Physical silver supplies are in short supply
CaptHenway
Posts: 32,173 ✭✭✭✭✭
FWIW, I went down to my old coin shop to say goodbye today. I am leaving the area and continuing my retirement elsewhere.
The place was a madhouse. After dumping metals like mad on Friday, the public was buying back today. While I was there an old customer came in and wanted to buy 25 10-ounce silver bars. First the man on the counter had to call their regular supplier to see if they could get the bars to cover the order. He called, and a screener asked who was calling. He identified himself, and the supplier said that he could place an order for them for delivery 30 days out.
The store's guy asked the supplier what was going on, and he was told that the supplier was performing "triage" on calls. Only good, large buyers were being allowed to order product. Small stores were being shut out.
So, when your local mom & pop store says that they don't have any product to sell during this dip, don't come whining to CU about it.
The place was a madhouse. After dumping metals like mad on Friday, the public was buying back today. While I was there an old customer came in and wanted to buy 25 10-ounce silver bars. First the man on the counter had to call their regular supplier to see if they could get the bars to cover the order. He called, and a screener asked who was calling. He identified himself, and the supplier said that he could place an order for them for delivery 30 days out.
The store's guy asked the supplier what was going on, and he was told that the supplier was performing "triage" on calls. Only good, large buyers were being allowed to order product. Small stores were being shut out.
So, when your local mom & pop store says that they don't have any product to sell during this dip, don't come whining to CU about it.
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
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He also said he had a difficult time committing his scrap as the refiners/wholesalers were reluctant to buy.
This is how markets work and is one of the great risks of pm's. Everyone wants to sell you this stuff, but they don't wanna buy it back-- at least when prices are falling and when YOU need them the mist.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Anyway to comment on the national buyers/refiners, both of the firms I deal with today, were not taking any lock in on price until the dust settles mid week. I am referring too scrap/ junk , not clean bullion.
<< <i>I went to Monarch today to get a kilo bar now that prices were sane. They were out of everything but 1/2 ounce silver butterflies. >>
I too went to Monarch today. When I went they were practically wiped out. At the time of my visit to the site they had seven (7) 25 t oz bars available.
While I pondered the idea to buy or not I would refresh to catch a slight spot dip, in those brief few seconds I watched in real time those bars begin to vanish.
Pulled the trigger and picked up one.
I re-visited the site later tonight and they had two ounce bars back in stock.
JC
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Wait for it. Wait for it.
The price of the real thing is starting to seriously diverge from the price in the electronic marketplace.
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<< <i>Common silver eagles and 90% rolls are selling for 30% to 35% premiums on eBay.
The price of the real thing is starting to seriously diverge from the price in the electronic marketplace. >>
Indeed!
I still have it, and wished those "walkers" the best in their search. Some people read the news. They should go watch HSN Coin Vault , or some _ _ _ _ before they come see me. I think most of them come direct from Sam's Club or WalMart.
I told a man yesterday, "for that price... go buy land in Nevada and start digging."
<< <i>A lot of people seem to think that the World owes them cheap metals. >>
+ 1,000,000
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i>Oh, I'll be back on here once I get the computer hooked up to the squirrel cage at my new home.....
Glad to hear that! But indeed, I'll miss possibly seeing you at your old coin shop, even though you'd retired of course. Always a pleasure to see you there.
<< <i>I've tried to tell people, but they don't hear me. An older professional couple were in yesterday. I had $100 face value of Walkers, Washingtons, Mercs and Roosevelts sitting out because two people asked for it on the phone. When they arrived, they wanted it at 17X face value and did not want to pay sales tax.
I still have it, and wished those "walkers" the best in their search. Some people read the news. They should go watch HSN Coin Vault , or some _ _ _ _ before they come see me. I think most of them come direct from Sam's Club or WalMart.
I told a man yesterday, "for that price... go buy land in Nevada and start digging."
Reality of buying and selling is what it is, they're just a bit misinformed. Altho if you were in IL, they'd be right about sales tax -- no sales tax on coins here!
<< <i>As many as seem to think the world owes them high prices for metals? >>
Especially so, if they paid a high price for them.
<< <i>
<< <i>As many as seem to think the world owes them high prices for metals? >>
Especially so, if they paid a high price for them. >>
The world doesn't owe high or low prices for metals, eventually the government will take care of that.
<< <i> I am leaving the area and continuing my retirement elsewhere. >>
Can we assume that you are moving to a warmer climate?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>As many as seem to think the world owes them high prices for metals? >>
Dig by the sweat of your brow, brother ! Everyman deserves what he earns.
It's no surprise...
There giving none away...
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>FWIW, I went down to my old coin shop to say goodbye today. I am leaving the area and continuing my retirement elsewhere.
>>
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
I knew it would happen.
<< <i>Common silver eagles and 90% rolls are selling for 30% to 35% premiums on eBay.
The price of the real thing is starting to seriously diverge from the price in the electronic marketplace. >>
Give it a couple months. The new normal will settle in and you will buy all the silver bullion you want at the 'paper prices'.
Tyler
<< <i>As many as seem to think the world owes them high prices for metals? >>
Couldn't agree more.
When it comes time to sell...as it always does eventually. The corner B&M shop is going to buy your metals at some percentage BELOW whatever the spot price is. The low life pawn shops / lending stores at 60%- 70% of the spot price. You can bank on that.
I have been visiting Monarch and Rust Coin (Salt Lake City) since 1978. They have never once paid a premium for my silver or gold.
Tyler
<< <i>
<< <i>As many as seem to think the world owes them high prices for metals? >>
Couldn't agree more.
When it comes time to sell...as it always does eventually. The corner B&M shop is going to buy your metals at some percentage BELOW whatever the spot price is. The low life pawn shops / lending stores at 60%- 70% of the spot price. You can bank on that.
I have been visiting Monarch and Rust Coin (Salt Lake City) since 1978. They have never once paid a premium for my silver or gold.
Tyler >>
I don't know who you are selling your silver and gold to but I have never gotten below spot price on any .999 silver or gold when I have sold.
<< <i>Sure wish somebody with the pockets would do a Hunt Brothers move right now. >>
Is the FED doing that with Quantitative Easing methods ? We can print a trillion dollars, and sell paper silver, but it doesn't make more metal come out of the ground. I think the mainstream doesn't understand the truth of the matter. There's way more money than precious metal.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>As many as seem to think the world owes them high prices for metals? >>
Couldn't agree more.
When it comes time to sell...as it always does eventually. The corner B&M shop is going to buy your metals at some percentage BELOW whatever the spot price is. The low life pawn shops / lending stores at 60%- 70% of the spot price. You can bank on that.
I have been visiting Monarch and Rust Coin (Salt Lake City) since 1978. They have never once paid a premium for my silver or gold.
Tyler >>
I don't know who you are selling your silver and gold to but I have never gotten below spot price on any .999 silver or gold when I have sold. >>
Never ever? I find that to be a remarkable statement.
When I was working at a large coin shop, there were time when, depending upon market conditions prevailing at the time, we sold surplus .999 fine gold and silver to other dealers at less than spot. Needless to say we did not buy it in at spot at that time.
Obviously those conditions do not apply in this market, but over the long run, things change.
Yep, I'd also like to see a very big somebody take delivery and hurt the naked shorts so bad that they never come back. The next best thing of course, would be for several end users to start stockpiling physical instead of using Comex.
And according to Sinclair, that's exactly what will happen (with gold) because the bullion banks will reverse their positions when the price gets low enough and when they've accumulated enough physical metal.
In such an opague and unregulated market, they can put on as many bogus short positions as they need to drive the price, and nobody else gets to use the same rules. They really do need to go to jail, but that might implicate a whole segment of TPTB. Whoops. Sounding too crazy. Never mind.
There is a lot going on, but we only get bits & pieces to evaluate.
I knew it would happen.
Which would cause what? a temporary spike?
Eventually, everyone must sell their silver (or give it away, or otherwise dispose of it) The only other alternative is to die with it (and then someone else sells it for you)
when "somebody big" who has taken delivery decides to sell it, then what?
prices go back down maybe
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
<< <i> I'd also like to see a very big somebody take delivery
Which would cause what? a temporary spike?
Eventually, everyone must sell their silver (or give it away, or otherwise dispose of it) The only other alternative is to die with it (and then someone else sells it for you)
when "somebody big" who has taken delivery decides to sell it, then what?
prices go back down maybe >>
I think what jmski is saying is that if someone huge took delivery and crushed the shorts the price would go up drastically and then the little man could sell for a nice profit...then wait for the big guy to sell off, causing it to tank...and create another buying opp for the little man. I don't know about anyone else on these boards but I don't cause the waves, I ride 'em.
I knew it would happen.
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
That's the wire price with small CC deposit. Looks like they are not 2013's (2013 listed seperately and showing sold out) but when I spoke with them yesterday I was told all monster boxes they sell are sealed and are only listed on the website if they are in hand and ready for delivery. Show only one more available.
Edited to add: GONE, keep checking their site, boxes pop up as they buy them from sellers. Picked up two others from them yesterday.
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
<< <i>the more the shortages linger, the higher the premiums will go. >>
Falling silver spot = higher premiums at retail. Eventually lower silver spot will be the norm and the premiums will also adjust downward. History just repeating itself.
<< <i>
<< <i>the more the shortages linger, the higher the premiums will go. >>
Falling silver spot = higher premiums at retail. Eventually lower silver spot will be the norm and the premiums will also adjust downward. History just repeating itself. >>
It reminds me of how everyone went crazy trying to buy AR's before they were "banned." Now that it's obvious that no ban will be going into effect prices are coming way back down.
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<< <i> I'd also like to see a very big somebody take delivery
Which would cause what? a temporary spike?
Eventually, everyone must sell their silver (or give it away, or otherwise dispose of it) The only other alternative is to die with it (and then someone else sells it for you)
when "somebody big" who has taken delivery decides to sell it, then what?
prices go back down maybe >>
Could be like my guns, they fell of the end of my boat last week and are lost forever!!!!
<< <i>It reminds me of how everyone went crazy trying to buy AR's before they were "banned." Now that it's obvious that no ban will be going into effect prices are coming way back down. >>
Actually, what I think is driving the price of ARs down is the lack of ammo. I remember when I bought my last one (that fell off the end of my boat last week - DARN!!), before the big price increase, there was a guy in front of me buying one. I asked him if he had any ammo or extra mags as they were tough to get. He asked the clerk if they had any ammo and he say, "No, been out for a long time." He bought it anyway and I wonder if he has ever shot it yet!
By the way, what makes you think they won't be banned? Sure, the main stream Bills appear to be DOA but an amendment can be attached to anything at the last moment and we won't know about it until it is a done deal!
Back to the OP, there are a lot of on-line places that appear to be reconciling orders to supply. Most of Goldmart's bars all say "Delayed" while other say "Notify Me." Same with ASE’s.
<< <i>FWIW, I went down to my old coin shop to say goodbye today. I am leaving the area and continuing my retirement elsewhere.
The place was a madhouse. After dumping metals like mad on Friday, the public was buying back today. While I was there an old customer came in and wanted to buy 25 10-ounce silver bars. First the man on the counter had to call their regular supplier to see if they could get the bars to cover the order. He called, and a screener asked who was calling. He identified himself, and the supplier said that he could place an order for them for delivery 30 days out.
The store's guy asked the supplier what was going on, and he was told that the supplier was performing "triage" on calls. Only good, large buyers were being allowed to order product. Small stores were being shut out.
So, when your local mom & pop store says that they don't have any product to sell during this dip, don't come whining to CU about it. >>
1. Supply limited or non-existent.
2. A free un-manipulated market responds appropriately to given cues.
3. Prices fall in the face of lack of availability in conjunction with greater demand.
Hmmm.
------
My question is this:
Have we fallen down a rabbit hole or have we stepped through the looking glass?
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
<< <i>shortages will subside as demand drops off and as producers catch up. >>
Hey dberry, I was reading an article yesterday (can't seem to find it now) but they were showing some of the miner's actual production costs, per ounce, and it seemed the margins were getting really slim between cost and spot compared to a few weeks ago.
Now, being like most good companies, I am sure they have gobs of money in the bank (ROFL) for operating cost. So, wouldn't it be prudent to hold off selling their production until prices rise or until that gob of cash is nearly gone, even using credit to keep from selling their production at these prices thus keeping supply down?
If so, what effect do you think this will have on demand? Will demand stay up, go up further and fall when people can’t find product to buy? Granted, this doesn’t account for any long-term supply contracts the Miners may have with the resellers (which could also have some de-escalation provisions in them to limit risk to the Miners).
Natural forces of supply and demand are the best regulators on earth.
<< <i>
<< <i>Common silver eagles and 90% rolls are selling for 30% to 35% premiums on eBay.
The price of the real thing is starting to seriously diverge from the price in the electronic marketplace. >>
Indeed! >>
Thats stupidity to pay those premiums!
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
The 1,000oz bars can be delivered to dealers in a few days; new, smaller bars need a few weeks to be manufactured and delivered. Voilà, in a month the "shortage" will be nothing more than a memory.
Why doesn't gold have the "shortage" problem silver perennially has? Probably because silver storage costs per dollar value of silver are much higher, so dealers keep less dollar value in silver in their vaults compared to gold. It makes more sense to order silver as needed, rather than keep it hanging around, especially since so much of the public is continually sending their silver to dealers who in turn ship it out for scrap.
(Just think of city streets clogged with a hundred thousand horses each generating 15 lbs of manure every day...)