Calling Lincolniana/CWT experts ! Can you help identify these tokens ?

shadargroup

These appear to be struck in brass, and the first one appears to be the Fuld combination of patriotic dies 125 / 160, which is unlisted in Fuld as a pairing. The second token obverse appears to be Fuld 127, but I've found no matches for the reverse. Maybe both listed in King ? Are these even contemporaries ?

Broadstruck

Top one is Brass... Lower looks like it might be German Silver or Nickel.

Top is a Fuld-125/160b Rarity-9 in Brass / King AL-1864-50 probably worth between $1-2K +/-.

Bottom in copper is a Fuld-127/428a which also Rarity-9 which fetches over $1K... Figuring yours might be a Rarity-10 also wroth closer to $2K.

jonathanb

Wow. I don't collect Civil War tokens, and even I knew enough that those pictures got my attention.

First is 125/160b R-9. Also cataloged as a political medal as AL 1864-50
Second is 127/428e R-8 (if white metal; several other "white"-type compositions). Also cataloged as a political medal as AL 1864-50

VERY nice! Any more where those came from?

BillJones

The first one is Patriotic CWT 125 / 160 b. It is rated as an R-9. It is an official CWT, but I personally don't think that it is a contemporary piece. The obverse die is attributed to a shadowy die sinker named (Montgomery ?) Burr who is believed to have worked in the Philadelphia, Pennsylvania area. The reverse die was made by John Marr who worked in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Both dies were used on tokens that were made during the war, but this token was probably made AFTER the war, perhaps in the 1870s. Burr was known to have acquired dies from other die sinkers and used them to make tokens with different die combinations.

Is this token rare? Yep, R-9 means 2 to 4 although I'll bet there more around than that. Is it something that would interest me? Not really unless it was cheap, and that's not going to happen. I like stuff that was made when it was supposed to have been ... usually.

Burr probably made the second token too. The obverse is # 127 and the reverse is #428. Burr MIGHT have made #428, but the Patriotic CWT book expresses some doubts. The piece is made of either white metal or copper-nickel and it's either an R-8 or an R-9.

I am not a fan of #428 because all of the other dies with which it was used created very rare tokens. When every token from a die is rare, I start to think "19th century collector market only."

You have a couple rare tokens that will probably bring some big money (hundreds or thousands), but they not are really CWT's in my opinion, but they are listed as such. There are collectors out there who will pay big money for them simply because they are listed as rare. I'm not one of those guys.

BillJones

Duplicate post due to "hang fire."

BillJones

Duplicate post due to "hang fire."

shadargroup

For some odd reason, the color of the 127/428(a?) is off tone in the image. It is the almost the same actual color as the 125 / 160b. Thank you very much for all of the replies!

lakeguy

Can I ask how you obtained these pictures?