A beautiful colorfully-toned Proof Kennedy Half Dollar
WingedLiberty1957
Posts: 2,980 ✭✭✭✭✭
1964 Kennedy Half Dollar (PCGS Secure Plus PR67).
This coin came out of a sealed OGP Proof Set that I bought for $125 on eBay.
I put this coin through PCGS's Secure Plus grading service so it could be sniffed for illegal chemicals. It passed with flying colors and I just got the results back on Thursday ... Proof 67.
Amazing to think that this coin is 50 years old already. Where does the time go? I still remember when this new half dollar design was rushed into production soon after the tragic Kennedy assassination in November 1963.
The PCGS TrueView Department did their usual outstanding job capturing the silky-smooth, two-sided, blue-violet color on this monster:
I just captured the slabbed coin with my iPhone in indirect sunlight:
This final image was another iPhone photo of this Kennedy still sealed in the OGP cello flat pack:
This coin came out of a sealed OGP Proof Set that I bought for $125 on eBay.
I put this coin through PCGS's Secure Plus grading service so it could be sniffed for illegal chemicals. It passed with flying colors and I just got the results back on Thursday ... Proof 67.
Amazing to think that this coin is 50 years old already. Where does the time go? I still remember when this new half dollar design was rushed into production soon after the tragic Kennedy assassination in November 1963.
The PCGS TrueView Department did their usual outstanding job capturing the silky-smooth, two-sided, blue-violet color on this monster:
I just captured the slabbed coin with my iPhone in indirect sunlight:
This final image was another iPhone photo of this Kennedy still sealed in the OGP cello flat pack:
0
Comments
I did examine the cello VERY CAREFULLY with my 45x scope, because I wanted to see if there were any pinholes. I found none.
Nor did I see any other signs of tampering of the cello pack.
Is there a way people can create their own cello packs and reseal them, themselves, with a machine?
In any case, to sort this out, I figured I would use PCGS's Secure Plus service so the coin could be examined and tested by their chemical sniffer.
This is my other monster toned Proof Half Dollar that I bought from CoinsAreFun a few years back ...
I just love this kind of material!
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
Is it possible someone figured out a clever way to tone coins this nicely inside cello? Maybe. But since they sold the coin inside the cello and not PCGS graded, they probably would not have been concerned with toning it in a way that would fool the PCGS sniffer. Also their profit margin would be pretty small on an endeavor with so much effort involved -- but who knows!
I guess the bottom line is ... I LIKE IT. And in the end, that's all that counts.
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
JH
Proof Buffalo Registry Set
Capped Bust Quarters Registry Set
Proof Walking Liberty Halves Registry Set
I don't know if thats true or not but it is plausable, I used to develop pictures and photo
paper turns dark in the sun rather quickly, but I would imagine just one side would exibit
this, unless maybe there is some heat buildup in the mint cello?????.......who knows
Steve
BTW that half rocks, looks as if most of the others in that flatpack have some degree of toning as well
I guess the nice aspect for me about this one was I paid only about $90 additional for this ... which is small potatoes (pretty cheap) for me at least ... and I think it's really cool looking.
The only real plausible scenario that I can think of for AT would be the Kennedy was somehow AT'd out of the Cello in a way that the PCGS Sniffer could not detect. And then someone has a machine that can create "fake" cello packs and the coin was resealed back into a fake cello pack. I did compare this set with another 1964 Proof Set that I had and it was apparently identical in look and feel and size, even down to the crimping of the cells between the coins. So if it was resealed, someone did a fantastic job!
And if the Kennedy was cooked, they did a stunning job with nice smooth colors that did not impact the mirrors and did not introduce any spots. Certainly does seem like a lot of effort with all that for a single set profit of $90. No one will be able to retire on that!
One thing is for sure though, the early 1960's is FANTASTIC for really colorful toning occurring inside mint sealed cello ... Most of my experience is with Lincolns!
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
It looks completely natural to me as you stated and you can see in your picture the rest of the set has toning as well.
I have seen toning like this, just not all the way developed like yours and nowhere as nice......usually spotted. I think people forget that
there were so many of these modern proofs made and were not closely guarded as the early proof sets with much lower mintages.
I also think that as the years pass we will start seeing much more to come.
Keep searching for them.......your sets are looking great!!
.
CoinsAreFun Toned Silver Eagle Proof Album
.
Gallery Mint Museum, Ron Landis& Joe Rust, The beginnings of the Golden Dollar
.
More CoinsAreFun Pictorials NGC
And then there was this crazy pink and blue PCGS PR68 BN Lincoln "Beast" that toned inside sealed cello ...
(This is only the 2nd known PCGS PR68 BN Lincoln in the entire Lincoln run)
This was an interesting case as the Lincoln was the ONLY coin that toned in that cello pack ... all the other coins were completely "normal" looking (you can see parts of the completely untoned Dime and Half Dollar in my photo below).
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
But in all seriousness that coin is awesome!
1. Exposure to light
2. Impurity on the inside of the Mylar as it went through packaging.
3. Poor seal between the coin and the Mint Emblem next to it.
4. Poor seal somewhere else in the packaging
5. Storage in an environment where the environmental elements could penetrate the Mylar.
It toned like an old copper proof stored in tissue paper.
<< <i>PCGS price guide says it's worth $18, I'll over a generous 2x PCGS price guide for a total of $36, I will also contribute $2.50 towards the cost of overnight shipping.
But in all seriousness that coin is awesome! >>
You are a collector after my own heart!
That's the way I think too ... always thinking "Sell it to me!"
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
<< <i>
<< <i>PCGS price guide says it's worth $18, I'll over a generous 2x PCGS price guide for a total of $36, I will also contribute $2.50 towards the cost of overnight shipping.
But in all seriousness that coin is awesome! >>
You are a collector after my own heart!
That's the way I think too ... always thinking "Sell it to me!" >>
That is a very nice coin. The color, and evenness of the toning is truly special.
<< <i>Hello congrats on the Kennedy. It came from a huge collection i bought in the Florida keys. There was a large front page article written about my company key largo rare coins that made the front page of the local paper. After the article i was bombarded with calls to appraise and purchase several collections. That coin along with boxes of other sets all came from the same lady to get money for Christmas. The boxes were all stored out of the sun and did not tone that way due to sun light. - KLRC >>
KLRC, Thanks for your post!!
It's great getting some history on a coin like this.
What year did you buy the set ... and how long has the color been stable?
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
Steve
Looking for Top Pop Mercury Dime Varieties & High Grade Mercury Dime Toners.
<< <i>I've had those sets for over 4 years and all came from one huge collection i purchased in the keys >>
Thanks KLRC, So it sounds like the color has been stable on the Kennedy for at least 4 years. The history of that set makes me think it was very likely NOT purposely cooked (AT'd) since it was just another anonymous set that was part of a huge collection that was sold.
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
As you are a toned coin specialist, it surprises me that you (as well as many others) are under the mistaken impression that the Sniffer can distinguish AT coins. In most cases, it can not. Fact.
Certainly I trust PCGS's opinions 10x more than ngc's (or any other tps's) opinion.
Is PCGS, or anyone for that matter, infallible ?
No probably not
But I will gladly position myself on PCGS's side with decisions they make
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
<< <i>Well I trust the combination of the PCGS sniffer and three PCGS graders more than anyone or anything else.
Certainly I trust PCGS's opinions 10x more than ngc's (or any other tps's) opinion.
Is PCGS, or anyone for that matter, infallible ?
No probably not
But I will gladly position myself on PCGS's side with decisions they make >>
No thread from WingedLiberty would be complete without at least one insult to the "other" TPG. LMAO.
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
My sets: [280+ horse coins] :: [France Sowers] :: [Colorful world copper] :: [Beautiful world coins]
-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
<< <i>That half puzzles me....I have several proof sets of '64 Kennedy's, (AH and non-AH), and there is not so much as a hint of tarnish on any of them. The information from KeyLargoRareCoins indicates storage in conditions that would not 'normally' be conducive to tarnish.... (of course, there could always be some missing details - i.e. attic storage, near a gas furnace/water heater - pure conjecture on my part). Just amazing how it could achieve that state. Cheers, RickO >>
Actually the mint and proof sets were wrapped in newspaper from an old move....when they got to their new house in the Keys the didn't unpack the boxes so the sets sat wrapped in newspaper in their garage for a long long time so certainly the heat and the presence of sulfur from the newspaper would have caused the toning over a decade or longer. KLRC just stated that the coins were not in direct sunlight which was correct....he is a former business partner which is why I know so much about the coins
I have a 60's proof set from the group that I bought from him as it was the crustiest sealed proof set I had ever seen....still have it so not all of the coins from the collection fared as well due to the storage lol
......................heat, time and enclosure in the cello: the early 1960's was a time when the Mint was trying different planchet rinses.
congrats
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
<< <i> Actually the mint and proof sets were wrapped in newspaper from an old move....when they got to their new house in the Florida Keys, they didn't unpack the boxes so the sets sat wrapped in newspaper in their garage for a long long time so certainly the heat and the presence of sulfur from the newspaper would have caused the toning over a decade or longer. KLRC just stated that the coins were not in direct sunlight which was correct....he is a former business partner of mine, which is why I know so much about the coins
Hey KryptoniteComics, Thanks for solving the mystery! Ahh!! So this 1964 Proof Set with the purple toned Kennedy, was wrapped in newspaper and stored for a long time in a garage in the Florida Keys after a move. This kind of historical background information really explains a lot. (That's one thing I truly love about this board! The information you can sometimes obtain is incredible!). This tale kind of reminds of the Matte Proof Lincoln toning story where those coins were wrapped in sulfur-laden tissue paper upon issue -- but in this case the whole cello pack was wrapped in newspaper and left for a long time in a high humidity garage (due to neglect and not purposefully).
I also tend to buy into the "experimental rinse" theory -- that were possibly used on some Proof coins issued at the Philadelphia Mint in the early 1960's. It's the best theory I have hard to explain the huge spike in beautifully toned Lincoln's and Jefferson's that turned amazing colors inside sealed cello packs from 1961 through 1964. I wonder if it was the copper content that was the most reactive to the rinse? Even the 1964 Kennedy Half Dollar had some copper content (90% Silver & 10% Copper). The lower copper content in the silver coins of that era, might be why color like this is rarer on the silver coins, than the Lincolns and Jeffersons (which had more copper content). Clearly for Silver coins, the environment in which the cello packs were stored for long periods of time, has more of a key factor in toning.
Here are a few more early 1960's toners for your viewing pleasure ...
I bought this 1961 sealed cello pack Proof Set for $29 from my local bricks and mortar. I found it searching through about 300 of his early 1960's Proof Set Inventory ...
And finally a wild colorful PCGS-graded Proof Lincoln from 1964 (the year of the blue Kennedy in the OP) ...
If you are a lover of Proof Color, focus on perusing dealer inventories of cello packs in the years 1961 through 1964. I personally have found the year 1961 to be a gold mine, but toners seem to be findable in all 4 years.
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
<< <i>This toned in the cello.
Love this one!
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set
and it sets us apart from practitioners and consultants. Gregor
I don't have any answers for you as to why some tone and some don't, just theories. AMRC's post on the 1st page covered most all of them.
It's hard to think that some chemical leaches thru the cello to tone the surfaces, but it's not entirely impossible. It may leach thru the seams/seals in between the coins and may not be detectable by human eye observation. (i.e. there is a small unsealed area between the Half and Mint seal and a small unsealed area between the Mint seal and outside package, thus exposing a micro-amount of air/chemicals to the half.
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
So BOTTOM LINE is ...
The 3 PCGS Graders that looked at this blue-violet 1964 Kennedy Proof Half Dollar (along with the PCGS Secure Plus Sniffer Machine) got this coin 100% CORRECT that it's "Natural Toning" and Gradable!
The color took over a decade to develop, the color has been stable for at least 4 years (probably longer), it was not done intentionally, and there were no chemicals applied to this coin with the intention to change it's color in order to increase it's market value. This was a coin that changed very slowly in color due to unusual environmental conditions and not by intention.
WAY TO GO PCGS !!
My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set