I don't want to cherrypick, because I don't want anyone in the pipeline to feel cheated. For coins I like, I'm more than willing to pay dealer's cost plus profit margin, but what is that? X + 10%? Some dealers are willing to share their cost, and bargain for what they see as a reasonable profit, but my experience is that such details don't come out on transactions where the dealer cherrypicked the coin.
<< <i>There have been a few good responses posted here for those dealers who are paranoid about 'cherrypickers', but this really doesn't address the underlying problem. If a collector is willing to pay the posted price for a seller's coin, without dickering, why should it matter to the seller why the collector is buying it? Is it okay for a collector to purchase the coin because he wants one with that date? Or he wants one with that mint mark? Or he wants one in that grade? But it is only forbidden if he is a cherrypicker, and wants it for the die marriage? How is that even logical? Why should the seller even care. If he has priced his coins at a price which allows him to make a profit, and a prospective buyer is willing to buy the coin at the listed price, why should the collector's motive even matter? And as has been stated here by others, if a seller is concerned that there might be money left on the table when a 'cherrypicker' buys a coin, then the seller should educate himself to properly attribute his coins. >>
>>
Yea, verily.
It'd be funny if the dealer took his box back muttering, "These aren't for sale," if he saw you appeared "too interested" in something. What if I were one of those weird die-state collectors who was looking for the progression of a die crack? Maybe it's worth more to me to have the coin, but others wouldn't care (and certainly wouldn't pay a premium). It would just result in the dealer holding onto it longer convinced he had a keeper.
I've had dealers (some who post on this site) allow me to take their bust quarters off to the side and check them against the bust quarter book while at a show to try and find varieties. I buy bust quarters and other coins/supplies from these types of dealers and they seem very happy to help me. I do a lot of repeat business with these dealers and rarely is it a cherry pick type coin.
Now, on the other hand, I have met one dealer at the CSNS show that made a huge fuss over me looking over their bust quarters. They kept asking me if I was a cherry picker and they were very nervous when I looked at their stuff. I told them I collect bust quarters by die variety and they got very nervous and defensive. I told them I would attribute all their bust quarters for them if they wanted so at least they knew what they had. I didn't buy anything from them but did help them out by looking up the varieties for them. My last comment was something to the effect that they should invest in some numismatic books so they wouldn't have to worry about getting cherry picked. They didn't really like that advice. They lost business with me just because of their attitude but that is their right.
I am not smart enough to memorize all the bust quarter varieties and die states from the book so I just ask if I can take the book out and check them right in front of the dealer. Most dealers like this approach since it is honest. I show them what I am looking for and what I find. Most of them could care less if it is an R1 or R5. The price is the price to them. I have never had a dealer increase a price on me or refuse to sell me a coin after I found an R4 or R5 that they didn't know about. Most of the dealers that care about the rarity of bust quarters already know what they have. The ones that don't care about the rarity don't seem to care as much about what they have. I have never had a dealer tell me that they didn't want me to look at the bust quarter book that I can remember.
It is no different than how I feel if I sell some coins that I picked up as part of a deal that is not my area of collecting/expertise. For example, if I sold someone some bulk mercury dimes and one turns out to be a cherry pick I don't feel bad at all. In fact, I am happy the mercury collector found something of added value. I bought the coins as bulk silver and I sold them at a slight increase. I didn't want to take the time to learn the intricacies of mercs and I am not going to lose sleep over someone else finding a cherry. In other words, if I am too lazy or time constrained to learn about the series, I am not going to get mad at the next person who has taken that time to increase their knowledge and find the cherry pick.
I think the reason dealers don't like cherry pickers has nothing to do with missing something. I think they get annoyed when someone wants to go through every box of coins they have, taking up valuable real estate, so they can buy one $10 coin (which they wouldn't even consider if it was identified and priced at the market price of $50).
The items I sell have been researched by me. If there was scotch in scotch tape, I'd get it out. When I am done, help yourself, please! I want the sale That's the point. If you can find more, well - good on you! I hope you do! I often help! You'll be back and we will smile together
<< <i>I think the reason dealers don't like cherry pickers has nothing to do with missing something. I think they get annoyed when someone wants to go through every box of coins they have, taking up valuable real estate, so they can buy one $10 coin >>
I think for dealers with hundreds / thousands of coins in inventory, this is the answer.
<< <i>I think the reason dealers don't like cherry pickers has nothing to do with missing something. I think they get annoyed when someone wants to go through every box of coins they have, taking up valuable real estate, so they can buy one $10 coin >>
THANK YOU. Someone gets it. And more often than not, my experience is that they buy no coin at all and waste a huge amount of time not buying it.
If you happen to find a top pop example of the rare 'inverted nose booger' variety that I missed and profit by it somehow, good for you. Just don't take forever finding it.
I usually reply that I'm looking for varieties. That usually elicits one of three responses:
1. We have a guy who comes in all the time who does that. I doubt you'll find anything. 2. I do that already, I doubt you'll find anything. 3. Ever see this one?
#1 and #2 mean 'you won't find anything because I don't want you looking through my stuff' and is a hint that its time to stop. I usually ask if they have any they can show me, and if the answer is no, I thank them and leave.
#3 usually results in a common variety being sold for full CPG price. It is, however, an opportunity to converse with the dealer, and might bring out other varieties or coins he thinks might be varieties, that might be good buys.
You Suck! Awarded 6/2008- 1901-O Micro O Morgan, 8/2008- 1878 VAM-123 Morgan, 9/2022 1888-O VAM-1B3 H8 Morgan | Senior Regional Representative- ANACS Coin Grading. Posted opinions on coins are my own, and are not an official ANACS opinion.
<< <i>I think the reason dealers don't like cherry pickers has nothing to do with missing something. I think they get annoyed when someone wants to go through every box of coins they have, taking up valuable real estate, so they can buy one $10 coin (which they wouldn't even consider if it was identified and priced at the market price of $50). >>
This is exactly what one dealer told me when the subject of cherrypicking came up. He said he could have the coin(s) they're looking for identified and priced in his case but the cherrypickers wouldn't be interested.
If anyone asks- yes, I am looking for varieties. No reason for me to lie or pretend otherwise. I don't spend hours pouring over a dealer's stock or spread out volumes of reference books all over their cases. It's just me and my 20x loupe and a quick check of coins I find attractive anyways.
Most dealers probably have no idea what I am looking for. Other times I will just talk to them and mention that I am interested in looking for Lincoln RPMs. They usually have no problem with it and just ask what to see whatever I find. Only once has a dealer ever asked me to leave, and she was a real piece of work. After waiting about five minutes for some Girl Scouts to page through a binder of cents and not purchasing anything, I started to quickly check for any RPMs. After less than a minute, she asked if I was looking for varieties and said "I can't have you looking for varieties. You're gonna have to leave" After a couple polite questions, it was clear she was not being honest with me and she was rather rude and confrontational. I finished checking everything in about two minutes and just left. Haven't been to her table since. No big deal. Plenty of other good dealers out there.
I think one thing some of these anti-cherrypickers do not understand is that the fun is in the hunt, not the having. I simply enjoy the process of going to a coin show and searching through coins. The quick thrill of spotting that RPM through the little loupe. Taking a few quick notes after the purchase. Getting home and pouring over reference books to see if I can identify the variety. Writing my little coin show report in my notes and documenting everything. That's the fun for me. There was a period where pretty much stopped going to shows, but cherrypicking RPMs has made going to coins shows fun again.
The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. -Thomas Jefferson
I think one thing some of these anti-cherrypickers do not understand is that the fun is in the hunt, not the having.
Glad to hear it. So that means when you find a significantly valuable variety, you donate the coin- or your profit from selling it- to, say, a charity? Since it's all about the hunt and not the having?
I always see that question as an opportunity to set the stage for future searching privileges. I always answer yes, and these are the things I like. If you let me look and I find them, we'll decide what should be a fair price. Sometimes this has led to me partnering with local shop owners with the split above X. If I'm looking for something my own collection, I'll say so. There are several shops where I can go in and look through everything in the cabinets, drawers, and "don't you dare sell this, I'm taking it home" piles.
Developing theory is what we are meant to do as academic researchers and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
Glad to hear it. So that means when you find a significantly valuable variety, you donate the coin- or your profit from selling it- to, say, a charity? Since it's all about the hunt and not the having?
Didn't think so.
Ummmm… I’m a collector. That means I collect things. I go out, look for things I like, and collect them. If I am out fishing or camping or hiking or attending a ball game, I never contemplate how fun it is to have my coins sitting in an SDB. My! What fun! But yes, I do enjoy taking out my collections from time to time and enjoy studying them and seeing what I have assembled.
You know how many cherrypicks I’ve sold? Zero. You know how much I have profited off my cherrypicks? Zero dollars and zero cents. That would be $0.00. To the penny. In fact, many of the coins I’ve cherrypicked are coins for which I have overpaid. They are not worth the purchase price even with the correct attribution. Since you are apparently such a fan of charity, perhaps I could be your non-profit charity and you could send me the funds necessary to continue my money-losing cherrypicking endeavors. So should I be waiting for a check or wire?
“Didn’t think so.”
The Tree of Liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants. -Thomas Jefferson
In fact, many of the coins I’ve cherrypicked are coins for which I have overpaid. They are not worth the purchase price even with the correct attribution.
Wouldn't that make them simply purchases rather than true cherrypicks then? As I've understood it over the last three decades as a dealer, the idea of a cherrypick is to take advantage of said misattribution or mistake to acquire something more rare and valuable than what was paid.
That's one possible definition. Another definition is just finding an unattributed variety. Often they do not have any extra value. If there are 2 conflicting definitions of cherrypick out there, what do we answer when someone asks if we are doing it? I guess we ask what their definition is? Then we can answer.
Comments
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
<< <i>
<< <i>There have been a few good responses posted here for those dealers who are paranoid about 'cherrypickers', but this really doesn't address the underlying problem. If a collector is willing to pay the posted price for a seller's coin, without dickering, why should it matter to the seller why the collector is buying it? Is it okay for a collector to purchase the coin because he wants one with that date? Or he wants one with that mint mark? Or he wants one in that grade? But it is only forbidden if he is a cherrypicker, and wants it for the die marriage? How is that even logical? Why should the seller even care. If he has priced his coins at a price which allows him to make a profit, and a prospective buyer is willing to buy the coin at the listed price, why should the collector's motive even matter? And as has been stated here by others, if a seller is concerned that there might be money left on the table when a 'cherrypicker' buys a coin, then the seller should educate himself to properly attribute his coins. >>
Yea, verily.
It'd be funny if the dealer took his box back muttering, "These aren't for sale," if he saw you appeared "too interested" in something. What if I were one of those weird die-state collectors who was looking for the progression of a die crack? Maybe it's worth more to me to have the coin, but others wouldn't care (and certainly wouldn't pay a premium). It would just result in the dealer holding onto it longer convinced he had a keeper.
Obscurum per obscurius
Now, on the other hand, I have met one dealer at the CSNS show that made a huge fuss over me looking over their bust quarters. They kept asking me if I was a cherry picker and they were very nervous when I looked at their stuff. I told them I collect bust quarters by die variety and they got very nervous and defensive. I told them I would attribute all their bust quarters for them if they wanted so at least they knew what they had. I didn't buy anything from them but did help them out by looking up the varieties for them. My last comment was something to the effect that they should invest in some numismatic books so they wouldn't have to worry about getting cherry picked. They didn't really like that advice. They lost business with me just because of their attitude but that is their right.
I am not smart enough to memorize all the bust quarter varieties and die states from the book so I just ask if I can take the book out and check them right in front of the dealer. Most dealers like this approach since it is honest. I show them what I am looking for and what I find. Most of them could care less if it is an R1 or R5. The price is the price to them. I have never had a dealer increase a price on me or refuse to sell me a coin after I found an R4 or R5 that they didn't know about. Most of the dealers that care about the rarity of bust quarters already know what they have. The ones that don't care about the rarity don't seem to care as much about what they have. I have never had a dealer tell me that they didn't want me to look at the bust quarter book that I can remember.
It is no different than how I feel if I sell some coins that I picked up as part of a deal that is not my area of collecting/expertise. For example, if I sold someone some bulk mercury dimes and one turns out to be a cherry pick I don't feel bad at all. In fact, I am happy the mercury collector found something of added value. I bought the coins as bulk silver and I sold them at a slight increase. I didn't want to take the time to learn the intricacies of mercs and I am not going to lose sleep over someone else finding a cherry. In other words, if I am too lazy or time constrained to learn about the series, I am not going to get mad at the next person who has taken that time to increase their knowledge and find the cherry pick.
<< <i>
<< <i>Best response to Cherrypicker? >>
No. >>
I agree with this response. It's not their business and it can only lead to trouble.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
World Collection
British Collection
German States Collection
Eric
<< <i>No, I'm just here to throw away money. >>
This one gets my vote
<< <i>I think the reason dealers don't like cherry pickers has nothing to do with missing something. I think they get annoyed when someone wants to go through every box of coins they have, taking up valuable real estate, so they can buy one $10 coin >>
I think for dealers with hundreds / thousands of coins in inventory, this is the answer.
Coin Rarities Online
<< <i>I think the reason dealers don't like cherry pickers has nothing to do with missing something. I think they get annoyed when someone wants to go through every box of coins they have, taking up valuable real estate, so they can buy one $10 coin >>
THANK YOU. Someone gets it. And more often than not, my experience is that they buy no coin at all and waste a huge amount of time not buying it.
If you happen to find a top pop example of the rare 'inverted nose booger' variety that I missed and profit by it somehow, good for you. Just don't take forever finding it.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
Lance.
1. We have a guy who comes in all the time who does that. I doubt you'll find anything.
2. I do that already, I doubt you'll find anything.
3. Ever see this one?
#1 and #2 mean 'you won't find anything because I don't want you looking through my stuff' and is a hint that its time to stop. I usually ask if they have any they can show me, and if the answer is no, I thank them and leave.
#3 usually results in a common variety being sold for full CPG price. It is, however, an opportunity to converse with the dealer, and might bring out other varieties or coins he thinks might be varieties, that might be good buys.
<< <i>I think the reason dealers don't like cherry pickers has nothing to do with missing something. I think they get annoyed when someone wants to go through every box of coins they have, taking up valuable real estate, so they can buy one $10 coin (which they wouldn't even consider if it was identified and priced at the market price of $50). >>
This is exactly what one dealer told me when the subject of cherrypicking came up. He said he could have the coin(s) they're looking for identified and priced in his case but the cherrypickers wouldn't be interested.
<< <i>"That's what she said." >>
Most dealers probably have no idea what I am looking for. Other times I will just talk to them and mention that I am interested in looking for Lincoln RPMs. They usually have no problem with it and just ask what to see whatever I find. Only once has a dealer ever asked me to leave, and she was a real piece of work. After waiting about five minutes for some Girl Scouts to page through a binder of cents and not purchasing anything, I started to quickly check for any RPMs. After less than a minute, she asked if I was looking for varieties and said "I can't have you looking for varieties. You're gonna have to leave" After a couple polite questions, it was clear she was not being honest with me and she was rather rude and confrontational. I finished checking everything in about two minutes and just left. Haven't been to her table since. No big deal. Plenty of other good dealers out there.
I think one thing some of these anti-cherrypickers do not understand is that the fun is in the hunt, not the having. I simply enjoy the process of going to a coin show and searching through coins. The quick thrill of spotting that RPM through the little loupe. Taking a few quick notes after the purchase. Getting home and pouring over reference books to see if I can identify the variety. Writing my little coin show report in my notes and documenting everything. That's the fun for me. There was a period where pretty much stopped going to shows, but cherrypicking RPMs has made going to coins shows fun again.
Glad to hear it. So that means when you find a significantly valuable variety, you donate the coin- or your profit from selling it- to, say, a charity? Since it's all about the hunt and not the having?
Didn't think so.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
Didn't think so.
Ummmm… I’m a collector. That means I collect things. I go out, look for things I like, and collect them. If I am out fishing or camping or hiking or attending a ball game, I never contemplate how fun it is to have my coins sitting in an SDB. My! What fun! But yes, I do enjoy taking out my collections from time to time and enjoy studying them and seeing what I have assembled.
You know how many cherrypicks I’ve sold? Zero. You know how much I have profited off my cherrypicks? Zero dollars and zero cents. That would be $0.00. To the penny. In fact, many of the coins I’ve cherrypicked are coins for which I have overpaid. They are not worth the purchase price even with the correct attribution. Since you are apparently such a fan of charity, perhaps I could be your non-profit charity and you could send me the funds necessary to continue my money-losing cherrypicking endeavors. So should I be waiting for a check or wire?
“Didn’t think so.”
Wouldn't that make them simply purchases rather than true cherrypicks then? As I've understood it over the last three decades as a dealer, the idea of a cherrypick is to take advantage of said misattribution or mistake to acquire something more rare and valuable than what was paid.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
Another definition is just finding an unattributed variety. Often they do not have any extra value.
If there are 2 conflicting definitions of cherrypick out there, what do we answer when someone asks if we are doing it?
I guess we ask what their definition is? Then we can answer.