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DENIED! - Time to buy those Garoppolo RCs
ndleo
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I guess Brady destroyed his 4 month old cell phone before the NFL could get a hold of it. Goodell used that as a reason to uphold the 4 game suspension.
I have a feeling Jimmy Garoppolo is about to become the hottest QB RC fo 2015.
I have a feeling Jimmy Garoppolo is about to become the hottest QB RC fo 2015.
Mike
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Dodgers collection scans | Brett Butler registry | 1978 Dodgers - straight 9s, homie
<< <i>I'm sure a lawsuit was filed immediately in Federal Court. Brady has promised he will not go quietly. >>
This. And I can see a judge saying Brady is allowed to play while the suit is ongoing.
i imagine in the world of tom brady and giselle that there are a ton of fun things transpiring that other folks shouldn't necessarily be privy to.
1994 Pro Line Live
TheDallasCowboyBackfieldProject
Wells Report? That report never mentioned the destroying of a cell phone.
Now The Commish can "uphold" a suspension by basing his decision on
this?
Believe me, if the NFL was aware Brady destroyed a cell phone when the
original suspension was issued, the NFL certainly would have let us know
about it. I just don't get it?!?
wpkoughan@yahoo.com
Collecting 1970-1979 PSA 9 & 10 Baseball Cards
Right Brady....
Matt (Raider fan for life!)
<< <i>Brady, after hearing of the ruling, noted, "I did not destroy my cell phone. I thought about throwing it but stopped mid-huck in order to tuck it back inside my designer jeans. In the process of doing that, I dropped it and it broke. Therefore, I never destroyed the phone."
Right Brady....
Matt (Raider fan for life!) >>
Best reply yet.
This denial by Goodell was just a way to still have some leverage to negotiate. Neither party gains anything out of court in this case. Goodell would most likely have the 4 game reduced by court and Brady wants to settle to save crediablity. So I think this will be done in a few days if not a week.
A huge fine and no time.
1992 Collectors Edge Football case?
Either way its 4 games and Brady is as good as guilty now, but I still stand by my previous statements that EVERYBODY cheats and the football psi DID NOT MATTER.
I will not feverishly defend the Patriots or Brady going forward, they got got caught for something that really wasnt neccesary for them to win and they will pay a heavy penalty but the Pats will still win the AFC East and hopefully get to their 7th Super Bowl.
help...i think my wife caught me cheating and need a plan..
Don't know who gave her a heads up but now she's questioning me if i cheated on her.....i kinda looked away and said.
1. I hope not...I don't think so.
she's demanding to see my texts...or just see a few specific texts and i can delete the other conversation.
2. Damn. I just happened to destroy and crush my phone....you know I go thru these iPhones at least one a month i just randomly break them..like everyone else
she met my buddy at a team party who we call the "phone destroyer"...
3. he just happens to work for at&t and more specifically works in the phones destroying department..coincidence
in fact he's such a nice guy I'm going to all of the sudden invite him on our yacht and party with us high class people (since seven yrs of not knowing his name has been long enough)
She asked one last time..
4. I said that "hey we had a great year together last year and lets just focus on our goals next year"....then i had to get back on my helicopter and get out of there.....
I think i fooled everyone.
She just sighed and recommends we just spend a few weekends apart. Then we'll be done with it. Im think Im gonna fight it and drag it out
- I think the impact/importance of under-inflated footballs is being way overstated. I think there's a difference (whether intentional or unintentional) of breaking rules and cheating. The refs still handled the balls every play and didn't notice anything wrong. To me...this is like a WR getting away with a push off for a TD. It's against the rules but it wasn't called. This isn't what won the Pats the SB or any game leading to it.
- I don't understand why the NFL has any right to Brady's cell phone. If your employer asked for your cell phone so they could review personal texts, what would you do? There are many non-football reasons he could have not wanted to provide his cell phone. And who knows if/how it was actually destroyed. I think I destroy a cell phone every couple years on accident.
- In the grand scheme, these 4 games are so minimal to the overall season. If Brady was suspended for the 2015 playoffs, now that would be a real punishment.
- My overall reaction to the allegations: mehh...no big deal.
- My overall reaction to the punishment: mehh..no big deal.
Arthur
<< <i>just have to remember that just because he destroyed his phone, doesn't necessarily mean it had anything to do w/ what the investigators were looking for.
i imagine in the world of tom brady and giselle that there are a ton of fun things transpiring that other folks shouldn't necessarily be privy to. >>
The problem with that is the NFL claims Brady still had the phone he terminated in late 2014. If privacy was his main factor, that older phone would have been destroyed too. It also doesn't help that the day he destroyed it is the same day investigators interviewed him.
Full disclosure for my post:
1) I don't like Goodell and think even less about how he doles out penalties.
2) I dislike the Patriots even more
3) I'm a Steeler fan who suffered through watching the Pats counter every Play the Steelers made in playoff games during the Spygate era.
4) I'm not an unbiased person on this subject.
Current obsession, all things Topps 1969 - 1972
<< <i>His phone should be irrelevant, I've never seen a phone only store one side of a text/sms conversation. Anything on Brady's phone would have been on whoever he was conversing with... and what proof is there that the phone wasn't "destroyed" by jumping in a pool, washing it in the washer, etc. The phone was the only issue of him not cooperating, it won't hold up in court... although I'm curious how he revealed it was destroyed in the appeal hearing. >>
Destroying the phone wasn't the only issue of him not cooperating, it was him not cooperating at all that's the issue. The phone was "little black book".
<< <i>I heard that after the ruling, Goodell walked out to his car and all the tires were deflated. Not sure how that happened? >>
Matt, seems like no one else liked this but I found it very funny! LOL
BTW, Patriots suck!
Thank you and God bless.
"Destroy" a phone - word used by anti-Patriots and anti-Brady people
"Replace" a phone - word used by Patriots and Brady supporters
If Brady destroyed his phone, it's huge news and a huge revelation.
If Brady replaced his phone, nobody cares and it never gets talked about.
So which word do you think the media will be using?
wpkoughan@yahoo.com
Collecting 1970-1979 PSA 9 & 10 Baseball Cards
I am very disappointed by the NFL’s decision to uphold the 4 game suspension against me. I did nothing wrong, and no one in the Patriots organization did either.
Despite submitting to hours of testimony over the past 6 months, it is disappointing that the Commissioner upheld my suspension based upon a standard that it was “probable” that I was “generally aware” of misconduct. The fact is that neither I, nor any equipment person, did anything of which we have been accused. He dismissed my hours of testimony and it is disappointing that he found it unreliable.
I also disagree with yesterdays narrative surrounding my cellphone. I replaced my broken Samsung phone with a new iPhone 6 AFTER my attorneys made it clear to the NFL that my actual phone device would not be subjected to investigation under ANY circumstances. As a member of a union, I was under no obligation to set a new precedent going forward, nor was I made aware at any time during Mr. Wells investigation, that failing to subject my cell phone to investigation would result in ANY discipline.
Most importantly, I have never written, texted, emailed to anybody at anytime, anything related to football air pressure before this issue was raised at the AFC Championship game in January. To suggest that I destroyed a phone to avoid giving the NFL information it requested is completely wrong.
To try and reconcile the record and fully cooperate with the investigation after I was disciplined in May, we turned over detailed pages of cell phone records and all of the emails that Mr. Wells requested. We even contacted the phone company to see if there was any possible way we could retrieve any/all of the actual text messages from my old phone. In short, we exhausted every possibility to give the NFL everything we could and offered to go thru the identity for every text and phone call during the relevant time. Regardless, the NFL knows that Mr. Wells already had ALL relevant communications with Patriots personnel that either Mr. Wells saw or that I was questioned about in my appeal hearing. There is no “smoking gun” and this controversy is manufactured to distract from the fact they have zero evidence of wrongdoing.
I authorized the NFLPA to make a settlement offer to the NFL so that we could avoid going to court and put this inconsequential issue behind us as we move forward into this season. The discipline was upheld without any counter offer. I respect the Commissioners authority, but he also has to respect the CBA and my rights as a private citizen. I will not allow my unfair discipline to become a precedent for other NFL players without a fight.
Lastly, I am overwhelmed and humbled by the support of family, friends and our fans who have supported me since the false accusations were made after the AFC Championship game. I look forward to the opportunity to resume playing with my teammates and winning more games for the New England Patriots.
<< <i>brady just needs to let it go...hes making public opinion worse....even if he gets zero games....ex..the destroyed phone will now never go away whether true or not >>
I do not agree with this at all. He will never win public opinion regardless of what happens and that's not what he's fighting for.
People are keying in on this cell phone and what's not being understood is that regardless of what he did with his cell phone, he NEVER would have to turn it over.
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However that was a criminal investigation. I'm assuming deflating footballs is not a crime outside of the NFL. I don't think the NFL had any other way to get the text messages. I am surprised the Brady only has one phone, I would think have a burner is standard operating procedure for those guys. Hell I have two cellphones.
All right, been thinking about this and bouncing it off labor people. Why would Bradly destroy a phone he is not even required to hand over. Here is a theory which makes sense.
The first reaction people will have is "Brady's getting his legal advice from Aaron Hernandez...destroying your phone on the day you are talking to Ted Wells is insane! But is Brady really Hernandez stupid? He does not even have to turn it over.
Brady and his team are smart people... so the real question is why would they snub noses in such a fashion?
To get a response. What response? To get the decision centered on non-cooperation on the phone issue. Destroying something you don't even have to turn over is done for a reason knowing it is a slap in the face.
Why? Because demanding a private individual's phone is an unfair labor practice.
The Vincent decision didn't hit non-cooperation hard enough.
The NFL probably didn't even know Brady destroyed the phone until the appeal hearing. Brady could have just said "I'm not giving it to you". Instead he testifies "I destroyed it the day I went to Wells, so you aren't getting it."
Goodell loses his mind. Bases punishment on unfair labor practice. Rope-a-doped into it.
Collective bargaining agreement: court can't touch rules based interpretations. It does have jurisdiction to address unfair labor practices and violations of collective bargaining agreement. The new document today is all about the phone.
Brady's team just suckered the NFL into moving their punishment basis and report to an area which is 99.9% favorable to Brady by destroying a phone that Brady would never have been forced to turn over.
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Great info!!!!! Very good points and thanks for sharing.
wpkoughan@yahoo.com
Collecting 1970-1979 PSA 9 & 10 Baseball Cards
Most people outside of New England hate Brady and the Patriots and Goodell knows that. He's just feeding that fandom and hoping to gain leverage through public opinion. I think what he forgets is that those same people have hated him since long before this circus and they're going to continue to hate him whether this happened or not.
And something tells me Kraft is going to get the last laugh between he and Goodell.
Arthur
The structure of the request had Brady backed into a corner. I'm sure Brady felt like he would not be able to answer the simple question: if you have no responsive texts on your phone, why will you not cooperate with our request to have your legal counsel turn over responsive text messages or confirm to us that no text messages were responsive. I cannot see his lawyers signing off on the destroy the phone idea, so I have believe he made the decision himself. The timing could not have been worse.
For those that note the two Patriots employees having texts on their phones, so why the duplication, there are obvious answers: (1) we do not know what texts may have been deleted on those phones, and (2) we do not know who else Brady may have texted with regarding the matter.
Destroying the current phone in June, while the prior phone was still operable during the investigation, only compounds the appearance of guilt.
Finally, people like Robert Kraft claiming innocence because of no "hard evidence" is laughable. We could state the same thing about Aaron Hernandez. You know, the guy most Patriots fans were claiming would walk because of no "hard evidence." That case had a much (much) higher proof threshold. Side note: if Kraft believes nothing wrong was done, why were the two employees suspended or fired? He should bring them back!
I see no way a court will reverse the decision based on the evidence presented. Brady's best hope will be a violation of the CBA/whatever else governed this process. I believe an injunction is unlikely.
It is my understanding the NFL asked the Patriots to suspend the 2 employees
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<< <i>For those that note the two Patriots employees having texts on their phones, so why the duplication, there are obvious answers: (1) we do not know what texts may have been deleted on those phones, and (2) we do not know who else Brady may have texted with regarding the matter. >>
In the words of Brady himself, who has more knowledge of the details than any of us: "To try and reconcile the record and fully cooperate with the investigation after I was disciplined in May, we turned over detailed pages of cell phone records and all of the emails that Mr. Wells requested. We even contacted the phone company to see if there was any possible way we could retrieve any/all of the actual text messages from my old phone. In short, we exhausted every possibility to give the NFL everything we could and offered to go thru the identity for every text and phone call during the relevant time. Regardless, the NFL knows that Mr. Wells already had ALL relevant communications with Patriots personnel that either Mr. Wells saw or that I was questioned about in my appeal hearing."
<< <i>Finally, people like Robert Kraft claiming innocence because of no "hard evidence" is laughable. We could state the same thing about Aaron Hernandez. You know, the guy most Patriots fans were claiming would walk because of no "hard evidence." That case had a much (much) higher proof threshold. >>
Not even close. Hernandez admitted he was at the scene of the murder, but he didn't pull the trigger... which was the dumbest move possible. Most states will convict you of murder if you were at the scene and didn't stop it from happening after facilitating the victim to come to your town and then help the murderers get of of town. In deflategate, they're is absolutely no hard evidence and very poor circumstantial evidence that anyone had deflated the balls intentionally... and if so, that Brady was part of it. On top of that, there's actually scientific evidence that explains it could have happened with no one intentionally deflating the balls. Not so much with Hernandez.
<< <i>I see no way a court will reverse the decision based on the evidence presented. Brady's best hope will be a violation of the CBA/whatever else governed this process. I believe an injunction is unlikely. >>
The only thing Brady and his team can argue is about the process being legal, fair and just. The fact that they've now ultimately suspended him for not providing access to content on his phone, he has a very good chance of winning IMO.
The only thing Brady and his team can argue is about the process being legal, fair and just. The fact that they've now ultimately suspended him for not providing access to content on his phone, he has a very good chance of winning IMO. >>
+1
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Everything else is all evidence of the above claim. You do not need "smoking gun proof" and a preponderance of circumstantial but strong evidence is enough to reach a guilty verdict in a criminal case, much less a civil matter, much less a matter of league punishments which are left to the discretion of the Commissioner.
<< <i> >>
The only thing Brady and his team can argue is about the process being legal, fair and just. The fact that they've now ultimately suspended him for not providing access to content on his phone, he has a very good chance of winning IMO. >>
+1 >>
May also be the only way Goodell can save face. He knows this will get thrown out of court and sealed the deal with the cell phone claims. Now it won't be on him (officially) when Brady gets zero games.
I was thinking this until Kraft freaked out this morning. I think if the above was true, Kraft probably would have stayed quiet. Or it could all be part of the bigger plan. Could also just be the way Kraft atones for his accepting the punishment earlier.
<< <i>Brady is suspended for orchestrating a scheme to manipulate game balls to give him a competitive advantage over his opponents in the AFC Championship Game.
Everything else is all evidence of the above claim. You do not need "smoking gun proof" and a preponderance of circumstantial but strong evidence is enough to reach a guilty verdict in a criminal case, much less a civil matter, much less a matter of league punishments which are left to the discretion of the Commissioner. >>
Scott Peterson comes to mind.
Long read but this sounds like a slam dunk for Brady
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<< <i>All your Deflategate legal questions answered right here >>
Despite all the blahblablee words in the Wells Report and the NFL rulings, two things are clear:
1. No Direct Evidence of Cheating. There is no direct evidence that Tom Brady preferred footballs deflated below the 12.5 PSI permissible levels. None.
2. Wells Report agrees with this. Even the Wells Report does not definitively say Tom Brady cheated. It concludes: “it is more probable than not that Tom Brady (the quarterback for the Patriots) was at least generally aware of the inappropriate activities of McNally and Jastremski involving the release of air from Patriots game balls.”
Okay so viewing all that, could Big Ben have sued the NFL to get reinstated when he was suspended 3-4 years ago? There never was any evidence proving he sexually assaulted the person making the complaint against him. Like with Brady, he was guilty in the eyes of fans based on previous similar complaints. Same with Brady. Had he and the Patriots not had a history of circumventing the rules of fair play, he too would probably have been given the benefit of the doubt here.
If legal precedent plays into this, the Roethlisberger case can be cited to support the league's position.
I also found this very interesting...
"Paragraph 111 of the 54-page lawsuit filed Wednesday by the NFLPA elaborates on a point briefly addressed in the ruling from Commissioner Roger Goodell upholding the Brady discipline. In 2009, the NFL suspended a member of the Jets’ equipment for attempting “to use unapproved equipment to prep the K[icking] Balls” before a game against the Patriots.
As the NFLPA points out, the NFL did not investigate or discipline the Jets kicker for “general awareness” or specific involvement, even though the Jets kicker (like Brady in this case) was the player most likely to benefit from the behavior and, in turn, the player most likely to be aware of the conduct.
The NFLPA explains in its lawsuit that the decision not to investigate or discipline the Jets kicker “was perfectly consistent with the Competitive Integrity Policy’s application to Clubs, not players.”
So why suspend Brady under a policy that applies to teams and not players? At paragraph 108 of the lawsuit, the NFLPA claims that “a fine would not have quenched other NFL owners’ thirst for a more draconian penalty.”
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<< <i>I don't know the background to the Big Bens suspension other than he was suspended for rape. >>
Correction, accusation of rape. Authorities never charged him because there wasn't enough evidence and the person issuing the complaint couldn't recall the events. Not saying he didn't do it but he was suspended just for suspicion of sexual assault.
<< <i>
<< <i>I don't know the background to the Big Bens suspension other than he was suspended for rape. >>
>>
accusation of rape >>
Correct
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Roethlisberger allegedly rapes a 20-year old college student = 4 games
Goodell is a joke.