Question for draped bust quarter experts?

bosco5041

I bought a quarter years ago on an impulse purchase. It is a B-1 and had a auction paper with it that stated it was from the "Robert W. Miller, Sr. collection. and it was auctioned off by Bowers and Merena in Nov. 20 and 21, 1992 Which is probably about when I bought it ( 1993 or so). Anyway, it says in the auction paper that it is a rarity 6. My question is , is it still a rarity 6 or has it gone down in rarity? I looked it up in the heritage auctions and it seems to be a rarity 4 now, is that correct. I just sent it in on my collectors club membership and it graded F-15 which is what it was graded in the auction. Does anyone know the approx. value of this coin??? Are there many collectors of var. quarters? Thanks for any help you can give me.

rhedden

We will need the date. For example, 1806 B-1. After that, your question is easy to answer, and determination of value will get even easier if you post a pic.

bosco5041

<< <i>We will need the date. For example, 1806 B-1. After that, your question is easy to answer, and determination of value will get even easier if you post a pic. >>

Duh... Yel, it is an 1805. Can't believe I forgot the date. Sorry , no pics I haven't got it back yet.

hchcoin

B1 is an R4. A F 12 example sold at Heritage in 2006 for $1,265 as an R5.

Alistair Skinner has one online in NGC F15 for $1,500. As far as bust quarter variety collectors there are 5-10 of us who post frequently on the forum. Not sure if that is a lot but I do enjoy seeing and hearing about what they have bought

rhedden

In that grade, I doubt an R4 would bring much of a premium, if any, because the Type coin price in that grade is already above $1,000. There is active interest in Bust quarter varieties due to the release of two very fine books about the series in the past several years. However, it's not yet reached the level of interest in Sheldon varieties of early cents, in my opinion.

Back in the early 1990s, there was some inaccurate information out there regarding the rarity of Bust coin varieties. Many of the die marriages have been downgraded in rarity after more examples turned up. Many of the R5 varieties in Overton's book (1993 edition) are now R4 or maybe even R3. Checking the Heritage archives was a good idea, but even they sometimes include an optimistic estimate of rarity.

bosco5041

Thanks for the replies guys, I sure wish I would had bought more draped bust coins back in the 1990's, they are not very affordable now a days. I looked at the coin on Alistair Skinner site, it looks nice for a fine-15, very original. I guess I will just keep it for the time being, I just retired and I might need the money later on. I am surprised that there are not more quarter variety collectors than what there are. What is the reason for that? Cost of draped bust quarters?

BillJones

<< <i>Thanks for the replies guys, I sure wish I would had bought more draped bust coins back in the 1990's, they are not very affordable now a days. I looked at the coin on Alistair Skinner site, it looks nice for a fine-15, very original. I guess I will just keep it for the time being, I just retired and I might need the money later on. I am surprised that there are not more quarter variety collectors than what there are. What is the reason for that? Cost of draped bust quarters? >>



Yes, cost. I as a type collector have thought about forming date collections of Draped Bust coins, but the cost for nice looking coins is too high.

Baley

I am one of the collectors of draped bust quarters.have all five of the 1805 varieties 8 of the 10 1806 and both 1807, along with several additional die states of some of these. all are in about good through fine of course it would be nice to collect higher grade and examples, but as has been said that is cost prohibitive....as is the case for the 1804 and 1796 coins.. very neat and historical coins but not for everyone especially collectors who require high grades. and yes as new coins are attributed the rarity ratings tend to decline.

numisma

As others have stated, at the time of the 1992 Miller sale, there was little in the way of accurate information. As time has passed, surveys, census studies, and auction research has provided a more accurate accounting of early U.S. coin varieties.

I remember during the late 1990s, I had two 1805 B-5 quarters in nice condition. If I recall correctly, a nice VG with full rims and a super cool F+ with full dentilation. Breen's 1988 reference stated that there were only two traced. Apparently I had both examples! That variety is still a solid R.5, but it was not the R.8 that Breen assumed.

Here's what Breen thought of your 1805 B-1 in his 1988 reference: "Possibly 15 survive."

Breen's 1992 update to Browning's work called the 1805 B-1 "a very rare variety," yet his condition census included a couple of Choice BU examples, and an AU coin. The 1805 B-5 in the same book received a slightly scarcer rating of low R.7, but the condition census has coins at VF30 and lower.

Billet7

I too collect bust coins, but with varieties I just stick to the Capped bust quarters.

Would love to see pics!

bosco5041

<< <i>As others have stated, at the time of the 1992 Miller sale, there was little in the way of accurate information. As time has passed, surveys, census studies, and auction research has provided a more accurate accounting of early U.S. coin varieties.

I remember during the late 1990s, I had two 1805 B-5 quarters in nice condition. If I recall correctly, a nice VG with full rims and a super cool F+ with full dentilation. Breen's 1988 reference stated that there were only two traced. Apparently I had both examples! That variety is still a solid R.5, but it was not the R.8 that Breen assumed.

Here's what Breen thought of your 1805 B-1 in his 1988 reference: "Possibly 15 survive."

Breen's 1992 update to Browning's work called the 1805 B-1 "a very rare variety," yet his condition census included a couple of Choice BU examples, and an AU coin. The 1805 B-5 in the same book received a slightly scarcer rating of low R.7, but the condition census has coins at VF30 and lower. >>

Yes , I just got the quarter out a few weeks ago from the safely deposit box to send in to get graded and I got my Breen book out and read that about the 15 surviving pcs. but I guess that is history now. Does anyone know about how many there are now? I did not have mine attributed when I sent it in and I notice the one for sale on Alistair Skinner's site is not attributed either so I guess it would be hard to estimate the surviving pcs.

numisma

Does anyone know about how many there are now?

Steve Tompkins or Rory Rea would be the ones to ask, as well as a few others here. If I had to guess, I would say that there are 75 to 100 extant pieces.

hchcoin

<< <i> Does anyone know about how many there are now?

Steve Tompkins or Rory Rea would be the ones to ask, as well as a few others here. If I had to guess, I would say that there are 75 to 100 extant pieces. >>



The John Reich Collectors Society is currently doing a census of its members on bust quarter varieties. I anticipate the information to be published in their journal in the near future. It will give a glimpse into the scarcity of your coin. Here is the web site:

JRCS

It only cost $25 to become a member. According to Steve Tompkins book, an R-4 is very scarce with 76-200 known.

Quarternut

I would say that there are probably closer to 100 - 125 examples of the 1805 B-1 still in existence today. That still makes it a solid R-4 as far as rarity goes. However, they are very rare above VF, and less than 15 pieces are known above that grade and that includes damaged and cleaned examples.

The "Robert W. Miller, Sr. collection sold by Bowers & Merena was an important sale as far as bust quarters are concerned. Robert was the one who compiled and gave the rarity ratings for the 1992 Breen/Browning book, as Walter Breen had not kept up with the quarter series for many years, as to rarity.

Even so, Robert Miller's ratings were wrong on many counts and the 1992 should not be used for that, or anything else, since the more recent books, starting with mine in 2008, superseded it.

There hasn't been a F-15 sold at auction since 2006...and even then, it didn't sell. So I would say that for value I would use the PCGS price guide for a F-15 and add 20-25% for the die marriage and the pedigree.

If you purchased lot #64 in the sale, then I would say you got a nice coin, a nice pedigee, and a part of bust quarter history...

QN

coindeuce

I sold my NGC Fine-12 in Stack's 2006 "The Amherst & Waccaabuc Collections" sale, Lot 489. It had been consigned unattributed by either NGC or me; an alert staff numismatist at the auction house added the attribution to the lot description, much to my delight.

RogerRamjet

Here is my 1805 B-1. It's in a PCGS F-15 holder. Love the DBQ's (and watch out because they are addicting!)