I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but are we seriously getting bent out of shape over a S&H difference of $10 on a $1500 coin? That's like 2 lattes...
I'm not justifying the charges that Heritage is collecting (and, I don't like them), but saying "BEWARE" and claiming it is a big travesty seems a bit overboard.
I have never personally been real impressed with the way coins are packaged and shipped by Heritage. A flimsy priority mailer, a little cardboard padding, and almost never requiring signature. Oddly, of my last 2 purchases with Heritage (all within the last month), the $160 coin required a signature and a special trip to the post office, whereas the $500 coin was just left in my box. I don't purchase things in the $1500 range often, so I can't speak to that.
-Brandon -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins] -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
At one point in life I ran a software package for a fulfillment center. I had a 5 layer spreadsheet that calculated shipping and handling costs. Firms charge what the market will bear, right or wrong. These are cost centers and typically make a profit. HOWEVER, you have to consider the cost to package, ship, record, etc. the item acquired. There is also overhead to consider.
In my mind, I look at the total cost to me, knowing what they charge and bid accordingly. It is a simple thing to build a spreadsheet that calculates the TOTAL cost to get a coin home with all fees and then bid according to the final total it will cost. I have done that for years and it really simplifies matters in terms of what the bid turns out to being as a final number I pay when I win an auction.
If the total amount is unreasonable, don't bid that high.
People vote with their feet and if the charges become excessive, both bidders and sellers will find another venue. Tilting agains windmills is never productive IMHO. Just make an informed decision as to the total amount you are willing to pay, based upon a specific bid.
Retired United States Mint guy, now working on an Everyman Type Set.
My reaction when they went to 17.5% BP was to not use them. Unless you buy whale coins, there are other venues you can use to get what you want (i.e. GC, Legend, eBay, BST, coin shows).
I look at shipping charges this way. If I traveled to the auction it would cost me hundreds of dollars, and an uncomfortable airplane ride. With these shipping charges, I don't have to do that. I have had good service from Heritage when I have asked them about the quality of the lots, and the estimated hammer prices.
Bottom line: The shipping charges are a lot cheaper than flying out to attend the auction. That makes them a "throw away" for me. Call me nuts, but that's how I view them. I have also gotten fast service from Heritage, which is more than I can say for some other auctions that I have won (not all coins).
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
Actually I think comparing this to sitting at home in your jammies putting a couple for $35 coins in a box is a very bad comparison. Heritage ships thousands of items per week for their various auctions and sales, they have a team of people whose sole purpose is to get the right items to the right buyers at the right time. But they also aren't Amazon where you have a warehouse full of $8/hour "contractors" shipping out tens or hundreds thousands of items per day.
The actual shipping and insurance expense is just one part of their overall shipping expense. Maybe they make a dollar or two per shipment, maybe they don't, but it really makes no difference at all to be honest. You might as well complain about their minimum buyers fee of $14, that's more than some of the coins they are selling are worth.
This is a real first world problem we are spending so much time on isn't it? Sort of like one of my auto racing buddies that was complaining about how much race gas cost these days.
<< <i>And for those comparing shipping costs to their own experiences shipping occasional items, that is not particularly relevant to the OPs point. His point is that a company on that large of a scale has much lower costs and is profiting from the shipping. >>
Unless they are mailing their coins bulk rate, non-profit they pay the same as the rest of us for USPS postage. Unlike you and I they can't efficiently say "actual shipping charges" without having to adjust each sale's shipping charge. With a standard reasonable fee they will make money on some shipping and lose money on others.
Anyone having a problem with a shipping charge (or buyer's juice) that is disclosed before the purchase should not make the purchase.
Are they really this stupid, or are they destroying the dollar on purpose?
I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but are we seriously getting bent out of shape over a S&H difference of $10 on a $1500 coin? That's like 2 lattes...
I'm not justifying the charges that Heritage is collecting (and, I don't like them), but saying "BEWARE" and claiming it is a big travesty seems a bit overboard.
<< <i>My last invoice for a single $455 coin was $12.55 shipping, prior to that 6 coins at $6300 shipping was $32.50. Both were shipped priority insured, and both in the past month. >>
Just to put the real world into perspective, Shipping of 6 Coins valued at $6300 from the PCGS Grading Service would have been $37.95 so, you got a deal! >>
Not according to TomB using certified mail and private insurance. >>
Uhhh, look at the back of a PCGS Submission form.
5 - 25 coins valued at $5,001 - $15,000 will set the submitter back $37.95. >>
I realize what it says back there. Just because that is what it says, does that really make it a deal or anywhere close to reality when using private insurance? I would find the reverse to be true. $32 / $38 ....not a deal at all. >>
That's not the point. The point is that even PCGS charges more to ship 6 coins valued at > $5,001 .
He got a good deal on the shipping at only $32.50
Send the exact 6 coins in for grading and it'll cost slabbing fee's and $37.95 for return shipping.
Private insurance comes in many forms. Some dealers simply have a replacement available for a like or similar coin. Others purchase a specific policy that has specific rates.
Heritage has set and published rates which anybody has access to. If folks don't like their rates, then they are free to not bid. Personally, I don't think the rates are out of line with reality. Especially when dealing with collectible coins which may or may not have a real, absolute value.
I decided to change calling the bathroom the John and renamed it the Jim. I feel so much better saying I went to the Jim this morning.
I actually noticed a charge of over $40 shipping on 3 coins and felt it was a little higher than it should be but my opinion of Heritage is at an all time low.
I feel they have become far too greedy for my tastes and have already lost a lot of my business. Little things like this annoy people and that is bad business.
I seldom check PM's but do check emails often jason@seated.org
Buying top quality Seated Dimes in Gem BU and Proof.
I actually noticed a charge of over $40 shipping on 3 coins and felt it was a little higher than it should be but my opinion of Heritage is at an all time low.
I feel they have become far too greedy for my tastes and have already lost a lot of my business. Little things like this annoy people and that is bad business. >>
True that.
Most of us are small fish in a big pond, so Heritage Auctions could care less.
Heritage is a business, with business expenses. Numismatics is a purely optional hobby. Collectors always have the option of seeking other venues, or, picking another hobby. As a business owner, I know what my products are worth and what I will charge. I imagine that Heritage is the same.
I don't like it necessarily, but I do like the options Heritage provides to me as a collector / consigner. First it was Ebay, now Ebay sucks for me. Now it is Heritage. Without them, I would get out of the hobby.
Tyler, have you ever worked with Ian at Great Collections? Their service is Top Notch and their fees are super low, for everything! They also have tons of bidders.
"If it's not fun, it's not worth it." - KeyMan64 Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners.
<< <i>Tyler, have you ever worked with Ian at Great Collections? Their service is Top Notch and their fees are super low, for everything! They also have tons of bidders. >>
They also have nowhere even remotely close to the selection of Heritage...
To each his own I guess. I collect a lot of world (non-USA) coins, and there is no auction house in the USA that handles more nice material than Heritage. That's worth $10 in shipping to me...
-Brandon -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~- My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins] -~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
<< <i>Tyler, have you ever worked with Ian at Great Collections? Their service is Top Notch and their fees are super low, for everything! They also have tons of bidders. >>
They also have nowhere even remotely close to the selection of Heritage...
To each his own I guess. I collect a lot of world (non-USA) coins, and there is no auction house in the USA that handles more nice material than Heritage. That's worth $10 in shipping to me... >>
Well I would certainly understand and agree with this. There are certainly exceptions to many things but within the context of a US Coin forum...
Just havin' fun. Customer Service, Accessibility, Fees, Buying, Selling, Bidders...and for US Coins, I would recommend at least looking into Great Collections.
"If it's not fun, it's not worth it." - KeyMan64 Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners.
<< <i>Soooo...how much does private insurance cost? >>
I can insure Priority Mail for 28¢ per $100.
In the OP scenario, I could ship the coin(s) in a small flat rate box for $5.20 plus the $4.76 for the insured value. So, slightly less than $10 in out-of-pocket plus my fixed expenses.
Customer Service, Accessibility, Fees, Buying, Selling, Bidders...and for US Coins, I would recommend at least looking into Great Collections.
I agree with keyman64 on this point. Try their World coins, too. I have been having excellent experiences with GreatCollections this year (and last). Top notch in all regards.
<< <i>Soooo...how much does private insurance cost? >>
I can insure Priority Mail for 28¢ per $100.
In the OP scenario, I could ship the coin(s) in a small flat rate box for $5.20 plus the $4.76 for the insured value. So, slightly less than $10 in out-of-pocket plus my fixed expenses. >>
I'm glad TDN asked this question. Maybe he could ask Heritage why they can't find it in their business model to use the same insurer as eBaybuyer uses. I'll bet Heritage would gain a lot of customers, new and old, if they cared enough to find ways to economize shipping costs for ALL customers.
<< <i>Soooo...how much does private insurance cost? >>
I can insure Priority Mail for 28¢ per $100.
In the OP scenario, I could ship the coin(s) in a small flat rate box for $5.20 plus the $4.76 for the insured value. So, slightly less than $10 in out-of-pocket plus my fixed expenses. >>
And I bet you can insure bullion by priority too which the USPS does not.
<< <i>So now the question becomes...Why is Heritage doing this to their customers?
Because people will pay it. You did >>
I paid it because they told me over the phone that I did not have a choice in shipping options.... unless of course I wanted to pick it up in several months from another show or whatever.
MY RECOMMENDATION: Buy AND Sell via Great Collections if at all possible or the BST. Or a trusted dealer if that makes you comfortable. Stacks seems to have their issues but people have posted that they can get a great deal with buying from them sometimes and they don't double your shipping costs.
This just seems crazy to me. Unless there is something really rare, a cherrypick I am going after or something like that...I will be avoiding Heritage if I can. >>
Great Collections is excellent venue for coins, both buying and selling .. no B.S., great service and nice coins . Both I and coin club have sold numerous pricey coins on GC .... happy with price received and no sellers juice extracted .. Postage more than fair on coins won at GC
<< <i>Soooo...how much does private insurance cost? >>
I can insure Priority Mail for 28¢ per $100.
In the OP scenario, I could ship the coin(s) in a small flat rate box for $5.20 plus the $4.76 for the insured value. So, slightly less than $10 in out-of-pocket plus my fixed expenses. >>
I'm glad TDN asked this question. Maybe he could ask Heritage why they can't find it in their business model to use the same insurer as eBaybuyer uses. I'll bet Heritage would gain a lot of customers, new and old, if they cared enough to find ways to economize shipping costs for ALL customers. >>
In a general private policy, you would not insure every shipment. If you ship $200 million per year and losses are $250,000 you buy a general policy probably with a deductible and file claims against that. A $100 coin lost would likely be a nuisance claim so you eat piddly stuff like that. Actual insurance using eBaybuyer's insurer would cost $560,000. You could cover a lot of claims out of pocket for that.
Comments
I'm not justifying the charges that Heritage is collecting (and, I don't like them), but saying "BEWARE" and claiming it is a big travesty seems a bit overboard.
I have never personally been real impressed with the way coins are packaged and shipped by Heritage. A flimsy priority mailer, a little cardboard padding, and almost never requiring signature. Oddly, of my last 2 purchases with Heritage (all within the last month), the $160 coin required a signature and a special trip to the post office, whereas the $500 coin was just left in my box. I don't purchase things in the $1500 range often, so I can't speak to that.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
This shipping structure (cited in the OP) has been in place since January of 2013. It is not new.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
In my mind, I look at the total cost to me, knowing what they charge and bid accordingly. It is a simple thing to build a spreadsheet that calculates the TOTAL cost to get a coin home with all fees and then bid according to the final total it will cost. I have done that for years and it really simplifies matters in terms of what the bid turns out to being as a final number I pay when I win an auction.
If the total amount is unreasonable, don't bid that high.
People vote with their feet and if the charges become excessive, both bidders and sellers will find another venue. Tilting agains windmills is never productive IMHO. Just make an informed decision as to the total amount you are willing to pay, based upon a specific bid.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars
Also it was nice for a change to get invoiced in 2 hours compared to S/B & Goldberg.
Bottom line: The shipping charges are a lot cheaper than flying out to attend the auction. That makes them a "throw away" for me. Call me nuts
The actual shipping and insurance expense is just one part of their overall shipping expense. Maybe they make a dollar or two per shipment, maybe they don't, but it really makes no difference at all to be honest. You might as well complain about their minimum buyers fee of $14, that's more than some of the coins they are selling are worth.
This is a real first world problem we are spending so much time on isn't it? Sort of like one of my auto racing buddies that was complaining about how much race gas cost these days.
World Collection
British Collection
German States Collection
<< <i>And for those comparing shipping costs to their own experiences shipping occasional items, that is not particularly relevant to the OPs point. His point is that a company on that large of a scale has much lower costs and is profiting from the shipping. >>
Unless they are mailing their coins bulk rate, non-profit they pay the same as the rest of us for USPS postage. Unlike you and I they can't efficiently say "actual shipping charges" without having to adjust each sale's shipping charge. With a standard reasonable fee they will make money on some shipping and lose money on others.
Anyone having a problem with a shipping charge (or buyer's juice) that is disclosed before the purchase should not make the purchase.
Are they really this stupid, or are they destroying the dollar on purpose?
I'm not justifying the charges that Heritage is collecting (and, I don't like them), but saying "BEWARE" and claiming it is a big travesty seems a bit overboard.
That's pretty much where I am on this.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>My last invoice for a single $455 coin was $12.55 shipping, prior to that 6 coins at $6300 shipping was $32.50. Both were shipped priority insured, and both in the past month. >>
Just to put the real world into perspective, Shipping of 6 Coins valued at $6300 from the PCGS Grading Service would have been $37.95 so, you got a deal! >>
Not according to TomB using certified mail and private insurance. >>
Uhhh, look at the back of a PCGS Submission form.
5 - 25 coins valued at $5,001 - $15,000 will set the submitter back $37.95. >>
I realize what it says back there. Just because that is what it says, does that really make it a deal or anywhere close to reality when using private insurance? I would find the reverse to be true. $32 / $38 ....not a deal at all. >>
That's not the point. The point is that even PCGS charges more to ship 6 coins valued at > $5,001 .
He got a good deal on the shipping at only $32.50
Send the exact 6 coins in for grading and it'll cost slabbing fee's and $37.95 for return shipping.
Private insurance comes in many forms. Some dealers simply have a replacement available for a like or similar coin. Others purchase a specific policy that has specific rates.
Heritage has set and published rates which anybody has access to. If folks don't like their rates, then they are free to not bid. Personally, I don't think the rates are out of line with reality. Especially when dealing with collectible coins which may or may not have a real, absolute value.
The name is LEE!
I actually noticed a charge of over $40 shipping on 3 coins and felt it was a little higher than it should be but my opinion of Heritage is at an all time low.
I feel they have become far too greedy for my tastes and have already lost a lot of my business. Little things like this annoy people and that is bad business.
Buying top quality Seated Dimes in Gem BU and Proof.
Buying great coins - monster eye appeal only.
<< <i>Funny post.
I actually noticed a charge of over $40 shipping on 3 coins and felt it was a little higher than it should be but my opinion of Heritage is at an all time low.
I feel they have become far too greedy for my tastes and have already lost a lot of my business. Little things like this annoy people and that is bad business. >>
True that.
Most of us are small fish in a big pond, so Heritage Auctions could care less.
I don't like it necessarily, but I do like the options Heritage provides to me as a collector / consigner. First it was Ebay, now Ebay sucks for me. Now it is Heritage. Without them, I would get out of the hobby.
Tyler
Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners.
<< <i>Tyler, have you ever worked with Ian at Great Collections? Their service is Top Notch and their fees are super low, for everything! They also have tons of bidders. >>
They also have nowhere even remotely close to the selection of Heritage...
To each his own I guess. I collect a lot of world (non-USA) coins, and there is no auction house in the USA that handles more nice material than Heritage. That's worth $10 in shipping to me...
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
<< <i>
<< <i>Tyler, have you ever worked with Ian at Great Collections? Their service is Top Notch and their fees are super low, for everything! They also have tons of bidders. >>
They also have nowhere even remotely close to the selection of Heritage...
To each his own I guess. I collect a lot of world (non-USA) coins, and there is no auction house in the USA that handles more nice material than Heritage. That's worth $10 in shipping to me... >>
Well I would certainly understand and agree with this. There are certainly exceptions to many things but within the context of a US Coin forum...
Just havin' fun. Customer Service, Accessibility, Fees, Buying, Selling, Bidders...and for US Coins, I would recommend at least looking into Great Collections.
Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners.
<< <i>Soooo...how much does private insurance cost? >>
I can insure Priority Mail for 28¢ per $100.
In the OP scenario, I could ship the coin(s) in a small flat rate box for $5.20 plus the $4.76 for the insured value. So, slightly less than $10 in out-of-pocket plus my fixed expenses.
Customer Service, Accessibility, Fees, Buying, Selling, Bidders...and for US Coins, I would recommend at least looking into Great Collections.
I agree with keyman64 on this point. Try their World coins, too. I have been having excellent experiences with GreatCollections this year (and last). Top notch in all regards.
<< <i>
<< <i>Soooo...how much does private insurance cost? >>
I can insure Priority Mail for 28¢ per $100.
In the OP scenario, I could ship the coin(s) in a small flat rate box for $5.20 plus the $4.76 for the insured value. So, slightly less than $10 in out-of-pocket plus my fixed expenses. >>
I'm glad TDN asked this question. Maybe he could ask Heritage why they can't find it in their business model to use the same insurer as eBaybuyer uses. I'll bet Heritage would gain a lot of customers, new and old, if they cared enough to find ways to economize shipping costs for ALL customers.
"Everything is on its way to somewhere. Everything." - George Malley, Phenomenon
http://www.americanlegacycoins.com
<< <i>
<< <i>Soooo...how much does private insurance cost? >>
I can insure Priority Mail for 28¢ per $100.
In the OP scenario, I could ship the coin(s) in a small flat rate box for $5.20 plus the $4.76 for the insured value. So, slightly less than $10 in out-of-pocket plus my fixed expenses. >>
And I bet you can insure bullion by priority too which the USPS does not.
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
<< <i>
<< <i>So now the question becomes...Why is Heritage doing this to their customers?
Because people will pay it. You did
I paid it because they told me over the phone that I did not have a choice in shipping options....
unless of course I wanted to pick it up in several months from another show or whatever.
MY RECOMMENDATION: Buy AND Sell via Great Collections if at all possible or the BST. Or a trusted dealer
if that makes you comfortable. Stacks seems to have their issues but people have posted that
they can get a great deal with buying from them sometimes and they don't double your shipping costs.
This just seems crazy to me. Unless there is something really rare, a cherrypick I am going after or something
like that...I will be avoiding Heritage if I can. >>
Great Collections is excellent venue for coins, both buying and selling .. no B.S., great service and nice coins . Both I and coin club have sold numerous pricey coins on GC .... happy with price received and no sellers juice extracted .. Postage more than fair on coins won at GC
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Soooo...how much does private insurance cost? >>
I can insure Priority Mail for 28¢ per $100.
In the OP scenario, I could ship the coin(s) in a small flat rate box for $5.20 plus the $4.76 for the insured value. So, slightly less than $10 in out-of-pocket plus my fixed expenses. >>
I'm glad TDN asked this question. Maybe he could ask Heritage why they can't find it in their business model to use the same insurer as eBaybuyer uses. I'll bet Heritage would gain a lot of customers, new and old, if they cared enough to find ways to economize shipping costs for ALL customers. >>
In a general private policy, you would not insure every shipment. If you ship $200 million per year and losses are $250,000 you buy a general policy probably with a deductible and file claims against that. A $100 coin lost would likely be a nuisance claim so you eat piddly stuff like that. Actual insurance using eBaybuyer's insurer would cost $560,000. You could cover a lot of claims out of pocket for that.
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
MY COINS FOR SALE AT https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/other/bajjerfans-coins-sale/3876
<< <i>BEWARE OF HERITAGE SHIPPING COSTS >>
Reads like the title of an old Scooby Doo episode.
".....and I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren't for you meddling collectors."
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress