quite a bit since I sold them.
  • TwoSides2aCoinTwoSides2aCoin Posts: 44,514 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Would have kept what I liked most. Other's always seem to want to pay me more for the stuff I like most. image I haven't figured that part out. HOW TO KEEP what I like.
  • ElmerFusterpuckElmerFusterpuck Posts: 4,777 ✭✭✭✭✭
    "I puled every cent I had out of the stock market in the mid nineties and put it into coins. I would wager I would be worth 1/5th of what I am now if I had left that money in the stock market!"



    I really don't think so about the one fifth. I started investing in the stock market with index funds and have done very well, even with the downturns. Yes, some coins have done well but like others have said, it's far easier to buy and sell stocks.
  • YorkshiremanYorkshireman Posts: 4,583 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: amwldcoin

    I collected world coins the better part of 40 years. So much more bang for the buck and very few were interested in world coins at the time. I always felt that as the rest of the world economy grew so would the market for other country's coins. You know what? I was right! I have done extremely well! I puled every cent I had out of the stock market in the mid nineties and put it into coins. I would wager I would be worth 1/5th of what I am now if I had left that money in the stock market! I started selling my world coins about 10 years ago and am still selling. I wish I had waited a bit longer as many of the coins I sold early have gone up quite a bit since I sold them.




    From the mid 90's. most major stock market indices are up multiples of the earlier level.

    In fact, $10,000 invested in the S&P on 1/1/95 would be worth about $65,000 now.

    A bit of tactical management made the numbers look much better



    Are many coins worth more than 6 times what they were 20 years ago?





    Yorkshireman,Obsessed collector of round, metallic pieces of history.Hunting for Latin American colonial portraits plus cool US & British coins.
  • mustangmanbobmustangmanbob Posts: 1,890 ✭✭✭✭✭
    When I lived in Alaska, there was a saying:

    There are Old Pilots and Bold Pilots but there are no Old Bold Pilots.

    In having to deal with going to numerous crash site, the words of the Prophet Clint Eastwood often came to mind:

    "A man has got to know his limitations."

    For the elite 1%, they can make a decent to excellent living off of coins. I am not counting those that profit solely by ripping off the uninformed or desperate.

    I am not in the group.

    But I did retire at 53, no pension, taken a few jobs to ease the boredom and keep SWMBO happy. My retirement and 401k's are happy in the stock market, and I have not touched them yet. I play with big boy cars now.

    If I would have rolled it all on coins, I would probably be in the Veteran's Homeless Shelter.
  • amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I know it is probably hard to believe my claim. I would wager I have turned that money over enough times to equal any gains it would have made being invested in the stock market not including the collection I amassed. Quite a bit of my collection I sold at horrendous profits(Think huge Russian collection at near the peak of the market. Many sold for 30-50 or more times what I paid for them years ago)! I bought many very large deals at a time when no one cared about world coins! My 1st big purchase was 10 or 11 double row boxes from a dealer that just sold me his inventory of world coins! He sold them to me for $1100 and at the time the cat value was over 10K! I can go on and on with better and larger deals than this! The biggest was over 50 double row boxes of really good coins!



    I collected every coin in KM by date. I had a rule I would never sell anything I didn't already have. I was constantly upgrading and adding while more than paying for what I kept with the duplicates I sold. This is actually how I became a dealer. I started setting up at shows to buy all those unwanted World Coins!
  • Kind of a dumb question (no offense) but everyone would do better because they would pick the path that would do better. Someone is going to say I would pick the exact same path because I'm a true collector and don't do it for the money, ya right. Even you would buy some home runs to cover your true blue collection.
  • GazesGazes Posts: 2,315 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: IwasAgentjim007

    Kind of a dumb question (no offense) but everyone would do better because they would pick the path that would do better. Someone is going to say I would pick the exact same path because I'm a true collector and don't do it for the money, ya right. Even you would buy some home runs to cover your true blue collection.




    Sorry you found my post to be a "kind of a dumb question". I did preface the question saying I know it would be impossible to say with any certainty but try to use your best guesstimate knowing your collecting/purchasing style. Some styles probably have a better return than others. Judging from the responses not everyone agrees they would do better since many people said they wouldn't have. Again, I thought it was a fun question and that would create some interesting responses. Again, sorry you found it "dumb"

  • joeykoinsjoeykoins Posts: 17,369 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Remember OP, when you first joined our forum I told you that you'll be sent to school! On this forum, one must deal with some criticism. Your in school learning about disagreements, tests on your patience and other things. Just learn to not take every response personal. Remember, just have fun! To answer your question, I probably would have kept up with collecting various "sets". I did finish a few but end up selling them. In which, I regret to this day. Esp. my Buffalo Nickel set. Man-n-n, I love that set but apparently, not enough to keep. Oh well, this happens in the hobby.-joeyimage

    "Jesus died for you and for me, Thank you,Jesus"!!!

    --- If it should happen I die and leave this world and you want to remember me. Please only remember my opening Sig Line.
  • GazesGazes Posts: 2,315 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Originally posted by: joeykoins

    Remember OP, when you first joined our forum I told you that you'll be sent to school! On this forum, one must deal with some criticism. Your in school learning about disagreements, tests on your patience and other things. Just learn to not take every response personal. Remember, just have fun! To answer your question, I probably would have kept up with collecting various "sets". I did finish a few but end up selling them. In which, I regret to this day. Esp. my Buffalo Nickel set. Man-n-n, I love that set but apparently, not enough to keep. Oh well, this happens in the hobby.-joeyimage




    Thanks Joey. My response to Iwasagent was mostly to explain it was a fun question to hear about people's thoughts---and looking at the thread I think that was accomplished. Trust me, I don't take it personal and thought my post was positive. I will say that I personally would not have responded to anyone saying "its kinda a dumb question" but that's just me and how I handle myself. He is certainly free to speak his mind.



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