Is this Trade dollar genuine or fake?

Wabbit2313

I welcome your opinions.

MsMorrisine

I can't decide... put it on eBay and see if they remove it.

Wabbit2313

<< <i>I can't decide... put it on eBay and see if they remove it. >>




Good one!

BustHalfBrian

Looks genuine, but definitely been polished

COALPORTER

I think its real

OriginalDan

Wait, didn't we just have a thread about this coin discussing whether it was a proof (it is not).

The coin is real. Known die marriage with major die crack on lower reverse under TRADE.

AUandAG

Geez, I can't imagine you having a fake, so I'll go with real


bob

crypto79

<< <i>Wait, didn't we just have a thread about this coin discussing whether it was a proof (it is not).

The coin is real. Known die marriage with major die crack on lower reverse under TRADE. >>



X2

stealer

<< <i>

<< <i>Wait, didn't we just have a thread about this coin discussing whether it was a proof (it is not).

The coin is real. Known die marriage with major die crack on lower reverse under TRADE. >>



X2 >>


X6


Wait what?

mbogoman

Looks real to me, but looks problematic. Not for my tastes...

Wabbit2313

Here is what eBay sent me. This is 3 times in a row now. I am not going to send coins like this in for grading, NEVER.

Those were the exact pictures.


eBay says.............................



Unfortunately, we had to remove your listing because of the following:

eBay may end any coin or currency-related listing if we believe that the sale of the item might create liability for the buyer, the seller, or pose a risk to the Community. Sometimes problematic auctions are identified by a group of members that comprise a Community Watch Group for currency listings.

As far as the exact problem with the item(s), the following was received from the Coin Community Watch group:

"190816343051 - Lustre is way off. This one is pitting due to a poorly made alloy. Denticles are poorly formed and rust is on the false die between them.

michiganboy

Fake

MsMorrisine

it does look like cheap aluminum from lawn chairs that has oxided. it's definately a weird color for it, in my inexperienced opinion. But I have no comment as to authenticity.

of course you weighed and measured it.... may as well confirm that.

Wabbit2313

<< <i>

of course you weighed and measured it.... may as well confirm that. >>



Yep. I still wonder if it is a circulated proof, and the reason why it looks funny. Experts here say no.

OriginalDan

It's highly unlikely a proof would have the large reverse die crack. Crypto gave you some great pricing guidance in the other thread, forget eBay and throw this coin up on the BST.

BillJones

I can't put my finger on it, but there is something funky about this piece that I don't like. Yet when I compare the details with a genuine piece, I can't come up with the difference. Here is an 1876 Trade Dollar that I know is genuine.

robertpr

<< <i>I can't decide... put it on eBay and see if they remove it. >>



Oh WOW...lmao!!!

My question would be, of course, why wouldn't it be in a PCGS or NGC slab if it were authentic?

crypto79

Here is the same die pair with the same die crack. This is a place holder in my collection as the coin looks just like the picture and I need to find an attractive one. Note as cleaned and ugly as this is it is EX NGC AU53???? and currently PCGS XF45.

crypto79

Here is my example of the common Rev Die of the Type 1/1 76p that is the same as Bills. There was a damage event to the Hub that broke many of the letters on the Rev. You can use the two to contrast.

Note the E in United, States & America along with the lack of a period after the word Fine. Many of the I & Ts also have parts clipped off. One of the reasons we know why the OP coin is not a proof is because the Proof die of that type is affected by the damaged Hub.
My Coin


A very very Rare Proof Type 1/1 76p (Blackhawk Collection)

Cougar1978

I believe it is fake: at best a body bag or details coin. A dealer / mentor I shared tables with year ago at shows told me years ago this is "the kind of problem coin you put down zero on your internal appraisal estimation form when arriving at the number your going to offer for an estate or collection. I don't even offer melt on this stuff."

My basis is the color seems off from a real piece. In addtion, the fields are extremely clean (for a trade dollar) except for the major obverse ding and something seems off with the detail. I have seen a collection a dealer has put together in an album of fake trade dollars (display purposes only, jokes about leaving it around his house for thieves to pickup) and this piece bears a strong resemblance - color, detail off.

I would not consider buying one of these raw in a New York minute. I find it unbelievable people would pay serious money for something like this on ebay if that happened. I would advise caution on raw stuff like this. A number of people in my coin club thinking they are going to buy raw coins off ebay (which is essentially sight unseen unless your looking at the coin at a show under a glass and 100 watt light) have been burned big time buying raw expensive coins thinking they are going to make a killing getting them slabbed.

Wabbit2313

<< <i>I believe it is fake: at best a body bag or details coin. A dealer / mentor I shared tables with year ago at shows told me years ago this is "the kind of problem coin you put down zero on your internal appraisal estimation form when arriving at the number your going to offer for an estate or collection. I don't even offer melt on this stuff."

My basis is the color seems off from a real piece. In addtion, the fields are extremely clean (for a trade dollar) except for the major obverse ding and something seems off with the detail. I have seen a collection a dealer has put together in an album of fake trade dollars (display purposes only, jokes about leaving it around his house for thieves to pickup) and this piece bears a strong resemblance - color, detail off.

I would not consider buying one of these raw in a New York minute. I find it unbelievable people would pay serious money for something like this on ebay if that happened. I would advise caution on raw stuff like this. A number of people in my coin club thinking they are going to buy raw coins off ebay (which is essentially sight unseen unless your looking at the coin at a show under a glass and 100 watt light) have been burned big time buying raw expensive coins thinking they are going to make a killing getting them slabbed. >>




I went to one of the local dealers a couple of years ago with a precise scale. Some of his Trade dollars were not even the correct weight? Some marked as Gem and $1500.00+ prices. He insisted I was wrong. At least when I sell one of these, I put a lifetime genuine guarantee on them. While possible to get the weight exact, most fakes are not, at least the ones I have seen.

So, buyer beware, not only on eBay. And get a gram scale at minimum!!!

Wabbit2313

Crypto, that Blackhawk 1876 is AWESOME!