Oooff! Just saw the grades online of my first submission...

Pinstriper

I feel like I just got punched in the stomach. The cards that I thought were worth so much have finally been graded and it ain't pretty.

My prized 1968 Topps Ryan was not graded due to "evidence of trimming". I bought this card at a sports card store back in the 70's. Could it have been tampered with? I guess its possible, but I never imagined.
75 Topps Aaron: 6.5 Gaaa!
61 Maris: 6 ...REALLY??? This card is really nice....crisp...centered. I always thought it was an 8 or 9.

I can't bring myself to list the rest. I am absolutely floored.

vladguerrero

...waiting for BBG advice in 3, 2, 1....

Piggs

Post em when you get them back and let's take a look. First submissions surprise many people. Hang in there.

Dodgerfanjohn

If you aren't looking at the cards under 10x magnification, you have no business sending them in to get graded.

OcTrAdInG

Surface issues, perhaps, on the Maris. Look for any type of surface wrinkle (especially on the back) or imperfection.

Measure the Ryan. If dimensions are correct and there are no obvious signs of trimming, I'd resubmit. Alternatively, you may want to submit to SGC for another professional opinion. Believe it or not, every SGC card that I have that has ever come back EOT (on 1st submission) from PSA eventually became graded so long as it met minimum size requirements. The grades were not always similar, but I do trust SGC's ability to recognize trim so long as the card is submitted to them raw. Then, you can crack and re-submit to PSA, if your really want the PSA card.

We've all been there. Set your expectations low for your next submission, and you may be pleasantly surprised. My own recent submissions seem to suggest to me that PSA is now paying more and more attention to surface, centering, and registration.

Dboneesq

<< <i>Post em when you get them back and let's take a look. First submissions surprise many people. Hang in there. >>

Dpeck100

This is one of the primary reasons why PSA on the label can help a card sell for big money.

orioles93

<< <i>Post em when you get them back and let's take a look. First submissions surprise many people. Hang in there. >>



This is true. Many people are very surprised when they see their first subs. I recommend buying a 10x magnifying loupe to look at your cards before sending them in. This will help a lot with seeing adge and corner wear, as well as surface issues that cant be seen by just looking at it.

handyman

Id try the ryan again. That card is very common miscut or a wierd cut like a dimond. Ive noticed its easy to say a miscut card is trimmed. Give it another try.

Mapleleaf

I've been there. Sent in my prized cards - the best I could find in 20 years of swap meets and got clobbered.
Occasionally they make a mistake but not usually. My Lemieux rookie that I paid $400 for 20 years ago (because it was so perfect) came back a 6.5.
I still haven't got a 10 on a raw card yet, a few 9's, lots of 8's.

cardbender

Most people over grade their own cards. You have to look at them with a discerning
eye to give them a fair assessment before sending them in. A loupe would help.

Sorry you feel you didn't get the grades you thought they were. That's happened
to many members here before so you just joined the club.

By your third or fourth sub. you'll get a better sense on what to look for when
screening your cards.

08HALA20

<< <i>

<< <i>Post em when you get them back and let's take a look. First submissions surprise many people. Hang in there. >>


>>




This is good advice. I am amazed at how folks here can see faults from a scan that I have a hard time seeing with card in hand.

My last sub had a Marino rookie came back a 6 thought for sure it was an 8 +

It had a wrinkle on front of card. Might be the Maris has one too.

Joe

stown

Sorry this happened to you but most 1st time submissions come in way below expectations. It takes experience since some flaws can easily be overlooked (ie a tiny surface crease, tilts, registration, etc).

Hang in there.

Pinstriper

I guess its all just part of the learning process. Thanks everyone for the encouragement and advice. I'll scan them when I get them back and get your feedback. It will be enlightening to see what you have to say.

Rudedawg

Yes, I support the "Post your Grades" and "Post Scans" advice. You'll learn a lot and get good input. Hang tough!

JustinsShoebox

You can only go up from here. My first submission was funny...it was 4 vintage cards - a 1954 Banks, 1956 Mantle and I think two Mathews cards. I put a minimum grade in for each of the cards that I wanted them to come back with. All of them came back "Minimum grade req". Obviously my idea about what the grades were turned out to be different than what they thought. Didn't take long for me to learn the process and nuances of PSA grading. In time so shall you.



<< <i>If you aren't looking at the cards under 10x magnification, you have no business sending them in to get graded. >>



Going to disagree with you here. I've had some of my best grades come from using my trained eye rather than 10x magnification.

Justin

Dpeck100

I may be in the minority but I just use my eyes and a lot of light.

MiniDuff

Eyes, light and a little magnification if I am not sure. Same with a micrometer if im not sure on the centering.

My first sub was the four cards you got with your cc membership. Sent in a griffey ud, jeter sp and a pair of 74 ryans. Was sure the first two were 10s and the second two were 9s. They came back 8, 8, 8 ,7. I was so upset that I didnt sub to PSA again for several years.
In hindsight, it was a pretty good sub and I'm lucky nothing was EOT, etc.

The truth is, very little is actually gradable and that can be a hard thing to get over. I cracked a vending case yesterday, 12,000 cards. 23 of them are going in. Thats it.

I've used everything from my own eyeballs and crappy light, to a loupe and honestly, I don't like high magnification. It is too easy to talk yourself out of grading a card because every card is flawed at 10x. Its the same principle that leads tons of folks here to trash high res scans people post of nice cards.

OcTrAdInG

<< <i> It is too easy to talk yourself out of grading a card because every card is flawed at 10x. Its the same principle that leads tons of folks here to trash high res scans people post of nice cards. >>



For me personally, it is rather easy to have overly high expectations for cards with sharp corners. Unfortunately, for a lot of my submissions, sharp corners alone don't determine final PSA grades, and neglecting what may be rather obvious can come at a cost.

On numerous occasions, I've added extra cards just prior to preparing my PSA submission. I've been pleasantly surprised with 8's and 9's, on cards that I originally thought worthy of only 6's and 7's. After examining the cards upon return from PSA, I've found that I neglected the overall presentation of the card (instead, focusing on corner wear).

totallyradd

I'm still learning. My first two submissions were of HOFers that my step dad had and my mom gave to me when he passed away. I just wanted them slabbed no matter what the grade was. I was getting graded cards on eBay and when I thought I had it all figured out I started buying raw cards that I examined at shows. Feeling they were all 6-7 range, I was upset when majority came back as 5's with some 6's involved.

I just bought a loupe on ebay, it's on it's way over from China (shoulda looked at the seller location, doh). I'm hoping it gets to me before the end of the month or I wont be submitting anything and I'll wait until the next good special comes around.

After my "true" first submission, I learned to take a step back, that not all your cards are not the grades you expect. I also found out I wasn't alone (thankfully) in feeling like getting burned after a submission.

Many people on this board have taught me a lot, and provided you stick around long enough, you're about to learn a lot too.

MiniDuff

It is easy to forget that humans are grading, not machines. Eye appeal matters. Rhythym matters too. Got a 9 in a run of 7s? Odds are its coming back an 8. The reverse can be true too. I am talking commons and cheaper cards for the most part.

BBG - yes, shooting for 10s on junk vending, in this case, 81 fleer. I've had really good luck on those in the past, once hitting 7 ryans on one sub for example. This case was a bit less friendly, but sometimes you get lucky. I'm also in the middle of ripping an 86 vending, at this point if I can grade 23 cards I am going to do a happy dance... wow is that crap, and a mad headache since they alternate up and down.

mygotta

I know i was disappointed in my first submission and have been apprehensive to send in anything again. So in that time, I learned a lot from the people on these boards and understood the grading process a lot better and also how to evaluate the cards more objectively. I have since only sent my second submission and currently waiting for the results. I have let go of expectations and hope for the best.

fur72

The first sub is a learning experience to everyone I think. Hang in there!

Boopotts

<< <i>If you aren't looking at the cards under 10x magnification, you have no business sending them in to get graded. >>



FWIW I think this is just terrible advice.

prthd

<< <i>It is easy to forget that humans are grading, not machines. Eye appeal matters. Rhythym matters too. Got a 9 in a run of 7s? Odds are its coming back an 8. The reverse can be true too. >>



This is spot on. 95% of my subs are Chrome/Finest type cards, and I will not send in a card unless its 50/50 50/50 centering. The only time I break this rule of thumb is say a gold refractor or something along those lines where its a rarer piece. Eye appeal is everything! As far as rhythym, I also agree with this. I just sent in 32 and I sat and looked over the order in which I wanted to sub them at least 20 times.

Good luck on your next sub.

Dave

prthd

<< <i>

<< <i>If you aren't looking at the cards under 10x magnification, you have no business sending them in to get graded. >>



FWIW I think this is just terrible advice. >>





Never used a loop though I have thought about it. My last sub yielded 13 10's out of the 15 cards submitted.

esquiresports

<< <i>I found an easy way to deal with this is to just look at your card(s) upside down. Your brain won't register it the same and you should be able to see any issues more clearly. >>



I haven't submitted cards in years but am thinking of sending a few in. This is a great tip that I don't recall reading before. Thanks!

One thing I still have from back in the day is an acrylic dome that nicely magnifies the card when placed under it. I think it's from Magnabrite and is 4x magnification, which seemed to be good to help show flaws without making every card look like it shouldn't be graded. Anyone else use something similar?

Dodgerfanjohn

<< <i>

<< <i>If you aren't looking at the cards under 10x magnification, you have no business sending them in to get graded. >>



FWIW I think this is just terrible advice. >>



Hmm maybe its me then. Its not the overall eyesight because I go in to the optomitrist each year. But theres corner flaws I can't see without magnification.

epatmythes

I only use a loupe for cards I evaluate and submit expecting to get 10's, everything else, eyes seem to work fine.

Even with the loupe, PSA still tells me I was wrong about 30% of the time

After all, it's an opinion. Slight touching on more than 1 corner, less than perfect centering, minor surface issues... the magnitude of any one of them, combined with the slightest of the others... can easily be the difference in one grader assigning anything from a 6 to an 8.

Over time, you'll find submissions with great disappointments... and others with unexpected surprises! If you do your best to honestly & thoroughly evaulate before you submit, it all evens out in the end!

Bosox1976

My "naked eye" subs have gone down by about a full grade... now I blow up a scan at 350 dpi and really study.... big difference for me (with better results than my loupe)...

purelyPSA

<< <i>

<< <i>If you aren't looking at the cards under 10x magnification, you have no business sending them in to get graded. >>



FWIW I think this is just terrible advice. >>



This is totally correct in my opinion.

It kind of reminds me a quote I read from a professional No Limit Hold 'Em player. A guy asked him about going all-in, and relayed to him that he always managed to go into the showdown with the better hand.

The pro responded that if you're always getting the better hand after you shove, you're not getting all in nearly enough. Same with cards: the smartest thing is to check EVERY sub that comes back, even if it's a 10, to figure out what passed and what not, and at what grade. If you're going that deeply to figure out every card, you'll get a huge smattering of 10s on your orders for modern, but you'll also be throwing back a crapload of cards that have a good chance of getting a 10 because you saw something incredibly minute that could very well either be overlooked or deemed not big enough to knock down a grade.

Use a loupe if there's something minute that may or may not be a flaw and you need a better look; otherwise knowing what to look for - and looking at the cards dispassionately and not hoping for a certain grade - and a good set of eyes and you'll be fine.

CDsNuts

Using anything less than 1500x magnification is throwing money away on grading.

Lee

itzagoner

there he goes being an auction house again.

cardbender

Mike, that's a great looking '73 Roberto card. How does the back look?
The front looks 8.5 to 9ish to me.

Bosox1976

Thanks guys -- probably an 8 with the t/b centering and the weak gold letters in his name. Back is clean though.

Didn't want to derail this thread though... just got glasses a couple of years ago, and with naked eye or glasses, I was still missing things. Am picking them up better with this method.