The $5 duke creek "finest** known*** Dahlonega collection) is now for sale
joebb21
Posts: 4,774 ✭✭✭✭✭
As originally mentioned here by RYK-
Text
I Actually went to the long beach show hoping to talk to Doug Winter about this set and low and behold I see it displayed and for sale.
Price tag $1.75 mill.
It was very interesting seeing all the coins in person... It was a very good learning experience to say the least.
Edited to add: Anyone going to Long beach should take a look at this set as there is alot to learn from it...
Text
I Actually went to the long beach show hoping to talk to Doug Winter about this set and low and behold I see it displayed and for sale.
Price tag $1.75 mill.
It was very interesting seeing all the coins in person... It was a very good learning experience to say the least.
Edited to add: Anyone going to Long beach should take a look at this set as there is alot to learn from it...
may the fonz be with you...always...
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Comments
<< <i>As originally mentioned here by RYK-
Text
I Actually went to the long beach show hoping to talk to Doug Winter about this set and low and behold I see it displayed and for sale.
Price tag $1.75 mill.
It was very interesting seeing all the coins in person... It was a very good learning experience to say the least.
Edited to add: Anyone going to Long beach should take a look at this set as there is alot to learn from it... >>
From RYK's March 07, 2004 post:
<< <i>This is huge news for the southern gold collectors. The unquestionably finest existing collection of Dahlonega coins (and private mint Georgia gold) has been sold in private treaty for $3,000,000. >>
Are the contents of the set unchanged?
If so, this looks like a loss of $1.25m from 2004 to 2012, or about -6.5% per year.
<< <i>
<< <i>As originally mentioned here by RYK-
Text
I Actually went to the long beach show hoping to talk to Doug Winter about this set and low and behold I see it displayed and for sale.
Price tag $1.75 mill.
It was very interesting seeing all the coins in person... It was a very good learning experience to say the least.
Edited to add: Anyone going to Long beach should take a look at this set as there is alot to learn from it... >>
From RYK's March 07, 2004 post:
<< <i>This is huge news for the southern gold collectors. The unquestionably finest existing collection of Dahlonega coins (and private mint Georgia gold) has been sold in private treaty for $3,000,000. >>
Are the contents of the set unchanged?
If so, this looks like a loss from of $1.25m from 2004 to 2012, or about -6.5% per year. >>
The set for sale now is just a small part of what sold for $3M then
The original sale was broken out into:
(1) 3 Tempelton Reid coins and 2 Georgia Bechtler coins
(2) 63 Dahlonega Mint coins (14 x G1D, 21 x G2.5D, 1 x G3D, 27 x G5D)
The new sale consists of the 27 half eagles only.
Wow - There are some awesome coins in that set. It can be seen here.
I'm a little surprised to see the coins in those holders from ATS. Oh well, terrific coins no matter the plastic.
<< <i>Wow - There are some awesome coins in that set. It can be seen here.
I'm a little surprised to see the coins in those holders from ATS. Oh well, terrific coins no matter the plastic. >>
Not only did ATS slab the original sale in 2004 (in prong-less holders), the coins are now sporting ATS edge-view holders.
<< <i>Those images SUCK for a collection supposedly worth $1.75m. Jesus, you'd think they could spare $1,000 to have the coins professionally shot. >>
The people who might consider buying the coins do not need photos from the Internet to help them. Many serious players already know the coins. They are all among the finest known for each issue. Others will use advisors to help them decide. The quality of the images will not come into play one iota.
Over the weekend, I will do an anlalysis of the NGC grading and compare it to the prior PCGS grading for the coins in the set, like I did for the Duke's Creek $1's and QEs several years ago.
They are nice but unnecessary for the task at hand.
I'm a little surprised to see the coins in those holders from ATS. Oh well, terrific coins no matter the plastic. >>
1838-D 62/63+
1839-D 60/61
1840-D 61/62
1841-D 65/65+
1842-D LD 58/61
1842-D SD 62/63
1843-D 63/64
1844-D 63/64+
1845-D 63/64+
1846-D 61/61
1846-D/D 65/66
1847-D 62/63
1848-D 62/62
1849-D 63/65
1850-D 61/61
1851-D 63/64
1852-D 63/63+
1853-D 63/64
1854-D 65/67* (wow!)
1855-D 61/61
1856-D 64/65
1857-D 63/63
1858-D 64/65
1859-D 64/64+*
1860-D 64/64
1861-D 63/64
(not a good photo--a CoinFacts freebie)
<< <i>not a good photo--a CoinFacts freebie >>
Phil said CoinFacts freebies and TrueViews are the same aside from the background and other formatting.
<< <i>
<< <i>not a good photo--a CoinFacts freebie >>
Phil said CoinFacts freebies and TrueViews are the same aside from the background and other formatting. >>
This was an old Secure Plus low res freebie (pre-Coin Facts).
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>not a good photo--a CoinFacts freebie >>
Phil said CoinFacts freebies and TrueViews are the same aside from the background and other formatting. >>
This was an old Secure Plus low res freebie (pre-Coin Facts). >>
Ah, Phil said the Secure Plus photos don't have the shadow effect while CoinFacts photos do. Perhaps the old Secure Plus photos also have the shadow.
<< <i>The people who might consider buying the coins do not need photos from the Internet to help them. Many serious players already know the coins. They are all among the finest known for each issue. Others will use advisors to help them decide. The quality of the images will not come into play one iota. >>
So glossy auction catalogs are what, a waste of ink and paper? Even rare, high-profile coins deserve to be shown in the best light. Educational purposes aside, you gotta respect the merchandise.
Amat Colligendo Focum
Top 10 • FOR SALE
Well, just Love coins, period.
<< <i>No stickers or not necessary? >>
Unnecessary. I would even suggest that having the coins in holders (or at least with grades printed on them) is unnecessary.
<< <i>No stickers or not necessary? >>
While I have no specific information on the individual coins in this set, I do know that in general JA hates blast dipped gold
<< <i>I will list the coins with their PCGS grades and their new NGC grades (PCGS grade/NGC grade). >>
Well, at least we know NGC made money. It will be interesting to see if "the market" agrees with the new grades.
<< <i>
<< <i>I will list the coins with their PCGS grades and their new NGC grades (PCGS grade/NGC grade). >>
Well, at least we know NGC made money. It will be interesting to see if "the market" agrees with the new grades. >>
The market for the coins is, IMO, independent of grades, photos, slabs, etc. The market needs to determine what to pay for the finest ever assembled Dahlonega $5 set.
While I have no specific information on the individual coins in this set, I do know that in general JA hates blast dipped gold
I have it on very good authority that the coins have not been "blast dipped". Perhaps someone else who has seen them can confirm.
<< <i>I will list the coins with their PCGS grades and their new NGC grades (PCGS grade/NGC grade).
1838-D 62/63+
1839-D 60/61
1840-D 61/62
1841-D 65/65+
1842-D LD 58/61
1842-D SD 62/63
1843-D 63/64
1844-D 63/64+
1845-D 63/64+
1846-D 61/61
1846-D/D 65/66
1847-D 62/63
1848-D 62/62
1849-D 63/65
1850-D 61/61
1851-D 63/64
1852-D 63/63+
1853-D 63/64
1854-D 65/67* (wow!)
1855-D 61/61
1856-D 64/65
1857-D 63/63
1858-D 64/65
1859-D 64/64+*
1860-D 64/64
1861-D 63/64
One way to boost revenue, at the possible expense of your reputation, is to up the grade from
the PCGS designation. Whether it's a + upgrade only or a number upgrade it is a way to capture
business from across the street. If you believe NGC's grades are accurate then PCGS sucks at
grading D gold. However, I rather doubt that PCGS got them wrong. A + is really just eye appeal
and NGC get's it wrong most of the time on Morgans so I suspect they aren't accurate on D gold either.
bob
the PCGS designation. Whether it's a + upgrade only or a number upgrade it is a way to capture
business from across the street. If you believe NGC's grades are accurate then PCGS sucks at
grading D gold. However, I rather doubt that PCGS got them wrong. A + is really just eye appeal
and NGC get's it wrong most of the time on Morgans so I suspect they aren't accurate on D gold either.
bob
The PCGS grades were from a long time ago (in coin market terms, anyway). It is quite possible that the coins would upgrade today at PCGS if they were resubmitted. Again, it's not like the coins have come out of nowhere, and they need to be assessed and ranked. If the best was called a 64 last time and now is called a 65+, it really has not changed materially.
<< <i>Price tag $1.75 mill. >>
Can individual coins be purchased or is the collection only being sold intact?
<< <i>
<< <i>No stickers or not necessary? >>
Unnecessary. I would even suggest that having the coins in holders (or at least with grades printed on them) is unnecessary. >>
While that *might* be true, I'm surprised the owner didn't want to - and the dealer didn't advise them to - do everything they could to maximize the profit potential.
I would have kept the coins in the older holders. This would have demonstrated that the coins haven't been messed with in XX years. It would have also played on potential buyers' willingness to pay more for potential upgrades.
Or I would have sent them all to CAC...still in the older holders.
<< <i>
<< <i>I will list the coins with their PCGS grades and their new NGC grades (PCGS grade/NGC grade).
1838-D 62/63+
1839-D 60/61
1840-D 61/62
1841-D 65/65+
1842-D LD 58/61
1842-D SD 62/63
1843-D 63/64
1844-D 63/64+
1845-D 63/64+
1846-D 61/61
1846-D/D 65/66
1847-D 62/63
1848-D 62/62
1849-D 63/65
1850-D 61/61
1851-D 63/64
1852-D 63/63+
1853-D 63/64
1854-D 65/67* (wow!)
1855-D 61/61
1856-D 64/65
1857-D 63/63
1858-D 64/65
1859-D 64/64+*
1860-D 64/64
1861-D 63/64
>>
This is just shows the sad state of the grading ATS
Many members on this forum that now it cannot fit in my signature. Please ask for entire list.
<< <i>buy the coin not the holder.........owner should send it in to CAC to get another opinion. >>
I agree and the results would be interesting no matter what they came out to be
<< <i>I would have kept the coins in the older holders. This would have demonstrated that the coins haven't been messed with in XX years. It would have also played on potential buyers' willingness to pay more for potential upgrades. >>
Comparing 4 of the 2004 NGC prong-less slabs, all four have the same cert numbers as the 2012 prong holders, suggesting they were reholdered instead of cracked out and resubmitted. Of the four, 3 had the same grade and one was starred. I do wonder if a coin can keep it's cert number after making a visit to NCS.
The Jeffrey Fisher coins that were sold in the 2006 have different NGC cert numbers than in 2004.
<< <i>The amount that would sticker I would guess is very small... >>
And presumably, any that sticker now should have gotten gold stickers with the lower PCGS grades... but that doesn't seem to happen in reality. I've seen several NGC coins with green stickers, get downgraded on a cross to PCGS, only to get a green sticker again... when they should have been a lock for the gold...
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<< <i>
<< <i>The amount that would sticker I would guess is very small... >>
And presumably, any that sticker now should have gotten gold stickers with the lower PCGS grades... but that doesn't seem to happen in reality. I've seen several NGC coins with green stickers, get downgraded on a cross to PCGS, only to get a green sticker again... when they should have been a lock for the gold... >>
Of course, something can happen to the coin once it's out of the holder.
All the same, I'm curious as to what JA would say. Has this been mentioned to him?
It has a score of 308033 and leads by 188236.