Help with a grade on a 64 Kennedy....opinions needed.
Ethan
Posts: 315 ✭✭
Well I recently bought something, I either lost big time or got a nice coin for a decent price. I do not have it in hand yet but I took a chance.
Here is what I think, I think it is DCAM for sure but the grade is where I run into issues. It is slabbed in a 2nd Tier slab. Either the pictures were overly fantastic or it truly is a nice coin. I know the grade on the slab is incorrect and by the history of the company that slabbed it, the guess is it was marked 2 grades high. So in that regard, I think it is PR66/67. From the pictures, I can see a few marked that I thought were hairlines, but in the 2nd picture no so much. I see only the one milk spot on the reverse. I will watch this and then post the actual slab and let's see what the guesses are. When I get it in hand I will update it.
Here is what I think, I think it is DCAM for sure but the grade is where I run into issues. It is slabbed in a 2nd Tier slab. Either the pictures were overly fantastic or it truly is a nice coin. I know the grade on the slab is incorrect and by the history of the company that slabbed it, the guess is it was marked 2 grades high. So in that regard, I think it is PR66/67. From the pictures, I can see a few marked that I thought were hairlines, but in the 2nd picture no so much. I see only the one milk spot on the reverse. I will watch this and then post the actual slab and let's see what the guesses are. When I get it in hand I will update it.
"A gun is like a parachute. If you need one, and don't have one, you'll probably never need one again.
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
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“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
The reverse is the questionable part on the grade a CAM/DCAM part
That spot is going to be very grade limiting.
you are aware you have a regular obverse with an accented hair variety reverse right?
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
the motto on the obverse also has "frost issues"...as with his portrait....frost is weak especially on the baek of his hair and neck
the mirrors are very-very hard to hide in pictures if it's true dcam mirrors...i'm just not seeing dcam fields and frost softness
on the die marriage part....it is neat...i had one too...no one held interest when it became time to sell...that should be considered
shame about that milk spot
btw...guess on grade only is 65 by me...about a 50% chance by my accords it cam's
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
<< <i>cam only i'd think
you are aware you have a regular obverse with an accented hair variety reverse right? >>
Did not notice I had a Accented Hair's Little Brother...cool. Was mainly wanting a 64 DCAM....will have to study this one in hand for sure.
Thanks for all the comments!
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
<< <i>I have not got it yet. I am a bit worried now but still hold hope. I do not own a DCAM 64 and wanted to get one but they are too $$ so I tried this. At this point I will just have to wait till it arrives but it is not looking good with all the remarks. It was a stunner when I saw the pictures and I did notice the spot but it was the only one and I can not see how one spot will ruin a coin, lots from this era had them. >>
you're in a crowd looking for such a coin in the raw...just saying
type 2 obverse with a type 1 reverse
sweet coin by the way
First, I think the coin is a cameo.
Second, I seriously doubt that anything is going to take that milk spot off.
Third, why do I think that? I believe that this coin has been over dipped to try and get that spot off. How do I know? Because of the refraction on the mirrors. It's very diffuse and I've seen that a lot on coins that have been over dipped. It gives the mirrors a sort of star burst appearance.
Check this out if interested..
Accented Hair;s Little Brother
another
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
"Jesus died for you and for me, Thank you,Jesus"!!!
--- If it should happen I die and leave this world and you want to remember me. Please only remember my opening Sig Line.This doesn't show it well, but it is the best I can do with what skills I have with a camera.
These pictures suck I know so I tried to do something else to show what I mean. Using my camera and pics one can compare to a known DCAM. Same shot, same angle....
So on to the grade, well with hair lines on this at high magnification etc, I still think it is pretty darn nice. Close up, you can tell most of the 'marks' are on the slab and not the coin.
Example:
But the hairlines are there...
And sadly so is a single milk spot. I am not sure how one will affect the grade but it is not an eyesore for sure. At least compared to others I have seen.
And another little bonus is it that it is also an 'Accented Hair's Little Brother' (Type 2 Obverse and Type 1 Reverse. That was a nice little bonus.
So I am pleased with what I got. I paid $132 for it and it was a gamble but I think I did ok. I think I have a PR67 DCAM Kennedy. If so I did well, if it goes PR66 then I still did ok. The fact that it is an Accented Hair's Little Brother might also add some respectability for it.
It is the 2nd PCI coin I have and on both of these I think they did a fair job. The other was an MS62 1964 half and I actually thought that was an MS63.
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
it truly is all about the coin...TPG or koolaide brands only matter upon sale
just remember dcam is a protected designation hence value reflection
looked like it should of been that die 2 obv with die 1 rev...your imaging clearly displays it
now if you pay the extra and have that put on the label...you'll get a return value for doing so.... if and when you sell it
update us....as i love it and many thanks
modcrewman there.....i hope you prize his replies....he's one of the more active with success tracks to prove his respect is "an earned thing" in stature
"we're blessed" with him
he's calling 64 cam...i'd bet it grades as such too
The name is LEE!
<< <i>Here's hoping you didn't pay more than $60 for it as that spot definitely hurts. >>
He said he paid $132, so I hope he didn't pay more than $132 for it.
As for those saying not a DCAM, look again at the pictures of the 'known' DCAM and this one, same angle, distance, and lighting. How could one not see that?
$60 I guess I lost, but I do not think that. This has become one of my best 64's. Did I pay too much? Maybe.......Maybe not.
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
<< <i>Well yes I paid $132 for it and $60 is not close. I know what I have and yes it has one milk spot but it does not grab you. I truly think looking at my other slabbed coins, this is a PR67 DCAM unless that spot kills it. Remember the pictures suck.
As for those saying not a DCAM, look again at the pictures of the 'known' DCAM and this one, same angle, distance, and lighting. How could one not see that?
$60 I guess I lost, but I do not think that. This has become one of my best 64's. Did I pay too much? Maybe.......Maybe not. >>
Well, as long as you are pleased with your purchase but I can say with some assurance that there is still much to be learned.
Be sure to post the crossover grade.
The name is LEE!
it will lock in a core additional value and right now variety service is 1/2 off...so that extra $12 would be well spent
In comparing it with others I have, I have a raw one just as good and it is DDO, so that made me happy also. It is not Type 1 Rev though...
If I did it would be with ANACS which most of you do not like.
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
I've been where you are...excited about a purchase and inexperienced with PCGS's grading standards. From your first couple of pictures, I was optimistic for you that you may have a DCAM on your hands. The other pictures show flow lines in the fields that will prevent DCAM at PCGS. PCI was a respectable grading company at some point in the past, I do not believe that either of the PCI coins you've shown would warrant a PCGS DCAM designation. If you are paying based upon PCGS DCAM values you are overpaying.
I've seen PCI coins on Ebay that they've labeled DCAM that honestly don't even show enough contrast to warrant a CAM designation at PCGS...pay their DCAM designation very little attention...their standard (if there is one) is leagues away from PCGS's designation. There's a reason PCGS DCAM's are at the top of the market in value.
With that milk spot, I'd be shocked if the coin would get a grade higher than 65; but I honestly think it'd be worth your time to either submit a coin or two to PCGS to get a feel for their standards or let someone else you trust (and who is familiar with PCGS's standards) take a look at your coins. I'd be glad to do so if you'd like.
so you'd be going anacs...grab some cheap anacs "designation" standards to work with or see if a shop or shows in town to reference off of
if you ever go pcgs for those "designation coins"...do the same unless you're by a shop you can reference off of
<< <i>I've been where you are...excited about a purchase and inexperienced with PCGS's grading standards. From your first couple of pictures, I was optimistic for you that you may have a DCAM on your hands. The other pictures show flow lines in the fields that will prevent DCAM at PCGS. PCI was a respectable grading company at some point in the past, I do not believe that either of the PCI coins you've shown would warrant a PCGS DCAM designation. If you are paying based upon PCGS DCAM values you are overpaying. >>
That might just be the case. PCI was a chance, it is only the 2nd one I own as the first was GIVEN to me. The fact that I bid on it, and the price got so high means that either one, everyone on the bay is an idiot myself included or others saw the same thing I did. (37 Bids on this coin). When I got it in hand, it was very similar to other DCAM's form PCGS and NGC that I own. It was not the best but yet better than other UCAM/DCAM that I have in hand to compare to. I was not paying on PCGS prices, I was paying for what I was looking at and hoping that I would finally own a DCAM 64 Kennedy. I think I do now even if PR65 it is a nice coin. I knew PCI when I was bidding it.
<< <i>I've seen PCI coins on Ebay that they've labeled DCAM that honestly don't even show enough contrast to warrant a CAM designation at PCGS...pay their DCAM designation very little attention...their standard (if there is one) is leagues away from PCGS's designation. There's a reason PCGS DCAM's are at the top of the market in value. >>
Agreed but the pictures are what grabbed me. I have a heck of a time showing Cameo in pictures so this one grabbed me. One thing, at MINIMUM its cameo but high end CAMEO. I think it is DCAM as I compare it to my 68-70 DCAMs and it is in that bunch.
<< <i>With that milk spot, I'd be shocked if the coin would get a grade higher than 65; but I honestly think it'd be worth your time to either submit a coin or two to PCGS to get a feel for their standards or let someone else you trust (and who is familiar with PCGS's standards) take a look at your coins. I'd be glad to do so if you'd like. >>
I have yet to submit a coin for grade, one NGC and PCGS are for dealers as they get a discount by volume, I am a little guy and can see no reason to pay $30 to have that grade when the coin itself is not worth north of $100. I have a Accented Hair that I think DCAMs that would be worth it if it grades, bit for now I am just glad to have it, especially since I found it in the wild.
There are no cameo experts around here and the coin dealers just do not care. I would have to send these to someone such as yourself to make sure. Or I could send to ANACS for $10 and have a decent case and a respectable grade. Then again as a hobby this takes some of the fun out of it.
Thanks for your insightful reply, I do appreciate it.
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
<< <i>I would call that a Two point spot. >>
Yeah, either a pr65 or 66 is my guess, but 67 is possible.
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”
I too enjoy these coins, but I get more fun hunting for the raw, in the wild at shops and shows. I stumbled across one at a loc as l show last Friday in a flat pack proof set. Total cost of th r set was about $25.00. One day I will sell it and possibly slab it first. Until then, into the stash it goes.
“I want you to remember that no * ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb * die for his country”