Percentage of mark up for Redfield dollars?

Rollerman

I've heard several percentages, I wondered what the prevailing thought was here on the forum. Redfield dollars are worth how much more than straight retail prices? 20%, 30%, 40% or whatever you can get? I "assume" (there's that word again!) that the Paramount holdered coins are worth more than TPG ones? Guess that's also my question.
Thanks for any sense of direction you may provide!
Pete

MGLICKER

Depends of course on condition. If the common Morgan (there are Peace Dollars as well) has been correctly graded at MS64 for example. a 100% or so premium is the norm ($150 vs $75 for a non Redfield).

On higher priced coins, the premium measured by percentage, drops dramatically.

OldIndianNutKase

For me, I could care less if the coin was part of a hoard, like Redfield or GSA. I don't like a famous collector attribution on my slabs either. For some it is special that Eliasberg, Green, Newman owned the coin at one time. But they owned so many coins, "what difference does it make?"

I would rather the TPG's maintained records of the coin historically, the grade changes and the prices for which it sold, and the owners. Many of the rarities have this type of pedigree, but I find this information relevant and important for any graded coin.

Obviously coin dealers-speculators would not embrace this.

ricko

Pedigrees mean nothing to me and I would not pay a premium for such..... I buy the coin - not the slab, history, tarnish, label etc., etc., etc.. Cheers, RickO

magikbilly

It's a neat story this LaVere Redfield and his stocked basement, not as much as the micro-o Morgans tho overall. It has its place as a well known hoard that hit the market with a rather specific toning pattern that many are attracted to, but I'd not pay crazy. And I love peaches.

Eric

Rollerman

To me, the Redfield story is fascinating and all part of the history of our hobby. I understand those that just want to deal with the coins and don't care about "pedigree"...but to me, some of the pedigree's are of interest, maybe not 100% over retail interested, but interested!
I was hoping more would chime in with the mark up percentages, so I know not to overpay. I prefer the original Redfield Paramount holders over the reslabbed ones and assume they are more desireable to others as well?
Pete

291fifth

Buy the coin and only the coin. For me, no premium.

JustMe2

Some ware between 0 and 1 percent. Probable closer to zero then one.

Rollerman

<< <i>Some ware between 0 and 1 percent. Probable closer to zero then one. >>



I'm sure that's where you're at on the premium above retail, but I have been around enough to know that they do sell for a premium and I'm just trying to get a handle on what that might be.
Pete

nags

Personally I like the story associated with particular coins and am willing to pay some premium. If any of the zero premium folks have any to sell please let me know.

DennisH

Zero premium in my opinion.
Dealers mark them up because they think they can convince people to pay it. Doesn't mean it's justified. Some people buy into that, some people don't.

291fifth

<< <i>Personally I like the story associated with particular coins and am willing to pay some premium. If any of the zero premium folks have any to sell please let me know. >>



Just because someone says they won't pay a premium doesn't mean they will not try to get a premium when selling.

Sonorandesertrat

<< <i>

<< <i>Personally I like the story associated with particular coins and am willing to pay some premium. If any of the zero premium folks have any to sell please let me know. >>



Just because someone says they won't pay a premium doesn't mean they will not try to get a premium when selling. >>



Yup.

lostincoins

It depends on the person collecting them and the insert color holding the coin. in order from the lowest Red, black, green. If you have a green you are going to get a high premium for the coin and holder because that is a MS65 or better coin. The black holders tendto produce more colorful toning and people pay a premium for that. I just sold my Red holdered one and got MS64 $ for it (1890-s)

lcoopie

nothing in my opinion

lava

Redfield is a neat story, but it is not like he stored his coins in these holders. The holders were a marketing gimmick. I see no premium associated with the holder. I have seen some of these change hands for a premium, but I attributed that to the coins (nice vams, which carried a premium).

Wabbit2313

There is no way to establish a benchmark on what the coin is worth, to then add a premium. The Red MS65 holders have AU-MS66 coins in them. Most falling in the 61-63 range.

You can buy the 26-S for 200 bucks sometimes, in the 65 holder, so does that mean you took a $1000 discount because of the Redfield holder?

Prices are way down, and will continue to drop in my opinion.

SamByrd

redfields sit and sit at the fantasy prices many sellers place on them .

Cougar1978

If you can get more than what a non Redfield Dollar would retail for well go for it on your Redfield Dollars. I wonder where those (pay above market price for pedigree) buyers are hiding, I have some Binion and Omah Bank Hoard coins I would like to sell them.

However, I will not pay much of a premium for pedigree coins, maybe $5......

MGLICKER

<< <i>

<< <i>If you can get more than what a non Redfield Dollar would retail for well go for it on your Redfield Dollars. I wonder where those (pay above market price for pedigree) buyers are hiding, I have some Binion and Omah Bank Hoard coins I would like to sell them.

However, I will not pay much of a premium for pedigree coins, maybe $5...... >>


Binions will draw a small premium, but Omaha bank hoard? Nope. Just like Wells Fargo 1908 no-motto saints don't draw a premium... nobody cares about those. The history surrounding the Redfield hoard, the unique marketing and holders by Paramount... that's why drives the premiums. Look at the GSA premium... when a company takes the extra effort to create unique and attractive packaging, they are typically rewarded. Now, in this day and age, when everything winds up in TPG plastic, stuff like the GSA holders and Redfield holders is seen as retro, so to speak, and people like that... and consequently, are willing to pay up for it. The pedigree has something to do with it, but clearly, as evidenced in hammer price differential between slabbed and original packaging, people prefer the original packaging when it comes to Redfield and GSA coins. >>



Well said!

Rollerman

Thanks to all those who replied.
At an auction, I saw the neatest holder that apparently was a PCGS item. It housed a GSA complete holder and the grade was inside as well. I don't know if this SOP for PCGS now on the GSA holders, or if someone made up thiri own holders. I should have paid more attention.
If PCGS is doing that for GSA's, I wonder if Refields can be far behind?
Pete

RedTiger

There are a lot of variables. One data point: a generic common date that is a MS64 in the Redfield-65 holder will sell for much more than graded 65s in top tier holders. So the premium in that case might be 120% for the Redfield holder, vs. having the coin graded in a standard holder.

If anyone wants to sell their Redfields for what the actual coin is worth in a standard holder, they would likely sell in about 30 seconds after listing as a buy-it-now on Ebay. It doesn't matter if a lot of people don't care, or won't pay a premium, as the thread indicates, as long as at least two of those that are willing to pay are bidding at a particular auction. There are thousands of collectors that care about the holder. As a percentage that might be small, but anyone that sells Redfields for what the coin is worth is leaving money on the table. How much? Too many variables to give a pat answer.

A lot of buy-it-nows on Ebay are priced at over double what an auction price might realize, so it is not that easy to get good information.

As for the other hoards, Omaha bank is a negative, Binion on average will bring a modest premium, sometimes a bit more than that.