Home U.S. Coin Forum
Options

Definition of brockage?

I was looking at the dictionary, and I found the word "brockage". It doesn't mean quite what we think of it as. The word "brockage" means "a coin with a minting defect" and is derived from a Middle English word meaning "scrap or refuse". So I wonder how it came to be used only for the mirror-image error created by a capped die strike? Anyone with a knowledge of numismatic etymology to clear this up?

Comments

  • LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭
    .
    idk

    under that definition, which i looked up also, which states "a defect or fault imposed on a coin during its minting" seems to have a few words with some rather large gapes to their implications.

    1. defect/fault being synonymous and 1 word for my context
    2. imposed - one can have a lot of fun with this one.
    3. minting - does this mean creating of the flans all the way up to and including striking and shipping? where is the official beiginning and end to this minting?

    seems that most if not all mint errors would fall under that definition which is one of the simplest i've ever seen and there wasn't any other context cited for the word. very odd
    .

    <--- look what's behind the mask! - cool link 1/NO ~ 2/NNP ~ 3/NNC ~ 4/CF ~ 5/PG ~ 6/Cert ~ 7/NGC 7a/NGC pop~ 8/NGCF ~ 9/HA archives ~ 10/PM ~ 11/NM ~ 12/ANACS cert ~ 13/ANACS pop - report fakes 1/ACEF ~ report fakes/thefts 1/NCIS - Numi-Classes SS ~ Bass ~ Transcribed Docs NNP - clashed coins - error training - V V mm styles -



  • << <i>very odd. >>



    Indeed.
  • edix2001edix2001 Posts: 3,388
    "I finally got around to reading the dictionary. Turns out the zebra did it."
    ~ Steven Wright
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,808 ✭✭✭✭✭
    I opened the dictionary and under "annoying", it showed a picture of the drunk women I just had to deal with in our hotel lobby at 3 AM. image

    Srsly, tho', it's interesting (but not terribly surprising) that the dictionary would apply a less specific connotation to "brockage" than numismatists do.

    Like you, I'd like to hear the etymology. Such things interest me. I guess I'm geeky enough, huh.

    Since the word has Middle English roots, you might pose the same question on the Darkside. Perhaps some collectors of medieval coins will have an idea of how the term evolved.

    Explore collections of lordmarcovan on CollecOnline, management, safe-keeping, sharing and valuation solution for art piece and collectibles.
  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Drunk women at 3 a.m.?? Do tell..... what might be the 'rest of the story' LordM??? In my checkered career, I have had both the fortune and misfortune to encounter such women in the wee hours..... Cheers, RickO
  • Here's a cool, assisted, and overpriced brockage.
  • MGLICKERMGLICKER Posts: 7,995 ✭✭✭
    Delete.
  • BroadstruckBroadstruck Posts: 30,497 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Here's a cool, assisted, and overpriced brockage. >>



    That's just a multi struck die cap with a fully obliterated reverse.

    Below is a photo of a full brockage created by a capped die.

    image

    Here's a definition of what a Brockage is =

    A brockage error can only occur when there are two coins involved. One of the coins involved will always be a struck coin which has not ejected properly. That struck coin will find its way back between the dies and will be struck next to a blank planchet which was fed into the collar. The image of that first struck coin will be impressed into that side of the blank planchet. The result will be a second coin which has images of the first coin impressed into it. Those images will be pressed into the coin and the image will be in reverse. This incuse sunken image is known as a brockage.

    1868LargeCent, Prior to purchasing any other errors try to find and read a copy of the book "The Error Coin Encyclopedia" by Arnold Margolis & Fred Weinberg.
    To Err Is Human.... To Collect Err's Is Just Too Much Darn Tootin Fun!
  • lcoopielcoopie Posts: 8,873 ✭✭✭✭✭
    LCoopie = Les
  • davewesendavewesen Posts: 6,645 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Hey 1868LargeCent, you were obviously looking at a counterfeit listing, did you report it? How many other listings did you report? Unless of course the entire book was a counterfeit - do you know enough about authentic dictionarys to be able to make that determination?
  • lordmarcovanlordmarcovan Posts: 43,808 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Drunk women at 3 a.m.?? Do tell..... what might be the 'rest of the story' LordM??? In my checkered career, I have had both the fortune and misfortune to encounter such women in the wee hours..... Cheers, RickO >>

    Ricko, when you're a hotel night auditor and desk clerk, ALL drunk encounters are misfortunes. And in my experience so far, the women are worse than the men. Which is saying something.

    The coin Broadstruck posted is ubercool, but how can one tell if it is a latter-date Seated dime, or a Barber?

    Explore collections of lordmarcovan on CollecOnline, management, safe-keeping, sharing and valuation solution for art piece and collectibles.
  • LakesammmanLakesammman Posts: 17,454 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Excellant question - looking forward to an answer. image


    image
    "My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko, Big Moose, Cardinal.
  • LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>Excellant question - looking forward to an answer. image >>





    << <i>A brockage error can only occur when there are two coins involved. One of the coins involved will always be a struck coin which has not ejected properly. That struck coin will find its way back between the dies and will be struck next to a blank planchet which was fed into the collar. The image of that first struck coin will be impressed into that side of the blank planchet. The result will be a second coin which has images of the first coin impressed into it. Those images will be pressed into the coin and the image will be in reverse. This incuse sunken image is known as a brockage. >>



    this is the numismatic answer i am familiar with. i just didn't comment on it because the official dictionary descript. didn't even cover it. i don't know how the dictionary(ies) are officially updated and how they determine to include/exclude words as applied to specialized areas that are (homonyms?), kinda like multi-use acronyms depending on "field."
    .

    <--- look what's behind the mask! - cool link 1/NO ~ 2/NNP ~ 3/NNC ~ 4/CF ~ 5/PG ~ 6/Cert ~ 7/NGC 7a/NGC pop~ 8/NGCF ~ 9/HA archives ~ 10/PM ~ 11/NM ~ 12/ANACS cert ~ 13/ANACS pop - report fakes 1/ACEF ~ report fakes/thefts 1/NCIS - Numi-Classes SS ~ Bass ~ Transcribed Docs NNP - clashed coins - error training - V V mm styles -

  • LakesammmanLakesammman Posts: 17,454 ✭✭✭✭✭
    Excellant question - looking forward to an answer.

    I meant, looking forward to hearing how the meaning went from a defect or fault imposed on a coin during its minting to the very specific meaning we give it today.
    "My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko, Big Moose, Cardinal.
  • BroadstruckBroadstruck Posts: 30,497 ✭✭✭✭✭


    << <i>The coin Broadstruck posted is ubercool, but how can one tell if it is a latter-date Seated dime, or a Barber? >>



    I no longer own this one but the date was clearly identifiable as due to the mint mark it was 1903-O/O variety.

    image
    To Err Is Human.... To Collect Err's Is Just Too Much Darn Tootin Fun!

Leave a Comment

BoldItalicStrikethroughOrdered listUnordered list
Emoji
Image
Align leftAlign centerAlign rightToggle HTML viewToggle full pageToggle lights
Drop image/file