1842 dollar on ebay...is it a proof?

lasvegasteddy

some coins are so darn tough to tell proof from ms
so this 1842
is this really just a ms?
simply amazing if this is a mere ms that it didn't get "pl" or "dmpl"
1842 on ebay


images here

CuKevin

PCGS only gives the PL and DMPL designation to Morgan Dollars.

JCLIGHTBRIGADE

<< <i>PCGS only gives the PL and DMPL designation to Morgan Dollars. >>



That is incorrect. 2014 Kennedy, 2009 UHR, ATB's, etc.

tradedollarnut

No mirror surface in the shield stripes

roadrunner

The peripherals are not crisp (stars, denticles). In fact on the right side of the obv those denticles slope inwards. Eagle's feathers not sharp enough either. Could just be a juiced photo to give it a semi-PL or PL look. If it were PQ as the seller says it would be stickered.

LanceNewmanOCC

.
scans do unfortunate things to images, even high quality scanners.

contrast variations exist amongst scanners as well, through no doing of the ebay sellers.
.

telephoto1

IMO it's a semi PL business strike coin angled in a way to make it look better than it is.

brg5658

It looks like a scan to me, not a photograph. Scans notoriously make coins look more "cameo contrasty" than they really are.

Wolf359

<< <i>No mirror surface in the shield stripes >>



Yes, planchet not polished so not prepared as a proof.

Coin Finder

It does not look proof to me.. The eagle on the reverse is to frosty especially inside the fields

LindeDad

TDN hit the dialogistic on the head again.

Neca63

I really appreciate coins like that one.
The aforementioned telltale diagnostic of frosting about the shield does, upon casual inspection, seem to indicate that the die was used to strike business strike coins.
And, if my eyes are not deceiving me, the denticles on the business strike appear to me to be smaller than those used on the proofs, with a different count.
However, you gotta admit, the die used to make that coin into a deep cameo contrasted coin begs the question of how it came about.
Someone appears to have spent some extra time creating that die, and the planchet as well.
Perhaps, it is one of the first dies used for that years business strike production, which begs the question, it a specimen proof, or some type of special strike proof coin? Does the coin show signs of micro doubling and squared off rims indicating a proof?
Even as a single struck coin, it screams out specimen, or special, strike.

ricko

A very nice coin, but not a proof..... Cheers, RickO

Neca63

<< <i>A very nice coin, but not a proof..... Cheers, RickO >>



Funny word proof.

lasvegasteddy

thanks for all the input as it's not my series...
<<< too poor for such

but i ran across this and was really taken back at it's appearance....rightfully so even if proof is out tha window
what an amazing series if mere MS examples can behold such beauty

LoveMyLiberty

Pretty sure this isn't a proof as the images are quite
small, but in addition to the comments previously made
here are some things to consider.

All 1842 proof dollars (15 or less) were struck from a
single pair of dies. The obv was used for circulation strikes
also, along with two other die pairs. The rev was used to
strike 1840 proofs and other dates during the decade.

OBV indicators:
The point of LIBERTY's shield points to the very left side of
the serif of the 1 in the date.

There are die file marks from the N/E to the S/W through the
top of the shield to the LIBERTY ribbon.

Verticle die file marks appear in the drapery above the upper leg
to the left of the pole.

REV indicators:
There are small projections on each side of the right upright of A-3.

The final element of stripe 1 in the rev shield extends to crossbar 3
and other stripes extend into the crossbar to some degree.


Examples of proof coins for this year can be found here:

PR 63

PR-65

PR-62

savoyspecial

stealer

,

Neca63

<< <i>Pretty sure this isn't a proof as the images are quite
small, but in addition to the comments previously made
here are some things to consider.

All 1842 proof dollars (15 or less) were struck from a
single pair of dies. The obv was used for circulation strikes
also, along with two other die pairs. The rev was used to
strike 1840 proofs and other dates during the decade.

OBV indicators:
The point of LIBERTY's shield points to the very left side of
the serif of the 1 in the date.

There are die file marks from the N/E to the S/W through the
top of the shield to the LIBERTY ribbon.

Verticle die file marks appear in the drapery above the upper leg
to the left of the pole.

REV indicators:
There are small projections on each side of the right upright of A-3.

The final element of stripe 1 in the rev shield extends to crossbar 3
and other stripes extend into the crossbar to some degree.


Examples of proof coins for this year can be found here:

PR 63

PR-65

PR-62 >>



Very nice. Thanx.
But, I am a bit confused. If the proof obv was also used to strike the dollars, EDS prooflike business strikes struck from the proof obv die may have a lack of frosting within the horizontal bars of the shield?
Are you saying that in addition to the proof die, 2 other business strike obv dies were used? If so, it still begs the question of how all that cameo got struck up on an early die state non proof die PL business strike. And, if there are proof examples of the 1842 dollar that are non cameo coins, why on earth would a business strike cameo display better cameo contrast when the proof die was used to strike only 15 coins?
Maybe them boys were just that good.

Neca63

There are not many coins that are rare by virtue of manufacture.
What a beauty.