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The "P" Mint Mark.
keets
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Why did the Mint start to use the "P" for Philadelphia issued coins in the 1970's??
Al H.
Al H.
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keets
Posts: 25,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
keets
Posts: 25,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
keets
Posts: 25,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
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Margo said that she did not know, and would call her friend, Stella Hackel, the Mint Director. She went into her office and made a call, and came out a few minutes later and said that Stella did not know, but would find out and call her back.
An hour or two later the Mint Director called back, and after finishing the call Margo told us "It's going to be above the point of the shoulder, and they are going to use a P for the Philadelphia strikes!" This was news to us, as it had not been mentioned in the press release. The 1979 Philadelphia dollars had the P, and starting in 1980 everything else did except for the cent. They skipped the cent because they were still mint marking dies by hand back then, and there were just too many cent dies being made.
Why they decided to use the "P" on the 1979 dollars I do not know, but I have always wondered if my innocent question resulted in the Mint Director getting involved in the process at the Mint and winging the decision to use the "P."
TD
But couldn't you have asked for a nicer coin?
R.I.P. Bear
I for one will always call it the DeLorey mark !
But couldn't you have asked for a nicer coin?
Makes sense.
Being in Philly she never thought about where the mint mark went.
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Love the stories that get posted here
I wonder why the P isn't used on the cents now?
And another question: I recall seeing somewhere a 2003 cent in a PC holder labelled : "2003-P".
Has anyone else seen this, and would this be considered a mechanical error?
early 90's.... Then I would show them a dime or something with the P... they would be all
amazed.... Obviously this was pre-internet and the collectors were mainly semi-casual
collectors... Thanks for the story Capt. Cheers, RickO
Makes for a short thread, though
TD, did you make a phone call to the Mint in late 1967??
nothing against the good Captain, but I don't really think his phone call prompted the Mint to start using the "P" MM, so the mystery isn't solved and my question isn't answered. a similar question would be what prompted the Mint to move the MM to the obverse??
TD, did you make a phone call to the Mint in late 1967??
I had no clout. Margo did.
Was in high school in late 1967.
I'm just wondering if Margo's getting Stella Hackel involved in the process caused Ms. Hackel to say something to the minions at the Mint like:
"We don't use a P mint mark for Philadelphia? Why not? Let's start using one on the new dollar!"
Yes, it is idle speculation, but unless you can get somebody working in the Mint in 1978 to spill the beans it is the best I got.
TD
I was at Coin World in the Fall of 1978 when we received the final designs for the Susan B. Anthony dollar in a press release from the Mint. As we were standing around the managing editor's desk looking at the pictures I asked "Where will the mint mark go?" That's the kind of coin geek I am.
Margo said that she did not know, and would call her friend, Stella Hackel, the Mint Director. She went into her office and made a call, and came out a few minutes later and said that Stella did not know, but would find out and call her back.
An hour or two later the Mint Director called back, and after finishing the call Margo told us "It's going to be above the point of the shoulder, and they are going to use a P for the Philadelphia strikes!" This was news to us, as it had not been mentioned in the press release. The 1979 Philadelphia dollars had the P, and starting in 1980 everything else did except for the cent. They skipped the cent because they were still mint marking dies by hand back then, and there were just too many cent dies being made.
Why they decided to use the "P" on the 1979 dollars I do not know, but I have always wondered if my innocent question resulted in the Mint Director getting involved in the process at the Mint and winging the decision to use the "P."
TD
Well, I could think that my letter to the US Mint was the reason they stopped making Satin Finish coins for mint sets but how naive would that be? There had to be more or other complaints/letters of an entirely different reason(s) why they stopped...........And why PCGS finally improved their holders.........that couldn't have been entirely.....just me?
Leo
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
Why did the Mint start to use the "P" for Philadelphia issued coins in the 1970's??
Al H.
IMO they ruined a great tradition of no-mintmark Philly coinage.
The only exception I'll excuse is one of my sentimental all-time favorites: The super-size "P" on war nickels.
Successful BST transactions with forum members thebigeng, SPalladino, Zoidmeister, coin22lover, coinsarefun, jwitten, CommemKing.
Ba dum ching.
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
Accept the sms coins where minted in Sanfrancisco.
Of particular interest to Mr. Keets was an item in the July 4 edition, P. 1, quoting a June 25 press release from Dr. Alan Goldman stating that:
A: Starting in 1980, the cents struck at the Denver Mint would not have a mint mark, to discourage hoarding. Shades of 1965-67! Elsewhere in the run of issues I looked for there were articles about the rising cost of copper, and how it might lead to a change in the composition of the cent, as eventually happened in 1982.
B: Starting in 1980, a P mint mark would be put on all Philadelphia-minted denominations EXCEPT the cent. It mentioned that the SBA dollars were already being struck with the P mint mark. It did not say why they had started doing it on the SBA in 1979, but as I continue reading backwards (am looking for something for an unrelated article) I will look for an explanation of that decision.
C: The San Francisco produced one cent coins would continue to carry an S Mint mark. I assumed that that was referring to the Proofs, but there was also a long article in the July 11 issue (P. 3 or 4, with a jump to P. 32) that said that circulating coins struck at the S.F.A.O. would have an S. mint mark on them.
Obviously "A" never happened, nor the second part of "C," but at least this establishes that the Mint was paying a lot of attention to mint mark policy in this time period. Perhaps an examination of the Mint Reports for 1978-80 will provide more clues.
TD
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Coin World Dec. 27, 1978, P. 1 (with jumps to pp. 14 & 18) has a long story about the first strike ceremony at the Philadelphia Mint on Dec. 13 that "reveals" the Mint's plan to use a "P" mint mark on the dollar. No mention of the fact that Stella told Margo this back in October, and no mention of it in other stories published between October and this one. My guess is that Stella called Margo back and embargoed the news until she could "reveal" it at the first strike ceremony.
Coin World Jan. 17, 1979, P. 1. Story by David Ganz about being at the first strike ceremony. Second paragraph says:
"On Dec. 13, the first small-sized dollar was produced at the Philadelphia Mint, and Mint Director Stella B. Hackel made an electrifying announcement that in order to increase public awareness of the facility, the "P" Mint mark would be utilized on the coin."
The story went on to say that adding the P mint mark to other denominations in 1980 would be considered later in 1979, probably in October after the SBA's had been out for three months and they could see what reaction people had to the "P" mint mark. Basically they were afraid that the P-mint dollars would be TOO POPULAR, and that they would be hoarded rather than circulate. This was not an unreasonable consideration if you look at how the S-mint cents of 1968-1974 were sometimes hoarded.
So there's your answer...."to increase public awareness" of the Philly Mint.
TD
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Public awareness campaigns are usually launched for the purpose of motivating people to do something, such as spending more money to find a cure for a disease. I don't see the point of making the public more "aware" of the Philadelphia Mint - how is this awareness going to impact their decisions?
At Congressional budget hearings?
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
A "P" mint mark would have come in handy in 1917. I have a terrible time figuring out which category my 1917 Philly half belongs in - no mint mark on obverse or no mint mark on reverse.
Yes.
We also had a change in the die alloy.