Can you say overpriced
frankhardy
Posts: 8,139 ✭✭✭✭✭
I am usually not one to be negative, and I really don't mean this to be a negative post. This is only meant to be truthful and to state my amazment.
How many of you get Larry Fritsch's catalog? I do, but I don't know why because I don't remember ever buying anything from him. Is this not the most overpriced dealer out there? Wow. I couldn't believe how overpriced his stuff is.
Here are some random examples.
1987 Topps Complete Set hand collated (stated condition is EXMT to NM mind you) - Regular price - $32.00; SPECIAL PURCHASE PRICE - $25.25
1987 Topps Factory Set - Regular price - $49.95; SPECIAL PURCHASE PRICE - $39.95
1985 Topps Complete Set - Regular price - $140; SPECIAL PURCHASE PRICE - $99.99
1990 Topps Factory Set - Regular price - $33.00; SPECIAL PURCHASE PRICE - $25.25
1958 Topps Mantle GD condition - $450 (I use this example because I have this set).
1958 Topps Ted Williams GD condition - $250
1970 Fleer World Series - ranging from $13 to $33. (I recently gave $2 each for a handful of Cardinals I needed)
1988-89 Fleer Basketball set - $175 (They usually go for around $50)
I could go on and on and on and on and one, especially his asking price for vintage singles (stars and commons).
I guess I am posting this thread (first of all) in amazement that a reputable dealer is still asking late 1980's BV for his cards. Secondly, I am wondering how they ever sell ANYTHING.
Again, this thread is not to throw stones at all. I realized Larry passed away a few years ago and I know he left an ENORMOUS collection to his family. I really just wonder how they sell anything at all with those prices.
How many of you get Larry Fritsch's catalog? I do, but I don't know why because I don't remember ever buying anything from him. Is this not the most overpriced dealer out there? Wow. I couldn't believe how overpriced his stuff is.
Here are some random examples.
1987 Topps Complete Set hand collated (stated condition is EXMT to NM mind you) - Regular price - $32.00; SPECIAL PURCHASE PRICE - $25.25
1987 Topps Factory Set - Regular price - $49.95; SPECIAL PURCHASE PRICE - $39.95
1985 Topps Complete Set - Regular price - $140; SPECIAL PURCHASE PRICE - $99.99
1990 Topps Factory Set - Regular price - $33.00; SPECIAL PURCHASE PRICE - $25.25
1958 Topps Mantle GD condition - $450 (I use this example because I have this set).
1958 Topps Ted Williams GD condition - $250
1970 Fleer World Series - ranging from $13 to $33. (I recently gave $2 each for a handful of Cardinals I needed)
1988-89 Fleer Basketball set - $175 (They usually go for around $50)
I could go on and on and on and on and one, especially his asking price for vintage singles (stars and commons).
I guess I am posting this thread (first of all) in amazement that a reputable dealer is still asking late 1980's BV for his cards. Secondly, I am wondering how they ever sell ANYTHING.
Again, this thread is not to throw stones at all. I realized Larry passed away a few years ago and I know he left an ENORMOUS collection to his family. I really just wonder how they sell anything at all with those prices.
Shane
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<< <i>LOL you dont mean it to be negative but throwing the stupid prices out there for examples? Ok I dont mean to be negative either but how does 707 sell anything? Im not going to throw stupid prices out there because again I dont want to be negative
LOL!
Seriously, it is posts like this that has made my visits and posts here few and far between. This place used to be a fantastic place where we could discuss the hobby. Yes, overpriced dealers are part of the hobby. All I meant about me not trying to be negative is that some people live for negativity and post things for that reason ONLY. That was not my intent.
I'm not going to say I won't ever post here again, but I am seriously thinking about it.
Shane
email bcmiller7@comcast.net
Years ago I used to go to furniture auctions. After a while, I knew who the dealers were. If I was only bidding against dealers I knew I would win because they would stop at the wholesale price. So I got the piece of furniture for a small percentage above wholesale. Because of this forum, ebay, the internet, VCP, etc. we are all dealers now and know not to bid too much above the wholesale price and eventually, the card we want will come along at the right price. Fritsch, Young, et. al. are selling to a retail market and are willing to wait until a retail buyer comes their way.
<< <i>I'm sure Kit Young and Wheat's prices are similar. They're a retail outfit, have a retail outlook and that's what retail charges.
Years ago I used to go to furniture auctions. After a while, I knew who the dealers were. If I was only bidding against dealers I knew I would win because they would stop at the wholesale price. So I got the piece of furniture for a small percentage above wholesale. Because of this forum, ebay, the internet, VCP, etc. we are all dealers now and know not to bid too much above the wholesale price and eventually, the card we want will come along at the right price. Fritsch, Young, et. al. are selling to a retail market and are willing to wait until a retail buyer comes their way. >>
Very thoughtful post.
I guess I had not thought of it in that way. But how many retail buyers are there out there? I certainly am not one, yet I got a catalog in the mail. Wouldn't you say that most people that get their catalogs are collectors like me that don't pay retail?
Shane
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<< <i>LOL you dont mean it to be negative but throwing the stupid prices out there for examples? Ok I dont mean to be negative either but how does 707 sell anything? Im not going to throw stupid prices out there because again I dont want to be negative
LOL!
Seriously, it is posts like this that has made my visits and posts here few and far between. This place used to be a fantastic place where we could discuss the hobby. Yes, overpriced dealers are part of the hobby. All I meant about me not trying to be negative is that some people live for negativity and post things for that reason ONLY. That was not my intent.
I'm not going to say I won't ever post here again, but I am seriously thinking about it. >>
Please Frank, I will add your name to the long list of people who "threaten" to never post again like anyone gives a rats a$$ one way or another. Discuss anything you want! Dont let the fact that I thought your post was absolutely hilarious drive you away!
http://www.unisquare.com/store/brick/
Ralph
Do you wonder how Levi sells cards at HIS prices? He asks those prices. And people that are not involved in the hobby on a daily basis pay those prices. The same way that people buy coins and stamps from the Sunday paper magazine, Shop-at-Home or Home Shopping Network. They don't know that there are other avenues and even if they did, they're not armed with enough resources to make, what most of us consider, an educated decision. We're comparing the general public to ourselves. And by doing so, we are giving the public far too much credit. Many on these boards, being more informed than a vast majority of the casual collector, still make mistakes or purchase things for far more than they could get them for elsewhere. Accordingly, there are some here that know where to buy computer accessories, car parts, furniture and other items at huge discounts versus what most of us typically pay. It is just the nature of the beast...
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<< <i>LOL you dont mean it to be negative but throwing the stupid prices out there for examples? Ok I dont mean to be negative either but how does 707 sell anything? Im not going to throw stupid prices out there because again I dont want to be negative
LOL!
Seriously, it is posts like this that has made my visits and posts here few and far between. This place used to be a fantastic place where we could discuss the hobby. Yes, overpriced dealers are part of the hobby. All I meant about me not trying to be negative is that some people live for negativity and post things for that reason ONLY. That was not my intent.
I'm not going to say I won't ever post here again, but I am seriously thinking about it. >>
Please Frank, I will add your name to the long list of people who "threaten" to never post again like anyone gives a rats a$$ one way or another. Discuss anything you want! Dont let the fact that I thought your post was absolutely hilarious drive you away! >>
It wasn't just your post. It's been a bunch of things like that over the recent past.
I really wasn't threatening. I am seriously thinking about it. I already have stayed away to an extent because I hardly ever post.
Ralph,
So, I guess you are saying that guys like 707, Kit Young, and Fritsch are almost exclusively marketing to those kind of buyers and not to informed collectors? Seems to me that they are marketing to a smaller group of people hoping to get that astronomical price.
Shane
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<< <i>LOL you dont mean it to be negative but throwing the stupid prices out there for examples? Ok I dont mean to be negative either but how does 707 sell anything? Im not going to throw stupid prices out there because again I dont want to be negative
LOL!
Seriously, it is posts like this that has made my visits and posts here few and far between. This place used to be a fantastic place where we could discuss the hobby. Yes, overpriced dealers are part of the hobby. All I meant about me not trying to be negative is that some people live for negativity and post things for that reason ONLY. That was not my intent.
I'm not going to say I won't ever post here again, but I am seriously thinking about it. >>
Please Frank, I will add your name to the long list of people who "threaten" to never post again like anyone gives a rats a$$ one way or another. Discuss anything you want! Dont let the fact that I thought your post was absolutely hilarious drive you away! >>
It wasn't just your post. It's been a bunch of things like that over the recent past.
I really wasn't threatening. I am seriously thinking about it. I already have stayed away to an extent because I hardly ever post. >>
Shane, Ive never had an issue with you before and dont dislike your posts but again I thought your thread was funny and responded.
So your seriously thinking of staying away from cu and hardly ever post well hey thats cool, I raked some leaves the other day and drank beers afterwards!
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<< <i>LOL you dont mean it to be negative but throwing the stupid prices out there for examples? Ok I dont mean to be negative either but how does 707 sell anything? Im not going to throw stupid prices out there because again I dont want to be negative
LOL!
Seriously, it is posts like this that has made my visits and posts here few and far between. This place used to be a fantastic place where we could discuss the hobby. Yes, overpriced dealers are part of the hobby. All I meant about me not trying to be negative is that some people live for negativity and post things for that reason ONLY. That was not my intent.
I'm not going to say I won't ever post here again, but I am seriously thinking about it. >>
Please Frank, I will add your name to the long list of people who "threaten" to never post again like anyone gives a rats a$$ one way or another. Discuss anything you want! Dont let the fact that I thought your post was absolutely hilarious drive you away! >>
It wasn't just your post. It's been a bunch of things like that over the recent past.
I really wasn't threatening. I am seriously thinking about it. I already have stayed away to an extent because I hardly ever post. >>
Shane, Ive never had an issue with you before and dont dislike your posts but again I thought your thread was funny and responded.
So your seriously thinking of staying away from cu and hardly ever post well hey thats cool, I raked some leaves the other day and drank beers afterwards! >>
I've never had an issue with you either. I guess we can call it a truce. I still need to rake / mow my leaves, but I can't because we still have a few more pecans to pick up. I don't drink beer, but I drink lots of water. PM me your address and I will send you some genuine western KY pecans!
Shane
<< <i>Don't worry about perkdog. 14k posts and I don't think he even collects cards. And his title should probably be changed from "Vintage Football Collector" to "Red Sox Fan Since October 2004". >>
Fritsch cards business plan is to own cheap and sell to those seeking something specific who pays more, or suckers who don't know. Based on recent experience here, I am about to get slammed. But unfortunately for you, you're looking in the mirror.
<< <i>I had someone rip on me on a previous string, stating that 'Alts are trolls and have no luck with girls and got beat up a lot when little and live in mom's basement and suck their thumb and etc etc. Not sure though if that was a definition of a 'troll' or a person with thousands and thousands of messages. No offense to anyone (perkdog) but I think the man has you.
Fritsch cards business plan is to own cheap and sell to those seeking something specific who pays more, or suckers who don't know. Based on recent experience here, I am about to get slammed. But unfortunately for you, you're looking in the mirror.
LOL yes he got me good there, i thought it was funny! See I can take a joke no problem, unlike you who apparently lost sleep over me accusing you of being some loser who probably got banned! Also I didnt even attack back at Levi and talk crap about how STUPID he looks at shows wearing those queer hats! Its all in fun, this isnt real life where a guy like you would probably get his teeth kicked in on a regular basis for opening your mouth
<< <i>"Red Sox Fan Since October 2004" >>
Bosox1976
Talk about your profit margin!
Joe
<< <i>If you REALLY want to get pi$$ed off about Fritsch's pricing. Larry once told me that some years Topps GAVE him the stuff from the year before if he was willing to pay for the shipping, once he ended up getting a BOXCAR full of trading cards!
Talk about your profit margin!
Joe >>
Wow, I did not know that.
Shane
<< <i>I'm sure Kit Young and Wheat's prices are similar. They're a retail outfit, have a retail outlook and that's what retail charges.
Years ago I used to go to furniture auctions. After a while, I knew who the dealers were. If I was only bidding against dealers I knew I would win because they would stop at the wholesale price. So I got the piece of furniture for a small percentage above wholesale. Because of this forum, ebay, the internet, VCP, etc. we are all dealers now and know not to bid too much above the wholesale price and eventually, the card we want will come along at the right price. Fritsch, Young, et. al. are selling to a retail market and are willing to wait until a retail buyer comes their way. >>
What people in this world would know enough to find Fristch's website to buy cards or to order a catalog but not know anything about buying on ebay?
-The real money is made on the 60's and 70's cards. Thus, they can "wait" for their prices on the 80's and 90's stuff.
It's not like your typical card shop owner that puts $50 or $100 k into inventory and needs to turn it (with rent, utilities, staff expenses, etc). The typical card shop owner can't wait for Joe Public to buy a $29.95 set of Topps cards.
-There are some people that do buy retail.....i.e. when I was 13 or 14, my grandmother bought me a 1992 Fleer Ultra Frank Thomas for Christmas (along with some other things). The person buying cards for their grandson isn't going to be on ebay or up to date on book values. I wonder how many of those $29.95 and $39.95 sets end up as gifts.
-It seems like some of the pricing is variable. I think years ago his 84 Fleer update set was something crazy....$550, $650. The old late 80's beckett value. But some of the prices do go down. He's also had some coupons in the front.
If you got warehouses full of Topps sets for pennies, would you be eager to blow them out? Probably not. He must have been a millionaire many times over.
Didn't Fritsch get most of the 72 Topps football hi number boxes and cases? I think I remember reading that. Those were, $6,000 a box? That's just one little set. And his cost basis was virtually nothing on it.
Something like 85 or 87 Topps is going to look like peanuts compared to that. It'd be funny and kind of ironic if some of the modern sets get rare, and in 5 or 10 years, he's one of the few sources with a particular set.
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Working on.........
Tony Dorsett Master Set
1977 Topps Mexican FB (raw)
1957 Topps FB Set (raw or graded)
I know I'm a little late to the party but I couldn't agree with you more about dealers overpricing cards. In fact, I recently posted a similar thread and it also didn't go well. People telling me to stop whining. Lol. Some damn near rude people on this forum, if they don't like it then they don't have to respond.
I have known about Fritsch Cards for a while, but this summer I stumbled across a specialized piece that only they had. It was something I had never seen and they had multiple copies. I did my first purchase and was happy with it. They send me a catalog now every couple months and I would agree that my first instinct on seeing their prices for most items was "no way in #$#(" However, they have a lot of obscure or special things that really appealed to me. I got a 1895 Mayo Plug reprint set, an N162 reprint set and some supplies a few months later. The price for those, IMO, was acceptable.
It's true they are evidently able to find enough buyers at their prices. They run a lot of sales, specials and "limited offers" which I'm sure adds appeal to certain buyers. As a regular eBay'er, I knew what was "overpriced" and what was a "good deal". Mind you, I won't be picking up a 1987 Topps Set from them any time soon, though
1991 & 1992 Fleer Pro Visions
1952 Topps
of the issues featured an article about Larry Fritsch and his collecting and how he became a full time
card dealer. In that article he stated he paid $38 for a 12,000 card vending case direct from Topps. This was in 1974.
He also said he was Topps' largest buyer. At 660 cards in the set and with good collation, you could sort out
close to 18 sets out of one case. That would put his cost at roughly $2.10 (at 1974's money) for each set.
I think Larry's done pretty well over the years with his foresight in this hobby.
Is he overpriced? Sure. But he's an upper level full retail seller. It doesn't appear that's he's ever needed the money to have to
sell at wholesale levels in order to pay his bills. He's a buy and hold type of seller.
Personally I think it's a mistake for the 1980's and '90's overproduced junk, but his son Jeff, who now runs
the family business, seems to be sticking with the same business philosophy today.
That said, is it perplexing sometimes? Absolutely.
For sure the more overpriced something is the longer it most likely will sit.
No business can aford no business...so whatever the pricing model they choose must work for them.
If thier products are vastly overpriced they don't have to sell as much. An example from above...
I know very little about coin collecting. I bought a few coins sets (gifts for my son) from a TV show on a major network.
I believe HSN. Good deal...probably not but I don't know. Do I care? not really. Could I have bought cheaper elsewhere?
probably. But it was convenient and I didn't have to do any research. Other dummies were buying the same thing also.
On cards the other hand...I have vcp and experience. Ebay has become a resevoir of BIN at up to 4x or more VCP.
I am certainly willing to pay above going price for something of higher quality or scarcity. Especialy if it's something I want.
I can't fault someone willing to pay retail. If it was so important to them they would research and find a better price.
As a business selling model I like 4SC. Start a card at the super duper grand slam price. Hope some 'just gotta have it collector' pulls
the trigger and let it stay for several weeks and then gradualy lower until it sells.
With their huge inventory nothing just sits there forever. Many of the other gig ebay seller have followed this nodel.
1948-76 Topps FB Sets
FB & BB HOF Player sets
1948-1993 NY Yankee Team Sets
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LOL yes he got me good there, i thought it was funny! See I can take a joke no problem, unlike you who apparently lost sleep over me accusing you of being some loser who probably got banned! Also I didnt even attack back at Levi and talk crap about how STUPID he looks at shows wearing those queer hats! Its all in fun, this isnt real life where a guy like you would probably get his teeth kicked in on a regular basis for opening your mouth
LMFAO!
Perkdog, one of many good hunorous quotes in this thread by you, LOL
Second of all, everybody has the right to pay or not pay for an asking price! That is the American way!
Third of all, everybody has the right to complain as in this thread! That is the American way!
Now that that's settled, to the complainers, there are some positives to the high dollar sellers.
That is one of the ways that prices are driven upwards and I think we all want to see our inventory rise in value.
Also, I use to love having the same product as WhereTheyAin't. My product could be over SMR or VCP and still be much cheaper than
the other listing.
I also agree that, as a seller, there are basiclly 2 plans of attack. Quanity or Quality. Sell lots of items with a low markup or sell a few items with a high markup. When you figure out how to sell lots of items at a large markup with a low startup cost, please let me know!
We are also not alone with this situation. In just about every market, the same goes on. I do not buy my grocies at Albertsons because I can get the same at Walmart cheaper, but Albertsons still has plenty of customers, as does the Fritch's, Wheretheyain'ts, etc...
<< <i>In 2 weeks it will be the 5 anniversary of Larry's death. >>
Thank you, Captain Killjoy.
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<< <i>In 2 weeks it will be the 5 anniversary of Larry's death. >>
Thank you, Captain Killjoy. >>
Dodgers collection scans | Brett Butler registry | 1978 Dodgers - straight 9s, homie
<< <i>He's a buy and hold type of seller. >>
<< <i>Wow............This has gone awhile with no mention of Deans Cards. He makes 707 look like bargain basement sometimes.
+100
The only thing about Mickey's post I might take issue with is the 'sometimes'.
-CDs Nuts, 1/20/14
*1956 Topps baseball- 97.4% complete, 7.24 GPA
*Clemente basic set: 85.0% complete, 7.89 GPA
I'm sorry I offended you. Yes, the word I needed to use was "ALWAYS". I'm wondering if Levi is mad at this........someone beating him.......and badly for the title of most overpriced.
<< <i>Walter,
I'm sorry I offended you. Yes, the word I needed to use was "ALWAYS". I'm wondering if Levi is mad at this........someone beating him.......and badly for the title of most overpriced.
Well at least Levi has the most overgraded cards at High End prices!
I actually did not want to go there; but that was funny.
<< <i>Perkdog,
I actually did not want to go there; but that was funny.