Values for complete baseball sets needed

1954

Last month I had a client come into my office that has complete sets dating from 1950-1971 in baseball. He told me that the sets were in very nice condition and that he had bought them in an auction back in the early 90's. I asked him to bring in the sets for me to review and I would let him know the value. A week later he started bring in the sets and to my shock most of the sets were all in nrmt-mt condition with many mint cards thrown in. The sets were purchased from the Copeland collection. My question is this, if he sells the sets is it best to sell the sets raw to other collectors to keep the Copeland collection intact or bust the sets by grading it out? Below are a list of sets that I have seen and that might be purchased in the next month or so.

1950 Bowman nrmt/mt
1951 Bowman nrmt/mt with the Mantle card grading a solid 6 due to centering and Mays 7.
1953 Topps nrmt to nrmt/mt with about 7 cards that would grade 9.
1953 Bowman Color nrmt to nrmt/mint do to centering alone. Mantle is a PSA 5.
1957 Topps nrmt
1958 Topps nrmt to nrmt/mint
1961 Topps nrmt/mint
1968 Topps MINT
1969 Topps MINT
1970 Topps Mint
1971 Topps nrmt/mint to mint- The Munson and Ryan are 6 quality due to centering but a ton of mint high numbers. Last card in the set will 8/9.

I want to make sure I offer the right price to him because he is a client of mine and I dont want to cheat him. On the other hand I don't want to over pay for these. I realize that it is pretty hard to make an offer on a set without seeing these but a general idea is what I am looking for.

Thanks for any input and advice.

Shane

Topps29

Wow, Shane this is great news on the possibility in acquiring these sets! Will the sets be kept in your collection, sold as is or broken up?

1954

I don't think he is going to sell the 1953 Topps set as it is perfect. I think he is going to sell the 1961 and up sets to me if he sells at all. I would probably keep the 71 Topps set and for sure sell the rest. I don't want to over pay for the sets but want to pay him above "book" due to the condition so he feels good about the transaction. Trying to figure out what that number should be.

Shane

Cakes

Not sure how much help it will be but I love to look at the sets this seller has on ebay, maybe he is a member here?

Text

Alfonz24

On the sets you are going to flip, maybe work out a commission rate of the final sale price.

jeff8877

How about....

Take a shot at the average grade of set...if it is NM, then look up the VCP price for that set in a grade 7. Deduct $5 per card for grading fees and you have a represenative value.

Good Luck

Jeff

1954

Jeff,
That is a very good idea. I am really interested in the 1971 Topps set for my collection. I counted around two cards per page that would not grade a PSA 8. What is a rough value of an all PSA 8 set from this year? The 1969 Topps set is totally crisp and mint.

Shane

mattinglymint23

Re: Are you sure you want to price the set as if it was a psa 8 set?
VCP on 71 topps psa 8 complete set was in 20k range last time I looked, maybe more.
Would make more sense to pay a premium in the 4k NM comp set price in Beckett.

Either way I am envious of your opportunity - I eat sleep and crap 71 sets these days and would love a chance at a pick up like that. Good luck!

1954

I offered $10000 for the 1969, 1970 and 1971 today and so I think I will be picking that up next week. My thought was the 71 set was $4000 too so we are on the same page. Do you think $3000 for 69 and $3000 for 70 sounds right? Thanks for your input.

Shane

mattinglymint23

3 k for no sounds right on 69
Could make a case for 2k on the 70 nm but if anything the premium will lock in the deal

Keep me in mind on the 71's if you break it


---
I like jeff's idea
VCP for 7's is 7600
752 x 5 = 3760
Net is 3840
If he doesn't take that give me his number

ShreveBo

This post was really interesting to me. I was talking to a national dealer today about some Dodgers cards I need & we started talking about the boards. He reads the boards but doesn't post. He found this post interesting, because he knows you from your days in Arkansas, Shane.......he told me you grade a ton of stuff & bid in all the big auction houses, especially Heritage in Dallas where you live.

So I did some research & you're pretty active on the set registry page, heck, you're practically a lap dog for the big boys posting over there.

So you know exactly what these cards should be worth....so why would you ask us lowly collectors what these are worth when according to a longtime national dealer you've been doing this for over ten years?

I'm interested in your thinking behind this, do tell.....

1954

Well not really sure how to take that comment, but I have made many high grade sets over the years. I have put together almost every Topps set made, however I have never bought a complete set in this grade. I was hoping someone that has bought a high grade complete set could tell me what the value was before I purchased it. I have put together some very nice 1950's Topps sets by buying four or five mid grade to nrmt sets and have merged them to make one higher end. If you saw the sets you would understand. The collector does not have 13 complete sets in the nrmt condition range which sells for book in some major auction house. He has nrmt/mt to mint condition which rarely is seen in raw form.
This is my purpose in asking for some help. Would love to know who you are.

Shane

ShreveBo

If you have put together every Topps set made, many in high grade, you should know the answer to the question you asked. That or call your buddies at the auction houses.

The psychology behind this board is really interesting. Kinda like gambling, I watch these people at The Horseshoe all the time, gamblin Grannies, high rollers who want people to look at them, just like a casino this place has all types!

Have a great day!

CDsNuts

Seems like a random attack, the guy is just asking our opinions on value. I've spent several hundred thousand on vintage in my life and I don't know what these sets would bring. And I certainly wouldn't want the auction houses breathing down my neck which they would certainly do if he hinted about buying these sets.

dennis07

1954, I think this is a great thread. Don't let one poster derail it. If we can't come to this board seeking opinions on baseball cards what is the purpose of the board?
I for one am fascinated that this opportunity is out there and if I ever walked into a similar opportunity I'd be better prepared having experienced it on this board.

lostdart58

I cannot help but think that you are overgrading these sets!

Why do I have feeling that if you were to actually have say the entire 1950 Bowman set graded that the grades would be closer to PSA 5 or PSA 6 at best.

A set of 69 Topps in all PSA9s??? I doubt it.

...but you are the one buying and then selling, so not my business.

Good luck!

Nice find , by the way.

mattinglymint23

@1954
Like the thread as well. I'm active in 71's and 75's so if you find yourself with hi grade inventory to move happy to talk.
Threads like this are part of the reason for being on the board. efficient markets require price transparency and a indication of active participants.

General comment: Top/active stock traders rely on counterparts to participate in market making and indicative pricing, why can't active hi-grade card traders?

1954

LostDart- Totally agree with you about being sceptical about the condition of these sets or perhaps my grading capability. This is the reason why I have asked the board for some help in what a nrmt/mt set would sell for raw. Remember these sets came from one of the top collectors 30 years ago. They are pack fresh and will grade out very nicely. Thanks to those who have offered some advice on values on sets that they are familiar with.

Shane

Topps29

The sets Shane is referring about are ALL high grades sets. The cards exhibit "Pack Fresh" appearance, white borders , not antique white(53T, 53B, Vintage Basketball), great eye appeal with cards being centered the same and glossy color. Paying PSA 7 prices for a high end raw set would not be a bad investment and a steal in this case. These deals don't come around very often and one must seize the opportunity if the funds are available!

Mickey71

1st off....Shane can ask what he wants. That's what the board is for.

As to the value of these sets..........If they are truly strong and well above NM and in some cases....entire runs of NM-MT and better/////////we are all pricing way too low.

As to the early Bowman stuff.........I would be prepared to pay well above PSA 7 price. Plus those sets are not huge in #'s. You could grade an entire set if it's that high grade...for not a ton of money.

As to the 60's stuff and 70's.......you will have to pay way more than book if it's that high grade. As to the 71 set.......if it's a solid NM-MT and some MT thrown in with the Raymond and boys it could cost 5 grand and you would make out like a bandit.

Shane,
Good luck with this. I would love this type of opportunity and feel that I would be ready if this situation ever presented itself.

Mickey71

gemint

Shane,

I've bought several raw and partially graded 1971 sets over the years. My best deal was buying a nice NM to NM-MT raw set at the Anaheim National about 10 years ago. I paid $2500 for it and most of the key cards graded PSA 8 (Clemente, Mays, Aaron, Ryan but not Munson). I only got 1 or 2 9s but quite a few of the commons graded 8. It really helped get me on the way to building a PSA 8+ set. I bought one from Mastro for $5k but it had a PSA 9 F Robby and Gibson so take that into account. It too yielded many 8s and a PSA 9 Claude Raymond which fetched me the entire purchase price in one fell swoop. I bought a 1968 set from 71toppsman on eBay. It was advertised as mostly NM-MT though in reality it was EX-Mint to NM-MT but did yield several 9s. It came with a PSA 8 Mantle, Bench and Ryan and I think I paid around $4k for it. I think I overpaid for that one but if the key cards are at least NM-MT, $3k is probably about right. $3k sounds right for the '69 set. The low pops aren't bringing what they used to. I would pay $6k to $7k for a 1961 set if it's truly NM-MT, especially if the Cerv, Gentile, World Series cards or some other low pop commons and the key star cards are NM-MT.

I think the 1971 set VCPs for about $25k in PSA 8 while the 1969 set is probably around $18k-$20k. I think the 1968 set is around $8k-$9k. 1961 is around $22k to $23k.

1954

Gemint- Wow that was exactly what I was looking for. The 1971 Topps set has many stars that would fetch an 8 but the Munson is probably going to be a 6/7 due to the centering. The 1969 Topps set looked like it was printed yesterday. 20% of the set would be 7's due to centering. I am not familiar with the 1969 set and pricing for 8/9's but this set would yield quite a few.

Thanks for the information.

Shane

DamageInc

Shane,
Sounds like a awesome find. If you get them, would you please upload some pics, would love to drool over these!!

KbKards

$9,900- 1950 Bowman
$25,300- 1951 Bowman
$19,250- 1953 Topps
$20,900- 1953 Bowman Color
$9,075- 1957 Topps
$7,700- 1958 Topps
$6,050- 1961 Topps
$3,300- 1968 Topps
$3,575- 1969 Topps
$2,750- 1970 Topps
$2,475- 1971 Topps

Above are the prices he paid in 1991, and that's before professional grading was a consideration.

A high grade raw set back from back then is very different from the culled high grade sets you see salted in auctions today.

There will be a lot of cards that won't be worth grading due to centering, but there will be a lot of 9's and even some 10's coming from such a large group of sets that have never been cherry picked for grading.

With nearly $9,000 invested into the 69-71 sets back in 1991, $10,000 seems a bit light especially with the potential they contain today. After grading what needs to be graded you'll probably get your money back in less than 10 cards.

mattinglymint23

Any views on how many raw sets at this level of quality may still be out there?
Has the well run dry?

1954

This is really great information. Thank you guys.

esquiresports

I recently paid $2600 for a 1971 set that is only 50% PSA 7 level or better, with the rest mostly EXMT (this is PSA-level grading). I would think that a true nmmt-mt set that could pull, conservatively, 50% PSA 7 and 50% PSA 8 (not even counting PSA 9/10 potential) to have a raw resale value of up to $10,000 by itself. I think you'd have no problem finding a person like me willing to pay in the $6,000-8,000 range.

1954

The 1971 Topps set is such a popular set and very condition sensitive. I have had three or four conversations with collectors who really know the set like you do. Thanks for the information.