So I went on a silver hunt with a pocket full of cash to see what I could find today,
piecesofme
Posts: 6,669 ✭✭✭
and there was nothing available worth buying, not even Christmas rounds...NOTHING worth buying. No ASE's, no Maples, no 1, 5, 10 or even 100 oz bars, I mean nothing!
Went to 4 local B&M's and even a Cash 4 Gold storefront and every one of them did not have silver, only 1 had some 90%, but only about $15 face.
So what do I take from this?
The cynic in me says, well, prices are down so the B&M's are up to their old tricks and they pulled their stuff back behind the counter til prices rise again, then suddenly, like magic, they'll have plenty.
All said they have been very busy due to people (customers) being on one side of the political arena or the other (I know, tread carefully) and placing their bets with the metal. So that's a possibility of what's going on.
The optimist in me says, if that is a big IF, the dealers are in fact telling me the truth that the reason they are out due to actual sales, then that means available product is drying up due to the higher demand, which in theory is supposed to make the value go up, right?
These are my 3 trains of thought on my advenrure today that yielded nothing. What do you think?
Went to 4 local B&M's and even a Cash 4 Gold storefront and every one of them did not have silver, only 1 had some 90%, but only about $15 face.
So what do I take from this?
The cynic in me says, well, prices are down so the B&M's are up to their old tricks and they pulled their stuff back behind the counter til prices rise again, then suddenly, like magic, they'll have plenty.
All said they have been very busy due to people (customers) being on one side of the political arena or the other (I know, tread carefully) and placing their bets with the metal. So that's a possibility of what's going on.
The optimist in me says, if that is a big IF, the dealers are in fact telling me the truth that the reason they are out due to actual sales, then that means available product is drying up due to the higher demand, which in theory is supposed to make the value go up, right?
These are my 3 trains of thought on my advenrure today that yielded nothing. What do you think?
To forgive is to free a prisoner, and to discover that prisoner was you.
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Keep in mind silver dropped a buck between Thursday and Friday so I would also not be selling too much. I went looking for some 2012 ASE's and some 2012 Maple Leaf 1 oz'ers. Just had told the wife that this was a waste of time (40 mile drive and 5 admission which was not to bad for a Kansas gun show) and decided to ask a dealer that I had dealt with in the past if he had any bullion and ASE's hidden away and he sure did. Told me the show was a flop so he needed to make some cash so he sold me two rolls of ASE's at 660 per. One roll of 12's like i needed and a mixed roll.
I was just getting ready to drive to Omaha to pay the 720/roll price (210 miles one way) and now glad I stalled on that trip.......
So the dealers have it with them they are just not wanting to sell at such a low premium. Most BM's around here charge 5 over for eagles, maples, englehard and Cuck's.
Keep up the hunt Rich
Tom
I can't even get $1 over for my Maples around here. That tells me alot on what the dealer profit margin is if they're selling for Spot +$5 in your neck of the woods.
The big show here is this weekend, I'll be loaded with cash just in case there is a good buy to be had. But I suspect the premiums will be a bit higher than usual.
I picked up 5 generic one oz. silver bars for 70¢ over spot. (they did have more)
They also have the new JM bars at $1.65 over and Englhard for $1.45 over.
Their 2012 silver eagles are $2.75 over.
Very fair prices I think.
Got quoins?
<< <i>Most BM's around here charge 5 over for eagles, maples, englehard and Cuck's
I can't even get $1 over for my Maples around here. That tells me alot on what the dealer profit margin is if they're selling for Spot +$5 in your neck of the woods. >>
you still have all those? What was it, a hundred of them?
Anyway, the charge around here is usually about five dollars over for ASE. A buck over (at most) on Libertads. Maples anywhere from two to four over.
<< <i>I went in the local shop that does the most bullion in the area.
I picked up 5 generic one oz. silver bars for 70¢ over spot. (they did have more)
They also have the new JM bars at $1.65 over and Englhard for $1.45 over.
Their 2012 silver eagles are $2.75 over.
Very fair prices I think. >>
70 cents over on .999? Geez if I could get that price here I'd be buying hand over fist. Engelhard bars for $1.45 over too seems like an excellent price.
Typical dealer premium here on generic .999 is anywhere from $4-5, $5-7 on maples. Even on 100oz bars you'd be lucky to only pay $2.25 over.
<< <i>
<< <i>I went in the local shop that does the most bullion in the area.
I picked up 5 generic one oz. silver bars for 70¢ over spot. (they did have more)
They also have the new JM bars at $1.65 over and Englhard for $1.45 over.
Their 2012 silver eagles are $2.75 over.
Very fair prices I think. >>
70 cents over on .999? Geez if I could get that price here I'd be buying hand over fist. Engelhard bars for $1.45 over too seems like an excellent price.
Typical dealer premium here on generic .999 is anywhere from $4-5, $5-7 on maples. Even on 100oz bars you'd be lucky to only pay $2.25 over. >>
Wow...five to seven on Maples! Unheard of locally.
yep, still have most fo them, not going to give them away not being able to get at least $1 over lol. And I really don't want to risk selling them on eBay.
<< <i>you still have all those? What was it, a hundred of them?
yep, still have most fo them, not going to give them away not being able to get at least $1 over lol. And I really don't want to risk selling them on eBay. >>
seems you either make a killing there or get reamed. Other than key date Libertads, I don't do any bullion sales there.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>Where do the B&Ms get their inventory? Over the counter from J6P? Maybe there no sellers as the public is much more loathe to sell at a loss than the dealers. >>
The smaller shops most likely have to buy over the counter. A shop that does more business could belong to Coin Net or CCE and list their buy/sell offers there.
A shop that does volume business could have accounts with the Mints authorized buyers such as A-Mark or Dillon Gage. It also speeds things up to have a Brinks distriibution center in your town so after you order and make the bank transfer you drive over and pick up your green boxes of silver eagles and other bulk bullion.
Got quoins?
<< <i>Physical holders don't like the paper price. When they do, more inventory will be available. >>
Really? Someone should relay that to APMEX, PROVIDENT, SILVERTOWNE or, heavens forbid eBay which currently has 737 active auction style listings for 1 oz silver bars...not BIN
<< <i>
<< <i>Physical holders don't like the paper price. When they do, more inventory will be available. >>
Really? Someone should relay that to APMEX, PROVIDENT, SILVERTOWNE or, heavens forbid eBay which currently has 737 active auction style listings for 1 oz silver bars...not BIN
Referring to those that do pull it off the shelf as noted by the OP. Ebayers are stuck once they get bids, unless they want to pay the bid FVF for cancelling. The big bullion players play right through price swings - some days peanuts some days shells.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Physical holders don't like the paper price. When they do, more inventory will be available. >>
Really? Someone should relay that to APMEX, PROVIDENT, SILVERTOWNE or, heavens forbid eBay which currently has 737 active auction style listings for 1 oz silver bars...not BIN
Referring to those that do pull it off the shelf as noted by the OP. Ebayers are stuck once they get bids, unless they want to pay the bid FVF for cancelling. The big bullion players play right through price swings - some days peanuts some days shells. >>
True...but some of us don't do businesses with B&M stores, including myself. The OP may be correct in assuming, that the B&M's he visits, may be waiting for an up tick. But you know the saying about assuming. FYI, there are not many eBay 1 oz silver auctions, that go for less than $5 over spot. A majority are in the $6 -$8 over spot range for the common stuff.
<< <i>Bought a bunch over the last 5 days. My indicators turned positive last week. >>
P-Me is my indicator.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
<< <i>Bought a bunch over the last 5 days. My indicators turned positive last week. >>
I made a medium sized purchase late last night, but mainly to hedge a recent sale. Still sitting on a bunch of fiat since I think we're still header lower in the short term.
<< <i>and there was nothing available worth buying, not even Christmas rounds...NOTHING worth buying. No ASE's, no Maples, no 1, 5, 10 or even 100 oz bars, I mean nothing!
Went to 4 local B&M's and even a Cash 4 Gold storefront and every one of them did not have silver, only 1 had some 90%, but only about $15 face.
So what do I take from this?
The cynic in me says, well, prices are down so the B&M's are up to their old tricks and they pulled their stuff back behind the counter til prices rise again, then suddenly, like magic, they'll have plenty.
All said they have been very busy due to people (customers) being on one side of the political arena or the other (I know, tread carefully) and placing their bets with the metal. So that's a possibility of what's going on.
The optimist in me says, if that is a big IF, the dealers are in fact telling me the truth that the reason they are out due to actual sales, then that means available product is drying up due to the higher demand, which in theory is supposed to make the value go up, right?
These are my 3 trains of thought on my advenrure today that yielded nothing. What do you think? >>
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So this morning, silver is up to $32. Has the situation changed in 2 days?
<< <i>So this morning, silver is up to $32. Has the situation changed in 2 days? >>
That must have happened when I blinked
<< <i>Where do the B&Ms get their inventory? Over the counter from J6P? Maybe there no sellers as the public is much more loathe to sell at a loss than the dealers. >>
What people fail to realize is that lower prices often brings out larger BUYERS!
When silver was "cheap" we had to adjust our bid to bring in the disgruntled sellers and add to the ask to protect against inventory reduction.
I did not EVER "sell based on what I bought"
I ALWAYS made a market both buy and sell and tried to stay competitive and well stocked in bullion. It worked for me.
<< <i>
<< <i>So this morning, silver is up to $32. Has the situation changed in 2 days? >>
That must have happened when I blinked
Yes, no doubt the market is volatile.
Today is Saturday so the price should remain steady at its current $32.50-$32.60 until late Sunday afternoon.
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My question was directed to piecesof me regarding whether or not the availability of silver for purchase in his area ( we see that the situation is not universal) had changed as a result of the uptick.
Did the nefarious B+Ms bring out the self same ingots and rounds from the backroom that they had previously denied having because the price was down?
Were they genuinely depleted by the rush of buyers during the downtick ?
Did new sellers come in and re-stock them with new stuff?
Or did nothing happen at all and the situation is as it was on Monday?
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I think that the question itself is difficult if not impossible to completely answer but I can certainly appreciate the OP's desire to 'see behind the curtain' and collectively perhaps we as a group can help him. I thought that was why he started this thread in the first place.
Feel free to give a report of what happened in your neck of the woods.
I'll be wearing a bright yellow Steelers hat with the logo staring you in the face if anyone wants to introduce themself.