How do I handle a case of fraud from an eBay purchase 14 years ago?

gregmo32

I bought a very expensive autographed item in 2000, on ebay, from a member who is still on eBay, but does not sell anything anymore. I know his ebay name, but not his actual name. ebay says they cannot share that information with me.

I have considered contacting him through ebay, but am trying to figure out what the best way to do it is.
I am certain he knew the item was not legitimate, based on the story he told me about how he acquired it.
PSA checked out the item and said it was bogus.

Ironmanfan

all reputable autograph dealers should guarantee the authenticity of their items for life

contact him and let him know what you've discovered

IMF

gregmo32

He used to sell a ton of high dollar items on ebay, but for the past couple years he has only had about ten new feedback, all as a buyer. I don't think he was ever a business, per se,, but an individual. Still think I should just contact him directly?

magikbilly

Do you have your paperwork/proof of the transaction? What was agreed if this happened? What is the downside to contact?
Many times when contacted, such a seller will back their claims by forwarding you a letter supporting the signature from a third party with a "good name". Google that name. I have seen some very funny results - authenticators with reputations who sell now - who have actually been thrown out of court because they did not have enough expertise to offer meaningful testimony. Going back to the seller with such info can be helpful. Once I saw such research reveal the name of the seller himself as well as the "letter writer" - both with meaningless credentials and bad reps in and out of court.. One has effectively destroyed himself, the other flourishes. Read enough of this stuff online and that is why I stared to learn to do my own authentication many years ago.


Eric

gregmo32

They had included a letter from an authenticator who was well known and a letter from the pro sports team that supposedly secured the signatures. I believe these were originally for a genuine item, which he switched outand sent me with the forgery. Back then, PSA didn't encapsulate memorabilia, I don't think. A letter was what they gave when they reviewed an item.

I am hesitant to contact him directly, because I don't know what my rights are in this situation, and would hate to do something that would hurt my case. The item is now likely worth $10,000 for a legitimate example. I paid less than $2000 for it.

BLUEJAYWAY

I have no idea the state you reside in, but I would check with your States Law Dept./Atty.Gen. office to see if they have a State law covering such lifetime guarantees on autographs. I believe New York has such a lifetime guarantee, but cannot be 100% sure. Small claims court may be an avenue to pursue as well if your state has a lifetime guarantee statute. Also, and not being sarcastic here, the various TV law shows(Judy, Marilyn etc.)might be interested in such a case. One day I saw a guy suing another over bogus baseball cards on one of those shows. Good Luck.

vols1

Does it say Lifetime Warranty or Guarantee on the certificate you have? If it does, who's lifetime does it reference?

gregmo32

No, the letters came from a third party, and are not attached to the item. There is no guarantee written anywhere.

soundgard

<< <i>Legally speaking, the statute of limitations is usually five years, which has long past. Anyway, you could only receive what you paid for the item, not what it is worth now or what you could have resold it for on a good day.

The exception to this would be if there is a documentable lengthy money back guarantee. If it was sold with a lifetime guarantee of authenticity, then you could get your money back.

Beyond that, you'd have to ask the seller for a refund. Maybe he will give a refund, but if he doesn't I don't believe there's anything you can do about it. >>



This.

lostdart58

Allow you to use a legal term: You're screwed!!

swartz1

14 years ago?

put a period an move on...

mygotta

I think you are going to have a hard time getting an eBay seller to be concerned with a sale 14 years ago. Especially a $2,000 sale. PayPal can do anything. Your credit card can't do anything. You can only rely on him apologizing and saying ok. Which is highly doubtful in my opinion.

Ironmanfan

<< <i>I think you are going to have a hard time getting an eBay seller to be concerned with a sale 14 years ago. Especially a $2,000 sale. PayPal can do anything. >>



PayPal can do anything? Was PayPal even existent in 2000?

IMF

dennis07

I think he meant paypal CAN'T do anything (about this particular situation).

jay0791

Greg
You can look for items from this seller...and just buy a low priced item. That will give u contact info.

In this day and age you can get info on almost anything or anybody.

If you know city he lives in the better.

I would get his phone number and call him. He most likely will ignore you if you contact him thru ebay.

Any ebay action is long gone so he has no legal requirement to do anything.

He may claim you switched the item.

Most of your avenues are going to be pretty hard to prove/let alone collect anything.

Forget direct legal action.....to expensive and again difficult to prove. You already have documents supporting your opposite position on authenticity.

Small claims...no way. You must sue in his hometown and even if you win...you will never ever collect unless you follow thru and get a lien and he then has property he is selling.

Difficult to get wages garnished. You will need to know specific information on him for that.

"I would check with your States Law Dept./Atty.Gen. office to see if they have a State law covering such lifetime guarantees on autographs. I believe New York has such a lifetime guarantee."

Trust me in NYS the attorney general's office couldn't care less and give a SHI_

Good luck

mygotta

<< <i>I think he meant paypal CAN'T do anything (about this particular situation). >>



You would both be correct.

According to Wikipedia, PayPal was founded in 1998 and bought in 2000, but not till 2002 until eBay owned it. So in part, it asks whether this was a PayPal transaction. But even in that instance, PayPal would not bother itself with a 14 year old eBay transaction. Further, i don't know if your records on eBay go back that far. Do they? They should, but I am not certain. If it was paid by CC, could they do something to reverse the funds from a 14 year old transaction?

I have never heard of a lifetime guarantee in terms of buying something unless it was a Zippo lighter.

MooseDog

<< <i>No, the letters came from a third party, and are not attached to the item. There is no guarantee written anywhere. >>



Who are the COA's from (name or names of companies and/or who signed them)?

JoeBanzai

It doesn't hurt to try to contact him and tell him what you think, but I seriously doubt that ANYONE would believe you after 14 years.

I won a Killebrew rookie in an auction about the same time, or even before, from a BIG TIME dealer and had it graded a couple of years ago and it came back "altered" I didn't bother to contact seller.

He was one of those guys who put that special fall-apart tape on the holder he sent it in, so once I took it out, I am sure he would claim I switched cards on him.

Move on.

orioles93

14 years is the kicker here. If it was a shorter amount of time you would have some options here, but after 14 years you don't.

gregmo32

Thank you for all of the feedback. It helps me know what my options may be.

Unfortunately, the seller no longer seems to sell on eBay or I would win an auction and get his name that way.

Based on the story he gave me at the time about how he got the ball, I am certain he knowingly sent me the fake one.

I figured it is too late for direct legal action, but it really stinks that I had the foresight to make an expensive purchase, that has increased at least five-fold, and it turned out fake. Had I known all of these years that I DIDN'T have one, I would have made sure to get my hands on one along the way. Now it is much too expensive for me to afford, and I could have really used the funds from a sale for non-hobby type expenses.

JoeBanzai

I understand EXACTLY how you feel!

The card I bought cost $400.00 at the time and appears to me to be a PSA 9, the card is stunning and clearly outshines my PSA 8 that I bought when the other card turned out altered.

A Killebrew rookie in PSA 9 is valued at approximately $7,000.00 and the bad one is well centered.

I ignored the rumors going around at the time I bought it, this SUPER FAMOUS dealer (who always paid in cash when he bought collections) was very vocal in his dislike of TPG companies, but I had heard he would take returns if you pushed it on an item that was rejected by a TPG. He then would simply put the item in question back in one of his auctions, as he didn't believe the grading companies knew more than he did. Convenient way of doing business. This guy might still be in business, but doesn't advertise like he used to. I think he might do big shows, but I am not even sure about that.

Knowing what I know, I am quite sure that he would laugh me out the door if I approached him, and to be honest, if I were in his place, I would find my story hard to believe after all this time has passed.

Moral of MY story is get every item worth over a $100.00 (?) graded or authenticated IMMEDIATELY after purchase and then you have a chance to get your money back if item doesn't pass.

I, UNLIKE YOU HAVE NO IDEA IF MY GUY KNEW THE CARD WAS BAD! It really doesn't make a difference because of the time that has passed.

In my case I am more upset with myself than I am with him.

Good luck.

Joe